powermad5000

I see an off center broadstrike. A legitimate error coin. I agree without the date, it is worth less than a dated example, but I would not diminish the value of this error to just give the coin away. There are niche mint error collectors that specialize in/only collect error coins and the more extreme the error the more they pay for it. I was able to view error coins this summer at a booth at the Worlds Fair of Money when it came to Chicago and the array of what he had for sale was astounding. I was not allowed by him to take pics, only to view. One of the most bizarre to me that he had was a Washington quarter struck on a Mexican Peso planchet (it was in an NGC holder). If I had your coin, even minus there being a date, I would submit it to NGC and have it slabbed. Its value would be whatever an error collector is willing to pay for it.

Morgans being my favorite (NOT claiming to be an expert by any means), but what I note from the coin in the photos you provided is that the 5 seems to be misshapen and I would venture to say was added to a set of generic dies (most likely Chinese made). The O on the reverse also looks like it is too close to the ribbon as there is more space between the O and the ribbon on a genuine Morgan. I also see what appears to be small piles of metal around the date and the base of the neck that would not be on a genuine example. The denticles on the obverse don't seem to be full, and separated which would still be evident on a worn example and the denticles on the reverse seem to blend together toward the south in the area of the mintmark which would also be another red flag on this coin. Lastly, I noticed the chin at the neck on Liberty on the obverse seems to blend into the field of the coin suggesting the relief of the dies is not correct. Way too many inconsistencies on this coin.

The slab may have changed hands many times in the past before it made it to Heritage Auctions. It is possible there were other stickers affixed to it previously and someone attempted to remove a previous sticker but did so unsuccessfully as they damaged the hologram. The hologram is not on the inside of the slab and the slab itself seems to be intact in the photos you provided.

They both look counterfeit. Both coins seem to be out of round and in my opinion appear to be cast pot metal with artificial toning.

Hello and welcome! Without photos to ascertain what you actually have, it is hard to be able to give you good advice. I submit all of my coins to NGC. The only coins they will not grade are coins that have been plated or altered, counterfeit coins, or those that cannot be determined to be genuine. NGC has ways to submit any coin from ancients to mint errors to varieties, proofs, business strikes, special mint strikes and just about anything in between. Mint errors and varieties have an extra fee on top of the grading fee to establish if it is a mint error or a variety and this fee is charged whether or not the coin returns with that attribution. That said, with your admission to being new at the hobby, I would strongly advise to get familiar with what you are thinking about submitting as having "alot" of coins to submit will cost you in the thousands of dollars. Also as you are new to the hobby, I am sure most of what you are claiming to be mint errors most likely are not. Error Morgan and Peace dollars are not very common for either series. Morgan dollars have a substantial amount of varieties classed under what are known as VAM's. One of the most widely used resources to investigate these is a book called The Comprehensive Catalog and Encyclopedia of Morgan and Peace Dollars by Leroy C. Van Allen and A. George Mallis. It contains most varieties known except a few that were discovered since the book was published. You can research other US varieties on the main NGC page under the Resources tab and go down to Variety Plus in the dropdown menu. I also recommend that from the main NGC page you type the words "mint error" into the search box and read the three part article they published on what mint errors are recognized. Mostly, I recommend being you are new to the hobby to get price guides (or use the NGC price guide), and also a book like the NGC Red Book that provides an explanation of the condition of the coin as it correlates to the grade. You need to determine whether or not a coin has sufficient value to submit as the grading fees are very expensive and it is not worth submitting a coin that even though may be in excellent condition is worth less than the holder that it gets put into. Both NGC and PCGS are the top two grading services and are very similar in fees and grading points. ANACS are also well respected but are less popular than NGC or PCGS. You may see ICG coins but I do not trust the grading points as they are in the holder. I have experimented with cracking their coins out of their holders and submitting them to NGC and they always grade lesser than ICG claims. Please try to take the time to research the value of the coins you are thinking of submitting before you do before it costs you alot of money to only be disappointed when the box returns and you open it only to find what you thought to be rare and valuable is not. Good luck!

Heavily damaged. Try to put it back in circulation.

As a kid I had gotten one of those Lincoln cent sets with a state map counterstamped on each one and one with the border of the lower 48 on it. Agree, the OP's cent is a counterstamp for a promotion. To the OP, please do not submit this cent to any third party graders and save your cash. You can't find any information on it because it is not a US Mint production cent, and in the coin world, it is considered "damaged" in the same way Trade Dollars are that have chopmarks.

