JKK

It's not ancient. If you want to sell it, you should post it in the buy/sell forum.

I don't think most of them start out as trolls. I think you (plural, referring to a subset of the regulars in general) create them.
It's the same thing every time. Someone posts something that is either stupid or annoying. They get heckled; sometimes they deserve it, and sometimes people are just being Richards (they know who they are). Pretty soon it's evident to the poster:
Their name is mud here. They're burned, done, hosed, marked lousy. They will not recover. This forum is full of people who just cannot shut the f-bomb up, and who just have to respond to people who are not worth wasting time on. Due to the above two realities, the only benefit the poster can get is the childish one of taunting and trolling just to manipulate people and watch them lose their bodily wastes. Its maturity level is about first grade, but the first-grade mentality gets a huge rod on from making old men harrumph and grouse and get their BP up. They are the kids (including adult kids who never grew up) who stick a foot on the old paternally_uncertain_person's lawn because they know he will rush right out there and yell at them. That mentality will not grow up. At that point, a troll has been created, and the troll will troll until they get bored with it for a while. Sometimes they'll leave off for a while, then come back and manipulate the members some more. I'm not saying that the troll didn't necessarily deserve their initial mockery; sometimes they do. I'm not saying that the responses their trolling draws are unjustified; they nearly always are. I am saying that trolls perish when not fed, and this forum is a free feeding ground for them because people simply cannot resist dignifying the trolls' stoopidness.
All it takes to be rid of them is the ability not to bother with them. But that will never happen here. While there are people here with poor impulse control, there are only a few that are too mentally deficient to recognize trolls, and those actually work to the forum's benefit because they at least give the troll some lousy advice (we need more of that). The rest--this is generally not a hobby for mental defectives, though they do appear--are sharp enough to know it's a troll, but simply can't refuse to be baited. And they won't change. So that's that. We won't change it, but we can at least take responsibility where suitable.

Then let me help you in turn. Newbies tend to think "really shiny" = proof. That's the most common basis, and they're usually incorrect. Another way to assess the student's receptivity is to ask whether they'd like to know what's wrong with the picture, and the advantage there is that it doesn't sound like you're being sarcastic with someone who does not know the things that you know. The types of queries appropriate for an undergraduate classroom are not necessarily as functional in this venue, and good educational methods adapt to the audience and situation.

How about you actually explain these things to the OP rather than ask questions you know good and well they can't answer? This is the newbie forum. Newbies often don't understand the difference between proofs and really shiny business strikes. You could help them, and certainly have the knowledge to do so.

No, it's not a proof and would not be worth grading. You could buy a nicer version of the coin for the cost of having it slabbed.

No, it's not a proof and would not be worth grading. You could buy a nicer version of the coin for the cost of having it slabbed.

They're not. The first looks to me like a dryer coin. Second, not sure, but there is no reason to believe they left the mints that way. The good news is the Kennedy is part silver, so don't just spend it.

It didn't look that way when it left the mint. Someone did this in their shop.

Thanks, Ronnie. I do less than most around here. My outlook is that there are the helpable and those who can't or won't be helped. With them, I don't bother. With those who can be helped, I'm usually about the fifth to speak up.

One of the biggest challenges in trying to help people is to imagine ourselves not knowing all that we know. For example, the term TPG: The new numismatist (let's say NN) rarely knows that this means Third-Party Grading (service). Some of us are good at realizing that we're addressing an audience that doesn't know all that we know, and some follow the "I'm not going to spoon-feed you; you know how to Google, so keep up, homes" approach.
We can do better, and since I'm probably the only professional editor in this particular space--if not, I'm not seeing anyone else step up, so I might as well be--I can help by mentioning things like this. I'd encourage us all to remember our audience, what it doesn't know, and to take the few extra moments to dial the guidance down to their level. It might feel repetitive, such as when explaining TPGs for the twentieth time, but each new arrival lacks awareness of our fatigue. We will better serve them if we try our utmost to assume less knowledge and impart the maximum understanding.
It's always reasonable to refer NNs to explanatory articles, price guides, grading guides, and so on. We can't control their content, and it will often be worth examining. But when we're the guides, let's make sure we don't miss the basics. For example, when the NN asks what the coin is worth, that question has multiple valid answers. There's what a typical dealer might pay; there's what a private collector might pay; there's what the price guides say. Obviously dealers do not pay full retail. Most of us have seen that collectors tend to pay more than dealers. No one's going to give them full book. NNs need to understand this or they can't get a fair idea of which number applies to their circumstances.
This could help alleviate some needless confusion.

