Submitted - MS68.5 vs mine. & off topic updated 1 1

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 3:55 PM, EagleRJO said:

No one said that. VKurtB said that the toning looked wrong, except that it was only on one side (meaning that's an indication it's legit toning). And I responded that one-sided toning is not always an indicator of legit toning anymore (with an example of one-sided AT posted), and that I was not seeing a good color progression. That is a classic indicator to look for with AT if you were not aware of that, and which is sometimes very difficult to identify. Also, I believe all that were critical at first (myself included) qualified comments that it's very difficult to properly evaluate a coin with just one pic of the coin, and that they hoped it was just the way the pics of the coin were presenting. One thing that was really rubbing me the wrong way the grainy appearance, but it looks like that was just the pics.

Can we at least agree that roll end toning is a different breed of cat? Completely unlike classic canvas bag toning. 

[Harry’s Collection]

Please share a photo of a rolled ended coin?

 Looks like you edited your post as you said it looks like a an ender.

This is an ender.

 

[Harry’s Collection]

On 10/31/2022 at 4:12 PM, VKurtB said:

Can we at least agree that roll end toning is a different breed of cat? Completely unlike classic canvas bag toning. 

 

On 10/31/2022 at 4:12 PM, VKurtB said:

Can we at least agree that roll end toning is a different breed of cat? Completely unlike classic canvas bag toning. 

Go back to the top, of the post, I added 2 more pics.  I don’t recall what type of lighting I was surrounded by, again the coin is in the received stage.  But it’s taking a LONG time.

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 4:26 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

 

Go back to the top, of the post, I added 2 more pics.  I don’t recall what type of lighting I was surrounded by, again the coin is in the received stage.  But it’s taking a LONG time.

They do take a long time. This could take several weeks. 

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 4:26 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

 

Go back to the top, of the post, I added 2 more pics.  I don’t recall what type of lighting I was surrounded by, again the coin is in the received stage.  But it’s taking a LONG time.

These photos are worse. Now, regarding roll end toning, this happens when a roll of coins is put away literally for decades. It happens MOSTLY to silver coins but not exclusively. I’ve seen it on a roll of BU 1929-D nickels. The edges of all the coins are toned dark, as are ONE side of the first and last coins in the roll. The remaining coins’ obverses and reverses are relatively toning free except for the edges. Those dark sides, of the first and last coins, tone a more uniform color than in “bag toning” which often has rainbows due to the dichroic effect. (Look it up.) The roll end toning comes from decades of intimate contact with high sulfur paper used in older coin rolls. 

[Henri Charriere]

On 10/28/2022 at 2:41 PM, AdamWL said:

68.5? Since when do we have half grades? 

Edit: Is that another way of saying 68+?

🐓 :  This is the one promising lead that got swept by the wayside...

Q.A.:  Troo dat!  I, for one, would like to know the acronym of the undisclosed TPGS that employs that uniquely incremental system of citation...

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 4:44 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

🐓 :  This is the one promising lead that got swept by the wayside...

Q.A.:  Troo dat!  I, for one, would like to know the acronym of the undisclosed TPGS that employs that uniquely incremental system of citation...

You talk to yourself in search of expert advice, I see. 

[Oldhoopster]

Spoiler

 

On 10/31/2022 at 4:24 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

This coin appears to have a diagonal scratch on Liberty jaw.  You have to understand one thing from my research the mint never wanted a perfect smooth coin for circulation to avoid counterfeits.  

However proofs are handled by hand & use a different polish & attributes to distinguish them from business. 

Wayne Miler's Morgan and Peace Dollar Textbook has a nice write up on Proof Morgan's if anyone is interested.

Edited October 31, 2022 by Oldhoopster

[Henri Charriere]

On 10/31/2022 at 5:52 PM, VKurtB said:

You talk to yourself in search of expert advice, I see. 

It's a simple question that was given short shrift.

[Henri Charriere]

On 10/30/2022 at 1:43 PM, Oldhoopster said:

....Sorry, but your coin isn't close to the top pop 68+ (what is this 68.5 stuff?)