Hello and welcome to the forum! My condolences on your loss. As it is, we are only the caretakers of these coins until we pass, and they are left for someone else to carry on the task. I would ask for you to share more about yourself. Did you collect coins as well and now have inherited a ton of them? Your level of experience in the hobby would be helpful. Also, it would be helpful to know your intent on what you plan to do with them from here? Hard sell the whole thing, keep part of it, have them professionally graded? In the absence of even a couple photos, I would ask if there are any substantial amounts of silver dollars (Morgan, Seated Liberty, Draped Bust) and/or gold (Quarter Eagles, Eagles, Double Eagles), early half dollars, ancients, early copper cents, or colonial pieces? As we know in this forum, condition is not exactly a measure of worth when it comes to value. Consider 1811 half cents, 1913 S Barber quarters, 1893 S Morgans, etc. may not be in perfect condition but still have substantial value based upon low mintage numbers. My only reservation with taking the collection to a dealer for appraisal is in the case if you are selling the whole collection. A dealer is going to pay less than actual value as they have to make their money by reselling your coins. Third party graders like NGC are not allowed to buy/sell but only grade so you will get an accurate grade translating to an actual value, BUT with that extensive of a collection, the grading costs would be enormous so you will need to do some of your own research to try to determine if you have any extremely rare pieces in the collection before going that route. It will take a lot of time (would be extremely enjoyable for some of us but maybe not for you), but I would get a basic coin value book unless you want to keep a laptop or tablet open for hours on end and either use the price guide on this site or PCGS coin price guide and attempt to get a base figure of the value of the collection and proceed from there. I wish you the best of luck in this endeavor!

Hello and welcome! Echoing the others before me, I cannot even make an assessment based on the photo provided. Try not to take the photo through the scope. Try a cell phone pic (most phones cameras nowadays are quite good) using natural daylight, both sides of the coin, and given your question the obverse with the coin tilted in hand at several angles. And, no overlays or text please. Let the coin speak for itself. Also, for the future, please DO NOT clean your coins or dip them in acetone.

Nice cent Coinbuf!

Bobby, it took me about two seconds to look at your 1 cent and the scale reading to know the slight misalignment of the strike is well within mint tolerance and would have nothing to do with the weight of the original struck planchet. Your scale is far from accurate as others have stated in this thread. What is insulting to us is that you made a post to ask opinions about a coin you featured and upon getting those opinions you have instantly become defensive and combative. That has no place in this forum. Most of the members in this forum are well seasoned and quite knowledgeable about this hobby. Have some respect.

https://www.ngccoin.com/coin-dealer-locator Found it on a search. There is a button to click on the page to find dealers that assist with submissions and locate them in your area. Maybe you could work out a deal with one of them.

Kyle, if you say you spent a lot of money on having the coin looked at by many people and still have this agony over it, I have an idea for you that might work to end your restlessness. I tried to look where the email went, but I couldn't find NGC's email about a listing of NGC submitters across the country, so maybe someone else has this and could help. The point I am trying to make here is maybe you could find an authorized NGC submitter and work out a deal to submit just one coin lumped in with others submissions so maybe you wouldn't even have to pay the shipping to get it there and back, just the submission fees. Another way you could do it is to take it to one of the bigger coin shows where NGC takes submissions in person and you could at least save the shipping to them. Just throwing some ideas out there as I am sure we would all like to know the real deal and how the story ends.

I will add that a retained die break is an error. When a piece of a die breaks off and is actually imparted into the planchet during the strike it is a retained die break error. Most of the "errors" people present were described accurately by HogHead. Worn out dies producing any number of minor imperfections or mechanical doubling.

I wish more people took the time to read first. https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/7765 https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/7855 Learn Grading: What Is a Mint Error? — Part 3 | NGC https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/7936 Links to a three part series on what is a Mint Error. Die chips/cracks, cuds, DDO, DDR, and any minor variations IF recognized would be considered varieties and not mint errors. Consider the VAM's of Morgan Dollars. They are NOT errors. They are varieties. Also, not every crack, chip, or other imperfection will be classed as a variety if there were not a substantial amount produced by the mint to be recognized as such. One-offs may be an oddity, but won't command any substantial value.

There has been evidence of cutting coins in half in the past. There have been several "hobo" trade dollars for sale on eBay that were cut in half, hollowed out and had an internal hinge put inside to hide "stuff" inside the coin. Agree this is a magician's coin. There are also modern magicians quarters made with either two heads or two tails. Not worth submitting.

Spots on the obverse and rim look like whatever is on the surface is either partially worn off or environmental hasn't finished completely covering the coin. Have you tried to rinse it under just plain water to see what happens to it? From your photos, I see something in the environment the coin was in that caused a change to the surface. I think a true alloy change in the planchet would produce a uniform color across the entire surface.

