Henri Charriere

@zadok Unbeknownst to My Cousin Vinny -- who appears to be making a complete mockery of the strict regimen I prescribed for him out of concern for his health and common sense acting in my unofficial capacity as unchallenged, unlicensed, wannabe caretaker -- I began my collection of coins much the way many here do, as type collectors who filled holes in Whitman albums in early 1960's, using nothing more than a stack of Whitman albums and a current Red Book, as a guide. Regrettably, I made a statement he has thrown in my face, three times in the past 24 months: my expectation that as soon as the bells rang and the gates at KY Downs shot open , I would complete the course [as a type collector] whether thr track is dry or sloppy, within 90 days. All I had was my wife's cell (with internet) eBay, and discretionary funds. I was unaware that the coins I bought were assigned arbitrary values, vowed I would not shift to slabbing rivalry and had no Idea what a TPGS was and what product they produced. I discovered a concept called a Set Registry, but much to my dismay found out the primary ones a). do not accept loose coins (I later found out were termed "raw" and b) shunned miscegenation in encapsulations (as it is applied in this context), The next discovery was a whopper: not all coins assigned the same grade, whether by the same TPGS or another, may be identical, or even similar. If you are a firm believer in science, precise incontrovertible evidence and firm conclusions, you will be annoyed by an entire hobby's reliance and meek acceptance (acquiescence) of opinions. Have you ever heard the saying, Tell me how you feel about a particular individual or event, and I'll tell you what paper you read and radio station you listen to? I am a collector of many different things, but only the American Psychiatric Association's bible, the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders [DSM-5] can tell us why. Incidentally, though you may be a complex man, there is a striking validity to what you've said the most difficult aspect being honest enough to bring one's self to admit it. 😉 🐓

@World Colonial You sure know how to hurt a guy. Now I am obliged to sit down with each of my 🐓 🐓 🐓 and explain my motivations for acquiring them... 1899: because you were the first one made. 1900: no, it wasn't the luster, I got you because you were the rarest... 1909: because the "detective" I bribed had to convince your owner to make him an offer he could not refuse. (I didn't even have an Order #; I was told "she," presumably a reference to "Marianne," was "beautiful," wired her an obscene amount of money -- for that and two there, sight unseen, and she was, a full-fledged MS-67 with original mint luster!) With all due respect, WC, some people carry a rabbit's foot, wear a talisman, maintain a "comfort" pet, etc. I have my Roosters. They are costly, described as the "Best French Set" ever assembled, now or ever [by P-] and to a mere chiffonnier married to a French woman, both seniors living on fixed incomes, they serve a purpose: they stimulate my mind, and encourage a motivation to leave no stone unturned until I have found the very best available rooster possible. As always, I am in accord with every thought you've heretofore expressed. I bid you, all lurkers and surfers, a pleasant evening. 🐓

@VKurtB Pardon me for interrupting, but I distinctly recall your saying, in substace: I do not smoke, drink or use drugs.

@J P Mashoke It's really a nice, well-executed design and exuding a strong example of the male gender. (There. I said it!)

@VKurtB We wish you all the best on your short, hopefully uneventful, hop to O'Hare. And don't forget: No alcohol whatsoever and no.luggage, carry-on on or not, over ten (10) pounds. Enjoy yourself! Godspeed!

@J P Mashoke Here's a plausible back-story: Note your coin (nee a "Proof") is in acceptable condition for its age which suggests its owner, initially taken by the novelty of the dual-date, held on to it hoping it would appreciate in value. But it did not. I suspect the reason you found this coin explains why I have over a hundred [unsearched] dual-dated Ikes still sitting on top of my file cabinet the details of which can be seen on each roll's end suggesting someone kept them when they were first introduced hoping for a decent return on investment, and when that failed to materialize, redeemed them, BU Flawless or not, for face value. I still don't know what I should do with them. (Not a day goes by my roosters harp on me to get rid of them.) 🐓

@Moxie15 Agreed. The OP picks up a coin that was recovered from under the wreckage of the LZ-129 [Hindenburg] and wants to discuss everything but the overwhelmingly obvious collateral damage. Sorry. Better luck next time.

[THAT EXPLAINS EVERYTHING! The expression, numismatically, of "mad scientist" can be traced back to the sterile etymology of "MisAligned Dies," and their close sanguine relatives, "doubled- and rotated-dies." I haven't the slightest idea why all the fuss over obvious imperfections, but I must admit it sounds good, and makes collectors of such curiosities and oddities, deliriously happy.]

@VKurtB Talking about bad feelings...Regardless, every forum needs a guy everyone loves to hate and, unfortunately on this Forum that person is me. @MAULEMALL hangs out at the water cooler, because of ME. The pi-guy, (3.14) hangs out with his cronies ATS, because of ME. I had one run-in with @bsshog40 and that was enough for him. @Alex in PA. ordered me to leave @Ratzie33 alone and I chose to honor his request. I resist the impulse to "follow" people because my imprimatur is poison. There are a host of people who tolerate me. A few who like me. And two who are amused by me: @VKurtB and the Great @zadok. I love this place! And the oft-times finicky moderators who ride herd on all of us.

[There was a not particularly pleasant woman selling tchotchkes on the street and I walked up to her and handed her a tall, flawless, thick-walled glass decanter on top of which was placed a removal perforated glass strainer topped by a Rooster. I bought it years before at a street fair for $85. I walked up to her and handed it to her without uttering a word. Stunned and startled she uttered four words: "What's this for???" I told her "It's called E-vic-tion," turned around, and left.

And if you did that, you'd have some 'splainin' to do not to mention the possibility of arrest on a Federal rap.