A rare find.  Send it to NGC for authentication and encapsulation.

I could do that; just give me some phosphoric acid and a couple of punches. There are no doubled dies or extra letters in it.

I call slabs like that JGS--Joe's Grading Service. I could as easily start my own, with the same initials, and be about as credible. But I feel for the new collector, because there is no way for them to know until they are told. There are three reputable grading services: ANACS, NGC, PCGS. There's no telling how many JGSes there are, but none of them matter.
The coins themselves look nice enough, but so very common that there is no demand. This is the case with most business strikes, with rare exceptions, from 1965 on. While we probably all check our change to some degree, we are also aware that finding anything big in pocket change is a lottery-level rarity. There are just too many examples of each issue.
Since you're a new collector, let's take the dime and do a dive. It's a 71-D and they say it's BU, a classification no longer the standard, but I remember when it was. All right. In my most recent Coin World--the prices in which have only a casual acquaintance with what happens on the bourse--the condition listings begin at AU-50 and that says $0.15. At MS-63 (likely the most optimistic grade), it rises to $0.60--less than you pay to get a bottle of pop from a machine. At MS-66, $8.00; at MS-67, $60.00. Even then, it's not worth slabbing from a money standpoint because its most optimistic value about equals how much slabbing would cost you. If you found an MS-68, yeah, that's about what it would take to make sense, but if those were at all common, they would certainly not show up in change because it would take less than a minute in a change purse for MS-68 to become MS-60 or AU-58. Would probably happen the instant it touched any other coin.
Not that you said anything about getting these out of change, but that's usually where people start, and this is good for new collectors to realize. So how does one collect? Simple: you decide what you like. Our club president collects elongates (smashed pennies). I don't get it, but it's what he likes. Our VP collects errors. I get it, but I don't much care about them. Our treasurer collects Oregon tokens. I sort of get that, because he's a webfooted homegrown boy from Grants Pass and Oregon State and he loves his homeland, but the only Oregon item I ever got (a Federal Reserve Note issued in OR) I turned around and sold to him. I like world coins, medieval, Byzantine, and ancient coins, so those are what I collect. I have a modest US collection, but I don't add to it these days. You are the one who decides what you like, even if it's parking tokens or poker chips or so-called dollars or proof wheat pennies.

One of the biggest challenges in trying to help people is to imagine ourselves not knowing all that we know. For example, the term TPG: The new numismatist (let's say NN) rarely knows that this means Third-Party Grading (service). Some of us are good at realizing that we're addressing an audience that doesn't know all that we know, and some follow the "I'm not going to spoon-feed you; you know how to Google, so keep up, homes" approach.
We can do better, and since I'm probably the only professional editor in this particular space--if not, I'm not seeing anyone else step up, so I might as well be--I can help by mentioning things like this. I'd encourage us all to remember our audience, what it doesn't know, and to take the few extra moments to dial the guidance down to their level. It might feel repetitive, such as when explaining TPGs for the twentieth time, but each new arrival lacks awareness of our fatigue. We will better serve them if we try our utmost to assume less knowledge and impart the maximum understanding.
It's always reasonable to refer NNs to explanatory articles, price guides, grading guides, and so on. We can't control their content, and it will often be worth examining. But when we're the guides, let's make sure we don't miss the basics. For example, when the NN asks what the coin is worth, that question has multiple valid answers. There's what a typical dealer might pay; there's what a private collector might pay; there's what the price guides say. Obviously dealers do not pay full retail. Most of us have seen that collectors tend to pay more than dealers. No one's going to give them full book. NNs need to understand this or they can't get a fair idea of which number applies to their circumstances.
This could help alleviate some needless confusion.

