Jason Abshier

Most of my German coins I have to really study the auction prices. Most of NGC and Krause price guide is just for reference to me not really a price point NGC basically only goes up to MS63 a lot time they don’t have listed prices for German proof coins… I always make offers if I’m buying if I’m buying directly I try stay on lean 10%-20% below what that last price was going for sometimes I get it sometimes I don’t … it’s how it goes other time I’m stuck paying that price or little over … however the Bidding on certain higher up coins …. The price is not really available it’s more based on how much someone willing to really pay for it that’s what I like about world coins sometimes it’s can really surprising to see what something will really go for unlike US coins it’s pretty much solid price is price point within a ball park everyone has easy access to price guides , auction reports , Grey sheet and so on narrows down what one should really pay out for a certain coin 

On 8/18/2023 at 1:27 PM, zadok said:

...been there done that...the real question u have to ask urself..."Which bothers u the most, the missed opportunity of losing the coin or buyers remorse if u overpaid??"...answer that n u know what u should have done....

I’d be telling a big lie if I said I didn’t over pay for certain coins in my collection . Then again I have no intentions of selling them anyways they sit in my collection never see market again …. Other coins I have flipped in on trades for upgrades , but most of the stuff I’ve got winning through bids are my keepers … to answer your question last night’s bidding wars on heritage hit me with “missed opportunities” then again I got the chance to watch a sorry high winning bidder have to pay out the high BP ! Ouchie …. That may or may not have affects on current coins I collect if another one happens to pop up for sale or Bid in the same grade it’s going to drive the prices upward based on last current bid price…  how much more ? Who knows but it usually goes up after that rarely will it fall downward not much tho depend on coin or grade … but I get what what you’re saying I’ve had my fair share of it as well 

On 8/18/2023 at 9:57 AM, Redline68 said:

Always loved the bear designs on Switzerland Bern and Canton coinage ! It never gets old with me if you like this design I’d suggest you look at some of the medals they made back then with the Bern bear on them really cool !  …Anhalt Germany also adopted the bear design walking on brick wall On the earlier year German thalers 

however I’m not to familiar with this reverse design on back of this particular Thaler it almost looks like old Frankfurt German Thaler (taler) design (I believe Frankfurt only used 1 headed eagle not to sure I’ve seen double headed split eagle made by Frankfurt maybe a shooting medal)  …I guess it was a pretty coming design back then in some parts of Europe with the Eagle crest , Russians adopted the same almost looking eagle crest design as well years and years later I never found much information as to why they adopted that type of eagle crest design your’s far by the oldest dated Thaler I’ve seen it used on so far 

@J P M I’d say the Top pop “US coins” hold more merits (harder to get) compared to a World coin that much easier to get the Top pop …. That wasn’t the case for me last night on heritage auctions … I was bidding on 4 different lots Top pop German coins (1 or 2 of them were 2nd best not really top pops) …. It was Signatures series night I was bidding like a heavy hitter over a couple grand on each coin I really wanted for my “life long collection” (coins I put away in my collection that will never ever be for sale again nor will ever see market again until the day I pass on) ….

Man ! I got my butt beat bad in Live bidding I had to pull out it just got way way to extreme for what I wanted to pay for each coin … they drove the prices through the roof it was probably most intense bidding wars I’ve been in for long while on German coinage , new prices levels I haven’t seen increase for long while once sleeper coins were awakened again last night through heritage auctions …. Just hope I get a 2nd chance at them coins again someday in future they are on my hit list just need pack a some more firepower next time they show up for sale 

If it were me I was in bind or limited on money or if that’s all I could afford … I’d go with Mercury dime as well so count my vote in with @ldhair and @Coinbuf… old school PCGS holder with a bean on it ? Take it ! Over the rest …. If you do decide buy the green bean Mercury , contact me through private message I have another old school Walking Liberty with a CAC Green bean in my collection that was left back when I sold off 95% of my US coin collection and switched over to German coin collecting ….  I’ll happily let you make an offer on it to go along with the Mercury CAC if you’re interested anything to help a new collector out get on right track with some decent coins but not overly priced ,  it’s within your budget of the coins you showed in your post if it makes your day … It not like I’m really trying to get rid of it or anything like that , I may have an old school Mercury dime or two in old soap bar ANACS holders ANA holders I might let go too 

Pretty much how us hardcore world coin guys feel when we need buy a coin for our collection it’s “Top pop” no price value is listed for it … only worth as much someone willing to pay for it … I own several and several Top pop , “rare” (or I’ll shall say seldom seen) proof German coins and high end Mint state coins and medals the “finest known”  they are only worth what auction prices are listed for them because I won them auctions …. Now if I put them back up for auction will they hit same amount ? Higher ? Lower ? Who knows “Top pop” stuff is little hard to determine a real ball park or solid price for it … what’s it’s like owning Top pop coins ? Eh ? It wears off after a while treat them just like any other coin I have in my collection, what’s it’s like when you got a Top coin it holds for awhile , then some lucky person gets a higher grade than your top pop ? It’s Heart breaking sometimes 😢 HA!😂 

On 8/16/2023 at 6:34 PM, Shygirl2020! said:

I posted here because they were similar to the other person's coins. I am new to this and I guess I am not sure about how you are or aren't suppose to respond. I guess now I know. 

thank you!