Yes, exactly what is this 68.5 nomenclature?

[EagleRJO]

On 10/28/2022 at 10:12 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

You mean 66+  ??

On 10/28/2022 at 11:54 PM, EagleRJO said:

Yea he meant 67+ with PCGS slabs.

Maybe you missed the above QA with your query below.

On 10/31/2022 at 5:44 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

... I, for one, would like to know the acronym of the undisclosed TPGS that employs that uniquely incremental system of citation...

[Henri Charriere]

On 10/28/2022 at 2:16 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

....He showed me 2x 1885-O’s that were 67.5 via PCGS & he was jealous of this coin.

A "67.5 via PCGS,"...

None of my PCGS slabs were honored with this unique attribute.

What gives here?

[EagleRJO]

On 10/31/2022 at 6:22 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

None of my PCGS slabs were honored with this unique attribute.

You're not "special" ... the comment by GoldFinger was in response to that post by Harry! [duck] 

[EagleRJO]

On 10/28/2022 at 3:30 AM, Harry’s Collection said:

... no sense of talking about coins when things don’t look good, no one is communicating with me except customer reps, and their tone of voice sounds bleak ...

Back on track here with the op's coins. What happened? I thought it was looking good with the feedback being the coins were very valuable.

[Henri Charriere]

On 10/31/2022 at 5:52 PM, VKurtB said:

You talk to yourself in search of expert advice, I see. 

Not necessarily, sometimes I'm busy.  Then, I turn to you, our resident expert on all things numismatic.  As a practical and hypothetical matter, if one submits a coin one believes is valued at $200. and it turns out upon preliminary examination by a grader that it is worth a great deal more as in the OP's example, say $20,000., what happens? Is the member contacted for the necessary submission form adjustments and related fees?  🤔 

[Henri Charriere]

On 10/31/2022 at 6:38 PM, EagleRJO said:

Back on track here with the op's coins. What happened? I thought it was looking good with the feedback being the coins were very valuable.

It was, until it wasn't.  This is a matter that is continuing to evolve. Last I read, the "brake broke," i.e., the submission was misplaced. 

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 5:48 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

Not necessarily, sometimes I'm busy.  Then, I turn to you, our resident expert on all things numismatic.  As a practical and hypothetical matter, if one submits a coin one believes is valued at $200. and it turns out upon preliminary examination by a grader that it is worth a great deal more as in the OP's example, say $20,000., what happens? Is the member contacted for the necessary submission form adjustments and related fees?  🤔 

They contact submitters to offer unrequested conservation that they think might be worthwhile, so why not?

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 5:51 PM, Quintus Arrius said:

It was, until it wasn't.  This is a matter that is continuing to evolve. Last I read, the "brake broke," i.e., the submission was misplaced. 

I believe the OP might have thought these things take little time to resolve. I hope I have disabused him of that notion. How long do they take? Longer than you can imagine plus 3 days. 

[GoldFinger1969]

Harry, many of us are not expert graders in general or on your particular coin type.  Toning adds another degree of difficulty.

Good luck with your submission and report back. 

 

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 6:01 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Toning adds another degree of difficulty.

Not JUST difficulty, although it does add that too, but outright DISAGREEMENT. 

[Harry’s Collection]

Disagree, how many rolls have you cracked?  Authentic rolls that are at least 20 yrs old?   Since you deviated the focal point of this post, I choose not to provide a photo of what an ender looks like not and not elaborate.

Edited November 1, 2022 by Harry’s Collection

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 10:48 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

Disagree, how many rolls have you cracked?  Authentic rolls that are at least 20 yrs old?   Since you deviated the focal point of this post, I choose not to provide a photo of what an ender looks like not and not elaborate.

20 years is nothing. That’s only 2002. I’ve been present at 100+ year old virgin roll openings, and numerous of 50 years +. I have virgin rolls of every coin of my birth year, and that’s 67 years ago. I am active in solid BU rolls. It’s one of my specialties, taken up because many old school roll collectors had been dying off in rural Pennsylvania and the Red Rose Coin Club. 