I see what you're referring to, but I don't see doubling. I do see disproportionate wear relative to the obverse. I doubt it's strike weakness because, while the steps did not commonly strike up fully back in the day, the strike was rarely bad enough to explain this. The most reasonable explanation is a circulation situation that caused more wear to one side.

One of the biggest challenges in trying to help people is to imagine ourselves not knowing all that we know. For example, the term TPG: The new numismatist (let's say NN) rarely knows that this means Third-Party Grading (service). Some of us are good at realizing that we're addressing an audience that doesn't know all that we know, and some follow the "I'm not going to spoon-feed you; you know how to Google, so keep up, homes" approach.
We can do better, and since I'm probably the only professional editor in this particular space--if not, I'm not seeing anyone else step up, so I might as well be--I can help by mentioning things like this. I'd encourage us all to remember our audience, what it doesn't know, and to take the few extra moments to dial the guidance down to their level. It might feel repetitive, such as when explaining TPGs for the twentieth time, but each new arrival lacks awareness of our fatigue. We will better serve them if we try our utmost to assume less knowledge and impart the maximum understanding.
It's always reasonable to refer NNs to explanatory articles, price guides, grading guides, and so on. We can't control their content, and it will often be worth examining. But when we're the guides, let's make sure we don't miss the basics. For example, when the NN asks what the coin is worth, that question has multiple valid answers. There's what a typical dealer might pay; there's what a private collector might pay; there's what the price guides say. Obviously dealers do not pay full retail. Most of us have seen that collectors tend to pay more than dealers. No one's going to give them full book. NNs need to understand this or they can't get a fair idea of which number applies to their circumstances.
This could help alleviate some needless confusion.

Thanks, Ronnie. I do less than most around here. My outlook is that there are the helpable and those who can't or won't be helped. With them, I don't bother. With those who can be helped, I'm usually about the fifth to speak up.

One of the biggest challenges in trying to help people is to imagine ourselves not knowing all that we know. For example, the term TPG: The new numismatist (let's say NN) rarely knows that this means Third-Party Grading (service). Some of us are good at realizing that we're addressing an audience that doesn't know all that we know, and some follow the "I'm not going to spoon-feed you; you know how to Google, so keep up, homes" approach.
We can do better, and since I'm probably the only professional editor in this particular space--if not, I'm not seeing anyone else step up, so I might as well be--I can help by mentioning things like this. I'd encourage us all to remember our audience, what it doesn't know, and to take the few extra moments to dial the guidance down to their level. It might feel repetitive, such as when explaining TPGs for the twentieth time, but each new arrival lacks awareness of our fatigue. We will better serve them if we try our utmost to assume less knowledge and impart the maximum understanding.
It's always reasonable to refer NNs to explanatory articles, price guides, grading guides, and so on. We can't control their content, and it will often be worth examining. But when we're the guides, let's make sure we don't miss the basics. For example, when the NN asks what the coin is worth, that question has multiple valid answers. There's what a typical dealer might pay; there's what a private collector might pay; there's what the price guides say. Obviously dealers do not pay full retail. Most of us have seen that collectors tend to pay more than dealers. No one's going to give them full book. NNs need to understand this or they can't get a fair idea of which number applies to their circumstances.
This could help alleviate some needless confusion.

Thanks, Ronnie. I do less than most around here. My outlook is that there are the helpable and those who can't or won't be helped. With them, I don't bother. With those who can be helped, I'm usually about the fifth to speak up.