Hello Eli! Welcome to the hobby and thank you for your service! I have been collecting coins for 40+ years and I still have a lot to learn but it has been a rewarding and fulfilling experience for me. I agree with the others, before investing or worrying about buying or selling, read legitimate books and turn off YouTube (except the ANA videos which are very informative). Get used to checking out what you get in pocket change. Get used to mintage numbers. Get used to inspecting coins. I say keep your examples in your photos and when you learn more about rarities and grading then you will see your progress and you will then let those coins go but you will understand why. This hobby does something different for everyone. I began by collecting the oldest coins I could find. Worn Morgans, cull Large cents, Indian heads, and Buffalo nickels. I later learned the ins and outs for myself and my collecting style. I also ended up getting a job that pays real dough and started into collecting higher value coins and higher end coins and spread out all over the place into Trade Dollars, half cents, Franklins, Mercury dimes, Seated Liberty Half dollars, Three Cent Nickels, Two Cent pieces, Capped Bust half dollars, and on and on. With all came pieces of knowledge. I am now comfortable going to coin shows and shopping out raw coins to submit. None of this happened overnight though. You are starting out so get some good books and refer to the price guides and the coin explorer on NGC. A 10X magnifier is fine. Maybe a scale that weighs out grams to two decimal places. Use these to inspect your pocket change which doesn't cost you a thing so you become familiar with inspecting and self grading. One thing to take away from my comment is you collect what you want and how you want and nobody can really tell you it is wrong. Keep that penny. And like I said, when your knowledge expands, you will one day let it go but you will understand why it is ok to let it go. Just my humble opinion.

If I may interject, the scale you are using is a cheap pocket scale. I owned three of those scales and all went to the recycler because the weights they were displaying were not accurate. You can check to see first if your scale is properly calibrated but you may benefit more by taking your coin to a coin shop or jeweler with a quality, accurate scale and getting a real reading to two decimal points. I think you will have your question answered at that point.

Great video Eagle! Thanks for sharing it!

What disturbs me about the coin you presented as yours in the photo is the lower portion of the hair on the obverse. On the genuine examples (and I zoomed in on my 1879 Vam3 Capped CC) is the lower hair on your coin is "disconnected". There are gaps at the very base of the hair and on the genuine examples, the hair is raised all across the bottom. Most notably on your coin is in the area near the second star on the right of the 9.

If I may offer my very humble opinion, as I have sent hundreds of coins over the years to NGC for grading and learning from my mistakes and sometimes sad results, I would hard pass on that at 10K. Obscure TPG slabs with inflated grades are something to stay away from unless you can determine its grade yourself. Having tested some less value coins in obscure TPG slabs, cracking them and submitting them to NGC has led to two to three points less in grade level. From your photos which is all there is to go on, I would put this one at AU level. The other thing to note is when submitting it is important to remember the rim is part of the coin and needs to be considered when selecting coins for submission. I have gotten back several descriptions on my return slabs which all became part of my learning experiences. For rim issues, I got back details grade followed by these (ugh) descriptions : Rim damage, Repaired, Mount Removed (as in the coin being previously used as a piece of jewelry), and Rim Filed. I am relaying these experiences I have had as the spot on the rim of the coin in your photo, for it being on a gold coin which basically should not erode, something is definitely wrong in that area, and with the amount of $$ involved in the transaction, I would continue my search for a better specimen.

Thank you for the information! That had crossed my mind, but I appreciate the official description on how that can happen.

From my hundreds of submissions to NGC, overdates, DDO, DDR, and RPM do not get assigned a label of Mint Error. That said, I own several overdates that are also not listed as varieties. I enjoy having these pieces as they are different from the norm. However, I know these overdates do not command much over common values. In cases such as the 1942/41 mercury dime overdate where there is high demand and low surplus, there is an obvious premium over the normal values. I am not sure exactly how new varieties get established and/or recognized, and maybe someone else on here could shed some light on that subject, but I would say it takes more than a single specimen for a variety to become recognized and established. As an example, on your coin, I would say if you submitted it with the extra $18 for variety plus, it would come back as 1950/50 but I doubt you would find it listed as a new variety. While I agree with the others that a photo of the full face of the coin would be helpful in determining a true DDO, I also noticed the denticles right away as pointed out by Quintus Arrius. Based solely on your provided photo, my humble opinion is you have some type of overdate or RPM, and there was also possibly maybe ???? a minor or start of a die clash or partial die clash to make the secondary denticles? Also in my opinion, while you don't have something that is worth a substantial premium over established values, it is definitely different and would catch someone's attention when it came time that you decide to let the coin go to a new owner.

Question for the graders....I have many coins with curved clips or double curved clips as mint errors and can see how that would happen in the minting process. My question is when a coin has a straight clip, is there a way in the minting process that a coin could end up with a straight clip, or are all straight clips man made?