GoldFinger1969

Really ? I wasn't aware anything CC had declined of late. What price range Morgans are we talking about that you saw the declines ?

Online, LCS, or coin show ?

We'll see if Powell is Volcker or Arthuer Burns tomorrow about 2:30 PM.

The spikes then were bubbles where the prices went up 500-1,000% as I recall. Prices than dropped 75-85% for the coins hawked by the telemarketers and gold/silver dealers.

Shouldn't the all-in costs for a seller on Ebay be somewhere between GC and HA ? I see more ridiculous ask prices on Ebay that are anywhere from 20% high for very liquid, frequently-sold items (i.e., popular Saints) to 50-200% over FMV or recent sales prices for less-actively seen coins/items (i.e., modern commemoratives or 5 ounce silvers).

FTW, did you end up sending in the coin for a grade ? Any more MSDs added to your collection ?

This is a really good thread with great posts, information, and back-and-forth. Even though I didn't contribute, I didn't want it to fall by the wayside so quickly. Maybe other Morgan fans here want to comment.

Check out the pair of MS-66 1908 WF NM Saints I posted in another thread, PCGS and NGC. If the weak feathers on the PCGS and the band towards 8 PM from the belly are NOT rub/wear, then it's very strange that the NGC would sell for 20% more than the PCGS coin. I can't tell if the feathers/band are rub/wear.

Nice coin....did you have to pay up for it if you were looking for this type for a while ? Carson City stuff is hot and has been for a few years now.

I see lots of gold coins on GC going without bids; buyers aren't just paying up. They will let the coins come in to them.

BTW, they are now up to the 7th Edition for the Bower's MORGAN SILVER DOLLAR book. Wish someone would do a 2nd one for DOUBLE EAGLES.

That is something that is Securities Law 101. Accounts must be segregated. Forget about "regulation of crypto" -- this is about basic custodial accounts. ANY business which takes monies has to adhere to this principel -- you can't take my downpayment for something and put it to another make-good. Instead of worrying about crypto itself, they should have been worried about the actual accounts. They weren't. It's aking to worrying about if my tech stocks are too risky for my age instead of....is my account being raided by the firm ? Yes, but even without the right structure there had to have been (or should have been) basic custodial recordkeeping audits. What about back-ups in case of a power failure ? In case of a cyber attack ? EMP attack ? Basic stuff. Yup....would have helped. You would think that the regulators -- who can regulate FIRMS if not CRYPTO -- should have been on this. Ditto the private investors. Fundamental principle of investing: custodial oversight is NOT with the firm making the investments (unless you trust a Big Bulge Bracket Firm like JP Morgan Chase, Goldman Sachs, Fidelity, etc.). Even those firms may use others to clear and verify trades, I'm not sure. But I know that most RIAs and small asset managers use firms like JPM Chase, Goldman, etc. to verify their trades. This way.....THEY are on the hook. If I open up "GoldFinger Asset Management" and I steal the money and am producing MY OWN statements, I can get away with anything for a long time. But if I clear through JPM Chase or Fidelity or Schwab.....THEY are on the hook and will insist the $$$ be held by them because the statements have their names on it and they're liable. That is how Madoff got away with his fraud. In fact, I am unaware of any material fraud or Ponzi Scheme where a big Wall Street firm was involved in clearing. There, the problem is excessive trading, risky trading, high commissions, etc. But no outright fraud. Self-clearing or clearing with a firm nobody ever heard of is 10 red flags.

From the Church Hoard above, it appears SOME years there are tons of survivors, no ? They may be circulated and even worn, but lots survived.

Sorry, they are one of the best news sources out there and I am no fan of NBC or MSNBC. Their markets coverage is excellent. When they have some news people squat over, yeah, you can detect the agenda bias. You can also watch Fox Business Channel and/or Bloomberg TV if you don't like CNBC. I'm watching all of them this morning. Business/financial channels are the least-biased and most-objective news channels around. They have to be -- their viewers keep score on them EVERY day with their accounts and P/L statements.

It's tough to judge before the fact. I do wonder though why a Primary Directive like no touching of customer assets is allowed to be possible at ANY firm. Again....if JP Morgan Chase loses $40 billion with their capital account on bad bond trades....Jamie Dimon cannot BORROW money from millions of Chase customer checking accounts like mine and my parents for a few days at quarter-end to fool the regulators and Fed oversight people. He can't just push a button and do that. It appears that was the case at FTX. Does anybody know who their custodian was ? Custodians need to be separate from the trading firm or asset manager.

Stop parsing words. You know what I meant. "All other things equal" -- ceteris paribas -- is tough to replicate but we know what things are good for a rising gold price and what things are bad. And at times -- like the 1970's -- what is considered "bad" (rising interest rates) can be DWARFED by what causes those rising rates and it's direct impact on gold (namely, galloping inflation).

Compared to other financial scams, gold retailing is small potatos. The "traditional" relationship is usually predicated on the 1970's, when Bretton Woods and currencies were in flux and inflation peaked after a 35-year bull market. If you had PERSISTENT inflation today that would probably be a plus for gold. Gold, like other financial assets, reacts to certain variables DIFFERNTLY depending on the level of OTHER variables.

Up $40 today on the lower-inflation news. We'll see how long it lasts. Fed talks tomorrow @ 2:30 PM.

The House hearing with the FTX bankruptcy trustee/CEO is on CNBC and other cable TV channels right now........

Great coin, this is the one holder that I personally do not like. Maybe I'm just used to prongs giving a more open-look but I find a coin totally encased in the plastic to be a turn-off. Can't see the edges, either.

The Feds did nothing for weeks, and the day before he is scheduled to testify before Congress under oath....THAT'S when they notify the Bahamian authorities.

Initially they engaged in strict technical grading. Later on, especially in the early-2000's, market grading took over.

I wonder about that....check out my comparision in another thread about the 2 coins graded MS-66....1908 WF NM Saints. It's in the Official Saints Gold Price Thread. The NGC sold for 20% more than the PCGS coin, although I've been told that the wear/rub I saw might be imaginary. If so, that just adds to the mystery.

Reports are his GF is going to flip on him.

I think the savvy, 1st-mover types probably said that years ago -- and you probably know that kind of collector. The more casual, less-dedicated collector who doesn't live and breathe coins 24/7.....I think for them it's a new thing.