I call slabs like that JGS--Joe's Grading Service. I could as easily start my own, with the same initials, and be about as credible. But I feel for the new collector, because there is no way for them to know until they are told. There are three reputable grading services: ANACS, NGC, PCGS. There's no telling how many JGSes there are, but none of them matter.
The coins themselves look nice enough, but so very common that there is no demand. This is the case with most business strikes, with rare exceptions, from 1965 on. While we probably all check our change to some degree, we are also aware that finding anything big in pocket change is a lottery-level rarity. There are just too many examples of each issue.
Since you're a new collector, let's take the dime and do a dive. It's a 71-D and they say it's BU, a classification no longer the standard, but I remember when it was. All right. In my most recent Coin World--the prices in which have only a casual acquaintance with what happens on the bourse--the condition listings begin at AU-50 and that says $0.15. At MS-63 (likely the most optimistic grade), it rises to $0.60--less than you pay to get a bottle of pop from a machine. At MS-66, $8.00; at MS-67, $60.00. Even then, it's not worth slabbing from a money standpoint because its most optimistic value about equals how much slabbing would cost you. If you found an MS-68, yeah, that's about what it would take to make sense, but if those were at all common, they would certainly not show up in change because it would take less than a minute in a change purse for MS-68 to become MS-60 or AU-58. Would probably happen the instant it touched any other coin.
Not that you said anything about getting these out of change, but that's usually where people start, and this is good for new collectors to realize. So how does one collect? Simple: you decide what you like. Our club president collects elongates (smashed pennies). I don't get it, but it's what he likes. Our VP collects errors. I get it, but I don't much care about them. Our treasurer collects Oregon tokens. I sort of get that, because he's a webfooted homegrown boy from Grants Pass and Oregon State and he loves his homeland, but the only Oregon item I ever got (a Federal Reserve Note issued in OR) I turned around and sold to him. I like world coins, medieval, Byzantine, and ancient coins, so those are what I collect. I have a modest US collection, but I don't add to it these days. You are the one who decides what you like, even if it's parking tokens or poker chips or so-called dollars or proof wheat pennies.

Thanks, Ronnie. I do less than most around here. My outlook is that there are the helpable and those who can't or won't be helped. With them, I don't bother. With those who can be helped, I'm usually about the fifth to speak up.

One of the biggest challenges in trying to help people is to imagine ourselves not knowing all that we know. For example, the term TPG: The new numismatist (let's say NN) rarely knows that this means Third-Party Grading (service). Some of us are good at realizing that we're addressing an audience that doesn't know all that we know, and some follow the "I'm not going to spoon-feed you; you know how to Google, so keep up, homes" approach.
We can do better, and since I'm probably the only professional editor in this particular space--if not, I'm not seeing anyone else step up, so I might as well be--I can help by mentioning things like this. I'd encourage us all to remember our audience, what it doesn't know, and to take the few extra moments to dial the guidance down to their level. It might feel repetitive, such as when explaining TPGs for the twentieth time, but each new arrival lacks awareness of our fatigue. We will better serve them if we try our utmost to assume less knowledge and impart the maximum understanding.
It's always reasonable to refer NNs to explanatory articles, price guides, grading guides, and so on. We can't control their content, and it will often be worth examining. But when we're the guides, let's make sure we don't miss the basics. For example, when the NN asks what the coin is worth, that question has multiple valid answers. There's what a typical dealer might pay; there's what a private collector might pay; there's what the price guides say. Obviously dealers do not pay full retail. Most of us have seen that collectors tend to pay more than dealers. No one's going to give them full book. NNs need to understand this or they can't get a fair idea of which number applies to their circumstances.
This could help alleviate some needless confusion.