Are you sure you weren't a prison guard in your former life? WHO CARES? (Psst! If you're interested in owning your very own '33 for your own personal satisfaction...) 🐓

[Note from OP... When I began this thread less than 24 hours ago, I anticipated outrage. Instead, I got a verbatim quote from a source dating to 1868, and a quiet resignation to reality and ho-hum acquiescence. Then I took a closer look at those who've responded and realized no one identified with the inherent problem because, to my knowledge, none are Set Registrants. Oh, they may assemble a type set, but they will consciously avoid the trials and tribulations of taking chances: paying $450., or well above melt value for a 🐓 they hope will turn out to be the Mint State grade they need for no other reason than the dearth of certified original roosters out there. An MS-66 "restrike" generally runs $600 and an MS-67 $1200; the likelihood a bullion dealer will give you an MS-68 (none of which have been certified) or higher, is pure unadulterated fantasy.. Do mistakes occur? All the time. A FDC coin I bought from Europe, which is defined in France as a range of from MS-65 to MS-70 was forwarded without delay to a TPGS which routinely encapsulated it as a certified MS-64+. Now what do you do having spent a fortune for a higher price, formal grade and new chassis? By the way, what is the FMV of a raw coin you bought in USD which were then converted to euros via bank wire transfer at additional additional cost" The melt price of a French 20-franc gold rooster is $325. Common Rooster dilemmas: a). Buying a fully vaccinated, certified Rooser for top price, or b). Buying a Rooster, hope it is a high enough B.U. and of or within the needed Mint State designation sought. (My Want (pure fantasy) List is small but if any member in his travels is inadvertently made aware of any "original"French 20-Francs gold rooser, 1899-1913 and 1914 at MS 65 of better and a "restrike" dated 1910, 19+3 or 1914 offered for sale, PM me immediately without delay. 🐓

@RWB One analogy that comes to mind has a sommelier approach a couple sitting at a table of the St. Regis, white starched towel on his forearm, removing a vintage bottle of wine from a silver bucket of ice, removing the cork, presenting it to the seated gentleman to appraise it with his olfactory senses, obtaining his approval and pouring the wine into two proper wine glasses without allowing the bottle to touch them, the gentleman lifting the glass to his lips to catch the scent of its bouquet with subtle fruity notes and nodding his approval. The other scenario involves a Bowery bum who orders a cheap bottle of rotgut, opens the bottle with his teeth, disposing of its contents in one long, noisy chug-a-lug gulp, burping loudly, and wiping his mouth off with the back of his fist. The difference between a wine connoisseur -- and a common wino.

The following is the reply I received today from one of the Top Three bullion dealers requesting their definition of the topic of this post as it related to an ad they placed regarding an "original" (1904) French 20-franc gold rooster: "BU condition will fall within the range of MS-60 to MS-70." Comments, anyone?

@GoldFinger1969 My apologies and sincere gratitude for your forbearance in allowing all these tangential rail spurs.

You are not going to accept this explanation, but as Just Bob responded elsewhere, "you put me on the spot," so here goes: I am unable to rely on personal experience but all 16 Roosters on my P- Set Registry and all 8 Roosters on my N- Set Registry lie within the range of MS-64 and MS-67. The overall appearance is one of uniformity. Theoretically, they have never been in commercial circulation. I am merely parroting fact or anecdotal evidence as noted in a number of sources. Evidently, any opinion I have of examples I own are colored by the collective unchallenged subliminal suggestions and perceptions of others. If I ever get my hands on something concrete you will be the first to know I've experienced my Eureka! moment. 🐓

[Gotcha RWB! That's the one and only Spartacus. Two a's, no i]

No pets or children are allowed and anyone coming in must get past "Security" or the "concierge" as he prefers to be called.

[I guess this is not a good time to say we may all need an additional "booster" shot depending on where this Delta variant takes us. My wife and I both got the Pfizer, twice, and after a brief rest interval, were asked how we felt. She told them the truth and said it hurt. Both times. I smiled and lied through my teeth saying, "I feel a whole lot better now than before I got the shot," and laughed. Seriously, there is no one shot that fits all and those who've been vaccinated have gotten sick, but probably not as badly as they would have had they refused it. The least anyone can do is get vaccinated and wear the mask when asked. Eleven people in my 93-unit senior residence have died since the onset of the pandemic. No one, however, knows their official cause of death. Age, poor health, an already compromised immunity system? I wish all who were affected a speedy recovery!] 🐓

In a dream I had, you graciously offered to become my "aerial ambassador," and I genuflected and thanked you profusely...

What a shame and they just announced a successor to Brett Charville.

Unless someone knows something I don't, the closest weight class would be the 100 Francs coin which comes in at .933 troy ounces but I am not aware of any French coin that competes with, say, the American Eagle or South African Kreugerrand.

I cannot give you a straight-forward explanation because even the most reliable sources are tainted with incorrect information. One thing for sure, the composition was tweaked many times with finer gold, the elimination of silver and manipulation of the copper used. Weight disparity is common and even the standard diameter size, 21 mm, touted by dealers and retail merchants alike, is in fact, slightly larger. No one has the slightest idea how many of the 117 million produced survived but dealers continually crow about their overall rarity. Who knows, maybe the finest MS originals exist in private collections or museums, but without formal certification the populations are mere guesstimates and existence just conjecture.

I do not collect 10-Franc gold roosters but there was one for sale for well over $10,000 on the web yesterday. These coins are presumably half the size of the 20-Franc gold roosters which contain less than 1/5 of a troy oz of gold. Paying that much 💰 for less than a tenth of an ounce of gold bullion is not my idea of coin collecting.