EagleRJO

This "smutch" and not the other "schmutz".

I have purchased the Presidential and Innovation Proof and Rev Proof sets, in addition to the regular yearly proof sets, and haven't really had any significant quality issues when they are direct from the mint, although I do see that sometimes when purchased on the secondary market. ASE's are a completely different story in terms of quality direct from the mint, and even though I have them starting in the early 1990s (plus I added the first year) I will likely stop getting them after this year due to the poor strikes, milk spots (fingers crossed, haven't gotten any yet), garbage capsules and dollar store like OGP they started coming in. [Talking about "milk spots" and discoloration of ASEs, I saw the attached coin slab protectors and box intended to prevent these things from happening. But apparently even ridiculous belt and suspenders like that will not prevent the milk spots which appear to be a result of changes in the blanks and minting process.]

Yea, they do seem like a looser and more of a novelty type purchase, at least for me, and I only started added ones I am missing starting with the 1960s when I see them in the thrift stores for under $10. I don't think I would switch to or add the silver proof sets at this point as they do seem overpriced, and was more just curious about who else collects the regular proof sets, and if there was any value to getting the proof silver sets I may have been missing.

I usually get a regular proof set of coins from the US Mint for a year just because I like the way proofs for coins that I handle regularly look and they are not that much. I don't think they hold value well as I see older ones for next to nothing in thrift shops, but I was curious if anyone collects or regularly orders the proof silver sets which seems a bit overly expensive.

Well said!

I think "smutch" refers more to dark stains and "schmutz" refers more to dirt and grime. It doesn't look like "schmutz" on the coin, so I think at least in terms of my question it was asking more about "smutch".

It is amazing what you can see with a microscope, and why I stopped using one to check out coins unless I need to look for something very specific or take pics of coins.

@J P Mits starting to look like that was good info even if these coins are not on the NGC or PCGS top counterfeit lists. I am reading up on these coins, including the book by Gurney and he states ... It looks like many of these were produced and circulated in Asia, and just may not have reached the US yet or are raw in collections which haven't been submitted to the TPGs so it doesn't make their top lists.

Yea, only "probably" a fake, and then list a coin out of the date range? I didn't even get past the coin turn because if something simple like that is wrong the rest is pointless to read. But THAT is even worse to get wrong.

I have not seen very many of these so I'm curious what the key indicators of a cast counterfeit are. The lack of detail and the "mushy" appearance, without apparent significant genuine wear, that appears to be the case for both of these?

In addition to the other things the dates just look all wrong right off the bat, especially the 6 on the 1856 one. It's almost cartoon like in size compared to the others.

I have been shying away from eBay lately as there is a lot of impaired or counterfeit garbage where I have to spend countless hours weeding through the trash and making offers for the raw coins I'm interested in, just to find 3 decent ones I ended up buying since earlier this year. Have purchased a few slabbed ones there too with a little teeth-pulling. But lately it seems like ppl on eBay are stuck with buying high earlier this year and are not bidding the coins, or it appears they have multiple accounts to bid up coins being auctioned. So, for slabbed auctions I have been sticking with Great Collections and getting some really good deals lately.

I did with wads of rolls from the bank, and they were horrible. Almost impossible to read the date/mark on the edge for most even with a mag glass due to dings commonly on the flat edges.

Are the darker appearing areas in the fields toning or smutch?

Funny you mention Northeast, I just bought a Morgan Dollar from them I was having trouble finding for a reasonable price. I think you recommended them earlier this year. I was actually going to buy 2 recently listed and while putting them in my cart the other was scooped up. Rats. I pretty much would stick with them, Apmex or Littleton for online dealers, and Great Collections for auctions, but I find Littleton is a little pricy with the Morgan Dollars. Also USSQ.com (US State Quarters) has some pretty good prices on raw/slabbed/ogp contemporary coins like the ASEs as well as Presidental and Innovation dollars.

Finally hit the wall with the mid 1890's? Good thing you're doing a one-a-year set so you can skip 1893-S and 1895 (P). 1893-S in particular is a problem for me with the full set.

Wait, would that be an actual error and not PMD or shell die deterioration. @Hoghead51512 gauge for squirrels, really.

Prices are still coming down, so buckle up.

I really like the Littleton albums, and I use them for all of the quarter series. They are similar, but I like the 3-ring binder style of the albums, and the labels on the spine which look nice and are easy to find with the albums side-by-side in a bookcase. But I don't think I would switch to another style that looked differently for a given type of coin. Like all my dollar and half dollar sets are in Lighthouse Encap slab/capsule albums. [Also, I do not believe that the 2026 quarters will be for U.S. Women as originally proposed and as indicated in the Dansco store, as there is now supposed to be a special issue of coins marking the 250th anniversary of our independence that year. The Littleton album also is for 2022 to 2025. I am sure all the female coin collectors are upset. ] Proposal for 2026 commemoratives calls for unusual coins (coinworld.com)

@Nomad_Romad Not much of the damage on your Mankillers appears to be from coin rollers/wrappers which typically shows up as circular marks or gouges near the rim of the coin, with a few examples attached. This happens when the metal tang closes on the wrapper up against the coin on the end of the roll and then the machine spins the roll to crimp the wrapper causing the damage. It is supposed to be light contact pressure with a rounded tang, but it gets worn down to an edge over time. Most of the damage on the Mankillers appears to be contact marks at high points that are more exposed, which I assume you verified cut into the coin leaving protruding adjacent original surfaces. Also note that the semi-circle on the obverse at the bottom of the Mankillers is part of the coin design. How Coins are Damaged by Rolling, Wrapping, and Crimping Machines (coincommunity.com) I am still trying to get more comfortable with coin errors vs damage, and at least I find it helpful to envision exactly how the marks on a coin may have occurred and do some digging related to the type so that the next time I see it the light bulb goes on right away or I can eliminate it as a possibility. Your milage may vary.

Rarieties can change based on events that occur (releases, melting, found hoards) with mintage numbers only being an indicator of rarity, but seems like that dealer just lost a potential customer trying to defend a sales pitch when he got called out on it. The prices for coins I have been watching including Morgans, Trade Dollars, early date half dollars, and common date Saints have been coming down also. Prolly a combo of the price spike earlier this year correcting, lower disposable income (pandemic slush funds running out with inflation) and economic fears of a recession constraining discressionary spending. And for the Saints a drop in bullion values also.

That is quite an old coin to find roll hunting. But I have to ask, how old was the roll? 😆

Yup, supply and demand. The demand side surprised me with the amount some of the toned Isabella Quarters, which is a commemorative coin, sold for at over $5k up to $21k for MS-67. I am definitely going to my local antique stores also to see what they have.

Yup, that one was a little nicer, but I was surprised at what some of the toned ones went for while doing a little surfing at GC. The toned Isabella Quarters from the Expo were going for a lot more.

At around $500 for a nicer toned 1893 Columbian that could buy quite a few happy meals! Slap that baby in a slab coffin and let it rip. 😆