Perfectly normal , we all started once in these forums as well …. As for your coin and OP’s coin both are PMD … 99% of time you find an odd awkward looking modern coin chances are it’s P.M.D …. Most of the “error” coinage or “variety” type of coinage is more in classic coinage era’ (the stuff us hardcore collectors know about and talk about ) books and articles as well as old talks on here been discussed  numerous of times over the years among some long time members on here been beat like a dead horse ! 
 

now a days we pretty much tell all newbs they got PMD which it is pretty much 99% of time …. You’re far better off getting yourself an coin album and do some roll hunting save all nice coins you find and fill up the album believe me you’ll waste your time chasing a ghost looking for so called modern day Error coins which rarely and say again rarely even exist anymore with modern technology mint uses today … even Double die stuff is not a “true” double die more like die wear most of us collector would happily throw it in the soda machine and buy a cold soda because it ain’t worth a hoot !  

On 8/13/2023 at 4:49 PM, World Colonial said:

In the past at YE, Heritage used to issue a press release where they broke out their auction volume measured by value for each major category they offer.  This included US and non-US coinage.  I didn't look for 2022 but you can find prior years (2019 or so at minimum) with an internet search.

This will confirm what I told you.

In checking their archives for my last post, I did notice that the count for the UK has gone up noticeably since my last search.  It was just under 40K the last time and now its 52K, about one in every eight "world" coins sold.   I also noticed the gap is closing in the overall ratio (with the US) but it's still lopsided, both by volume and value.  

A low number of countries account for a disproportionate pct. of "world" volume: UK, Germany, Canada, Mexico, China, and France in that order with the UK in the lead by a "country mile", almost twice Germany (including German states) which is marginally ahead of all other except for France. 40% to 45% of the total.

The archives don't provide an option to filter by sale date, and I didn't perform a manual count to try to quantify any change in distribution.  I know the ratio of US vs. "world" in aggregate has decreased somewhat over time, but that's all.

Heritage has Hong Kong based sales occasionally, so I assume much or maybe most of the more expensive Chinese and Hong Kong (colonial) coinage is consigned by locals since these sales commenced.  I also infer that Heritage receives major European collections in the Netherlands, any other offices they have there, or any agents if they have any.  Mostly though, that this coinage is consigned by and bought by US based collectors.

Note, the last paragraph is an inference, not "fact".

I agree with this statement over last few years I’ve been getting my nose beat bloody raw ! Bidding on German coinage on heritage where this great “boom” of bidders came from? I don’t know 🤷‍♂️! But several years ago I was able to bid on world coins on heritage flexible and easy the bidding pressure wasn’t there back then ….
 

fast forward Today ? It really blew up on heritage auction I rarely “try not to use” them anymore but some times I’m forced to they have some of nicest and Seldom seen coins I need for my collection I can’t find them anywhere else I have no choice but to fight in trenches (bidding wars) hope I come out as a winner … but I mostly do win 75% of my bidding wars come out licking my wounds earn my battle stripes …. Are these US bidders or European bidders I’m up against ? I have no clue 🤷‍♂️…  

That looks like they put Sloth from Goonies on the bust ! 

On 8/11/2023 at 9:55 AM, NeverEnoughCoins09 said:

That was some other things bouncing around in my head. I guess I would just have to take a chance. With the added on cost of grading for what I paid I'm pretty sure I'm just at a loss

Me personally I wouldn’t send this coin for grading but that’s just me …

@Sandon I definitely agree I’ve seen my fair share of over dipped coins you’re correct they will detail grade for improperly cleaned I believe … I wasn’t aware that’s what you meant in your post when you stated dipped coins will detail grade as “cleaned” …. My apologies if I misread what you meant when wrote that in your post . 

On 8/10/2023 at 4:44 PM, Sandon said:

It also appears to have been "dipped" in a tarnish removing solution, which might result in it receiving a "details" grade as "cleaned"

I believe PCGS and NGC both widely accepts dipped coins they straight grade them do not consider them “cleaned” maybe at one time that was a big NO-NO in coin collecting but not anymore more and more people are becoming aware that Dipping is not cleaning…. Although I agree with you on grade tho. I myself don’t consider dipped coins “cleaned” if it’s done right this coin in picture looks like whoever dipped it did it right it would straight grade by PCGS or NGC …. however I do draw the line when it comes to dipping certain coins some should not be dipped … I have both rainbow toned and bright white coins in my collection … but to each their own on the subject about dipping as cleaning or not 

