GoldFinger1969

I have to re-read the book. Remember, the impetus for Double Eagles (Liberty DE's first, then Saint-Gaudens') was because we had the California and Yukon Gold strikes. As you may learn from FMTM or will learn from S-G DE, large denomination gold coins weren't used that much in regular commerce and by most people. But it served a need in using the mined gold. $5 and smaller gold coins didn't do the trick, you needed Eagles and Double Eagles.

It's a GREAT reference book, the only thing is it doesn't come in hardcover. But a MUST if you have interest in gold coins in general and Saints specifically. If you read the SAINT GAUDENS DE thread here, that'll give you a good flavor for what's in the book. But basically you have on average 5-7 pages on every year/mintage of Saint-Gaudens coin plus special sections and longer ones on special coins and patterns.

Yes, at a minimum you're buying 1 ounce of gold if you buy a common in low-60's grade. I have a few of those and am hoping to get a 1907 High Relief in the next year or so. We'll see..... If you have to wait before you buy a Saint -- and I waited a while, too -- then getting the book and educating yourself is a good backup position to enjoy while you wait/save up.

Just a reminder that besides FMTM, Roger has other great books out there. I'm obviously partial to his book on Saint-Gaudens Double Eagles, as we have a pretty lengthy thread on it. If you have any Saints or even if the coins are of interest to you, it's a great book with year-by-year mintage data and commentary and special sections on gold coins, gold trade flows, the gold standard, etc. It's also a much easier read too than FMTM. Though if you read -- and underestand -- the complexity of FMTM, then stuff about striking and other coinage procedures in the Saints book will be second nature to you.

Yes, I know Gillio said some things had to be kept private. My guess is -- and I agree, total speculation -- that wherever the original hoard was found might have led to other claims by other participants who got shut out. I wonder if he's ever spoken on the find, maybe he gave more details there. But probably not. Dealers like him just find 'em and then sell 'em. I have to check out those books on hoards in 2021.

Roger, where did you get most of the commentary on that Wells Fargo 1908 No Motto section ? Only part of it was from the DE Red Book for which you had several footnotes listed.....the rest is commentary I haven't seen before.

Who is NS&G and what account are we talking about and how would it affect the CLCT deal ?

That seems to be the play. All these sports cards, uniforms, bats, and other memorabilia...they need to be certified and graded and sometimes protected.

Masks should eventually be redundant. Raise what alarm by what going public ? I'm confused.

In this thread, I have the usual Toolbar with Size/Color functions -- on a recent post in the Saint-Gaudens thread, I did NOT. The comments are only using 1/2 the screen on the left-side.....the right-side has a list of active posters on the thread. This is interesting but not worth the reduction in size and functionality. I would appreciate a button that got rid of the stuff on the right-side and restored The Old Look. I noticed that the information on the right-side disappears as you SCROLL DOWN. You just have empty space. All the more reason to ditch it or have a button that expands the posts on the left-side to the old format size as they shift rightward. I see an Arrow Button top-right that does get rid of the Top Posters & Other Info on the right-side....but it just gives you more empty space. The posts do not shift-right to fill it.

1908 No Motto Hoard: Was re-reading the outstanding section on the 1908 No Motto Wells Fargo hoard in Roger's book. Interesting....the coins were initially offered in MS-65 quality for $1,160. Spot gold averaged about $330 per ounce and an Uncirculated Saint DEs (doesn't say what grade -- MS63 ?) was about $375. The price guide for that Saint-Gauden year included in the book says that the MS-60 sold for $490, the MS-63 for $540, and the MS-65 for $1,150. Since the price guide MS-65 price matches up well with the initial price for an MS-65 Wells Fargo, maybe the other prices are off a bit since you'd have to go down to AU's to approach $375. Regardless....buying the Wells Fargo or regular No Motto at MS-65 quality entailed paying a huge premium (350%) to spot gold. Today, you can buy a 1908 No Motto MS-65 for about $2,400 or about a 30% premium to spot gold. It's counter-intuitive, but when the absolute price is CHEAP the relative price is EXPENSIVE. At these times it paid to buy spot gold for more price leverage and wait to pay the higher price for the Saint later on.

Can a veteran here give me their thoughts on The Big 3: ANA vs. Long Beach vs. FUN ? In terms of overall attendance, number of vendors, "enthusiasn", trends the last few years and last 10-20 years. The one advantage that FUN has is that all the collectors in the Northeast who are in the cold of winter get to go down to Florida for a few days in January.

Not familiar with them, story ?

I get cutting back on expenses and I see how going to shows can add up. You clearly DO NOT need to go to them if you are a dealer as often as you did 20 or 30 or 40 years ago. As someone who went to his first non-local show only this year (FUN in January), I had a blast. Yeah, it probably cost me $1,000 before I spent a single dollar but I thoroughly enjoyed it.

If they went out the back door, then they should have been seized as per the bogus arguments surrounding the 1933 Saints.

I think everybody is going to bank on kick-a** attendance and vendor support in 2022.

Even if you don't have the coins, the S-G DE book is fantastic reading. Year-by-year in-depth analysis of each mintage, plus special sections on lots of topics gold-related from 1907-1933.

I'm sure if you can't find an autographed copy that Roger would be happy to sign it sometime in the future if you two should meet. But I'll let him speak for himself. Not sure you are interested in the coins, but have you considered purchasing his Saint-Gaudens Double Eagle book ?

I thought it was a Saint, but the 1907 High Relief. The 1933's need a rescue operation from Fort Knox. Emailed some woman named " Pusssy Galore" the other day, awaiting a response.

What do these software programs offer, above and beyond my homemade Excel Spreadsheet with a few key columns that I created ?

What's the answer, I honestly don't know !!??

Eliasberg is one of the most famous coin collectors given his extensive collection and longevity. I would think a coin from his collection matters -- isn't that why NGC and/or PCGS sometimes put collectors on the labels ?

How many "coins" are we talking about ? It's a penny-Sacagawea combination mistrike, right ?

I think you are right, Mark....I think one of the dealers told me that.

SP is "special proof" -- right ? I think that 2013 Reverese Enhances ASE got the SP rating from PCGS....I can't recall if NGC gave it an MS or SP rating. Gotta check.....