One of the biggest challenges in trying to help people is to imagine ourselves not knowing all that we know. For example, the term TPG: The new numismatist (let's say NN) rarely knows that this means Third-Party Grading (service). Some of us are good at realizing that we're addressing an audience that doesn't know all that we know, and some follow the "I'm not going to spoon-feed you; you know how to Google, so keep up, homes" approach.
We can do better, and since I'm probably the only professional editor in this particular space--if not, I'm not seeing anyone else step up, so I might as well be--I can help by mentioning things like this. I'd encourage us all to remember our audience, what it doesn't know, and to take the few extra moments to dial the guidance down to their level. It might feel repetitive, such as when explaining TPGs for the twentieth time, but each new arrival lacks awareness of our fatigue. We will better serve them if we try our utmost to assume less knowledge and impart the maximum understanding.
It's always reasonable to refer NNs to explanatory articles, price guides, grading guides, and so on. We can't control their content, and it will often be worth examining. But when we're the guides, let's make sure we don't miss the basics. For example, when the NN asks what the coin is worth, that question has multiple valid answers. There's what a typical dealer might pay; there's what a private collector might pay; there's what the price guides say. Obviously dealers do not pay full retail. Most of us have seen that collectors tend to pay more than dealers. No one's going to give them full book. NNs need to understand this or they can't get a fair idea of which number applies to their circumstances.
This could help alleviate some needless confusion.

One of the biggest challenges in trying to help people is to imagine ourselves not knowing all that we know. For example, the term TPG: The new numismatist (let's say NN) rarely knows that this means Third-Party Grading (service). Some of us are good at realizing that we're addressing an audience that doesn't know all that we know, and some follow the "I'm not going to spoon-feed you; you know how to Google, so keep up, homes" approach.
We can do better, and since I'm probably the only professional editor in this particular space--if not, I'm not seeing anyone else step up, so I might as well be--I can help by mentioning things like this. I'd encourage us all to remember our audience, what it doesn't know, and to take the few extra moments to dial the guidance down to their level. It might feel repetitive, such as when explaining TPGs for the twentieth time, but each new arrival lacks awareness of our fatigue. We will better serve them if we try our utmost to assume less knowledge and impart the maximum understanding.
It's always reasonable to refer NNs to explanatory articles, price guides, grading guides, and so on. We can't control their content, and it will often be worth examining. But when we're the guides, let's make sure we don't miss the basics. For example, when the NN asks what the coin is worth, that question has multiple valid answers. There's what a typical dealer might pay; there's what a private collector might pay; there's what the price guides say. Obviously dealers do not pay full retail. Most of us have seen that collectors tend to pay more than dealers. No one's going to give them full book. NNs need to understand this or they can't get a fair idea of which number applies to their circumstances.
This could help alleviate some needless confusion.

One of the biggest challenges in trying to help people is to imagine ourselves not knowing all that we know. For example, the term TPG: The new numismatist (let's say NN) rarely knows that this means Third-Party Grading (service). Some of us are good at realizing that we're addressing an audience that doesn't know all that we know, and some follow the "I'm not going to spoon-feed you; you know how to Google, so keep up, homes" approach.
We can do better, and since I'm probably the only professional editor in this particular space--if not, I'm not seeing anyone else step up, so I might as well be--I can help by mentioning things like this. I'd encourage us all to remember our audience, what it doesn't know, and to take the few extra moments to dial the guidance down to their level. It might feel repetitive, such as when explaining TPGs for the twentieth time, but each new arrival lacks awareness of our fatigue. We will better serve them if we try our utmost to assume less knowledge and impart the maximum understanding.
It's always reasonable to refer NNs to explanatory articles, price guides, grading guides, and so on. We can't control their content, and it will often be worth examining. But when we're the guides, let's make sure we don't miss the basics. For example, when the NN asks what the coin is worth, that question has multiple valid answers. There's what a typical dealer might pay; there's what a private collector might pay; there's what the price guides say. Obviously dealers do not pay full retail. Most of us have seen that collectors tend to pay more than dealers. No one's going to give them full book. NNs need to understand this or they can't get a fair idea of which number applies to their circumstances.
This could help alleviate some needless confusion.