Yeppers ! Harshly cleaned !!! Looking at letterings and around bust you’ll see dirt or contaminants pushed into the crevices is usually a dead give away it been cleaned not once but attempted few times awkward looking (doesn’t look like toning to me) looks like dirt and contaminates … probably “rubbed”cleaned improperly with a soft rag then someone tried dipping several times left it in solution to long acid etched the surface of the coin  … sadly worth nothing but melt value now 

Typical average Morgan dollar nothing to write back home about … definitely NOT DMPL , and definitely NOT MS70 ! 
 

more like MS63ish ? A lot of bag mark rubs all over the cheek and some nicks in field (from being in mint bags for long time) I’d grade it at 62/63 at the most…. Whoever sold you that coin saying it’s DMPL then write MS70 in lower corner didn’t know hoot what they were selling or writing on that 2x2 flip although nice coin and no I wouldn’t send this in for grading I’d keep raw I highly doubt that came from an original “ROLL”

On 8/6/2023 at 2:05 PM, RWB said:

Also, is there any reason to remove a modern coin from its capsule? Leave it as it came from the Mint.

I often asked myself the same thing … why remove it from airtight capsule  … why can’t the grader , grade the coin through a capsule and put the whole thing in slab after grading is done ?? I see no harm in adding the capsule inside a slab ….  when I buy a coin I have to examine it through a scratched up holder to determine if it really worth grade it was given 

Keep in mind AI robotics is programmed by Man (human) it can still make errors, although accuracy would probably be better …. However they would need to program this AI robot to grades coins in parameter that’s acceptable for the grade what happens if the robot come across a coin that not quiet in the grade it was programmed to be ? A human would have to look at coin to determine the grade … bag marks , rim nicks , wear and so on will have to be programmed within parameters for AI robot to read it correctly…. therefore !  Grading would still and always be “subjective opinions” with or without AI robotics 

On 8/5/2023 at 9:42 PM, Fenntucky Mike said:

I don't know how the slabs are produced.

I’m willing to bet the bank they are mold injected as well every slab made is probably Acrylic injected into a mold with high pressure and the results hold a tight tolerance like you said … 

Yep ! We see it and hear it all time on here newbies sending or wanting to send in pocket change for grading … some listen to our advice on here and a lot of them don’t …

On 8/3/2023 at 6:17 PM, bobbyboshay said:

Thanks for you all for taking your time to give your opinion now since everyone doesn’t have the same opinion I will send in to get graded the last opinion was probably more spot on so I appreciate your assessment 

Why? I mean it’s basically pocket change what’s whole point of paying high grading fees for pocket change ? 
 

if you really wanna 1965 Lincoln cent that been already graded buy and you’ll save yourself hell of a lot more money (to spend on other coins) than to send send this single coin in for grading which merits NO value what so ever to any hardcore collector tiny die chip is nothing… work smarter at collecting  not harder don’t be wasteful with your money either throwing it away on grading fees for a bunch of coins that nobody will even glance at them a second time….
 

Very rarely do any of us long time collectors send in coins for grading only if it merits the higher price tag say $300+ or more on the market or we plan to sell a high end classic coin we want a new decent grade opinion and encapsulated so we can sell then in that case it’s worth the expenses sending a coin in for grading 

On 8/4/2023 at 12:27 PM, VKurtB said:

This is an outright lie. Not true.

American Gold Eagle coins are considered collectibles by the IRS. If you own your Eagles for less than a year and sell them, they are taxed at your personal marginal tax rate. If you hold them more than a year before selling, they are taxed at 28 percent, which is the IRS tax rate for collectibles.

https://www.providentmetals.com › ...

Commonly Questions About American Gold Eagle Coins - Provident Metals

Ive heard the same there taxes on bullion I believe it’s called capital gain taxes after you own/hold/sell IRS considers you reporting if I high doubt most private owning individual report this…. Beauty of PA state is collectible coins and bullion are tax exempt! But I believe medals and Exonumia and tokens are not covered under the Tax exemption law ? 

As a machinist for 27 years myself did you really measure that coin with a micrometer ? 😂 people often get Dial or Digital calipers mixed up with Micrometer both are two different measuring tools it the metalworking machining world … 99% of the folks wouldn’t know how to read a true micrometer anyways … but it’s not really needed to determine 1982 small date 👍

@Sandon is right you gotta be careful buying that ancient coin stuff … lately Chinese notice there’s a market for for it in our coin collecting hobby face it the ancient stuff was pretty horribly made makes a counterfeiters’ job easy … 

On 8/1/2023 at 4:48 PM, VKurtB said:

No road rash common cents, huh?

With my luck in life some times Kurt you might as well say I’ve gotten worse of the worse GRAVEL RASH ! Road rash I can probably live with but Gravel rash is a B**ch … I should of said it more like this if I win lottery

1) invest into properties and stocks (seek/Hire a reputable financial advisor what heck would I know about owning that much money anyways I’m just an average Joe 🤷‍♂️)

2) then keep building my collection as it is and sit back make money on my investments

3) then lastly buy high roller coins 👍