At just ONE auction I attended near Gettysburg, 35 solid date rolls of Morgan dollars were auctioned, all with 100+ years of roll end toning. 

Edited November 1, 2022 by VKurtB

[Harry’s Collection]

I wish someone else knew the answer to this because I’m either freaking out since I did NOT request prescreen nor am I an elite member to opt for this service.  The receiving dept took it upon herself to out into prescreen.  I’m freaking out — reread the revised original post edited earlier.  
 

So 4 questions:  *For those that have first hand experience & especially anyone currently having coins being processed please comment.  -*Include the total number of coins in your submission.

• Has anyone here declared a value of $25-100k amount & then it went straight to receiving to schedule to be graded? (No Prescreen requested on their submission form)

• Has anyone non elite members, ever had their coin sent to prescreen eval without being notified?

• For the elite membership people, on avg how long does it take for that prescreen to finish?  -*You chose Walkthrough service?  Include # of coins.

 

• Has anyone here ever had someone from receiving suggest or even submit your submission to prescreen without informing beforehand and you are NOT an elite member?

*Side note..  for those who go off topic about this or that, post a photo of your own coin, so all of us can at least see what your referring too.

Edited November 1, 2022 by Harry’s Collection

[Harry’s Collection]

Please post some photos?  Seeing is believing, sir

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 11:04 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

Please post some photos?  Seeing is believing, sir

Pretty big demands for a newb on here for only 10 days. For all we know, you are a complete charlatan. I don’t “do” photos of coins other than through my stereo microscope. My phone doesn’t do closeups and my photo gear is too big of a production to set up. 

Edited November 1, 2022 by VKurtB

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 11:03 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

I wish someone else knew the answer to this because I’m either freaking out since I did NOT request prescreen nor am I an elite member to opt for this service.  The receiving dept took it upon herself to out into prescreen.  I’m freaking out — reread the revised original post edited earlier.  
 

So 4 questions:  *For those that have first hand experience & especially anyone currently having coins being processed please comment.  -*Include the total number of coins in your submission.

• Has anyone here declared a value of X amount & then it graded much higher? (No Prescreen requested on their submission form)

• Has anyone non elite members, ever had their coin sent to prescreen eval without being notified?

• For the elite membership people, on avg how long does it take for that prescreen to finish?  -*You chose Walkthrough service?

 

• Has anyone here ever had someone from receiving suggest or even submit your submission to prescreen and you are NOT an elite member?

*Side note..  for those who go off topic about this or that, post a photo of your own coin, so all of us can at least see what your referring too.

Sounds like you sent in a bunch of coins. Yes or no? It also seems you did select walkthrough. Are you aware how expensive that is???? That is a complete waste of resources. Sounds to me like the prescreen is to separate the wheat from the chaff for you. 

Edited November 1, 2022 by VKurtB

[Harry’s Collection]

Again, seeing is believing.  Post a photo of your BU rolls top View & the ender view & preferable the ender coin in a 2x2.

[Harry’s Collection]

Agree, I’m new here, but I rather spend 60+ hours a week & finish reading books from the likes of David Bowers before I start chiming in.  Btw, off and on 15 years of collecting.

 

not hard to take a photo with even an old smart phone of an ender.  Here I’ll show you, from the US mint, placed immediately in an air tight plastic tube.

tell me how the 1885 Morgan looks anything like an ender?

Edited November 1, 2022 by Harry’s Collection

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 11:14 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

Again, seeing is believing.  Post a photo of your BU rolls top View & the ender view & preferable the ender coin in a 2x2.

I have at least 20 boxes of solid date rolls, slightly more than half in cents. 

[VKurtB]

On 10/31/2022 at 11:16 PM, Harry’s Collection said:

Agree, I’m new here, but I rather spend 60+ hours a week & finish reading books from the likes of David Bowers before I start chiming in.  Btw, off and on 15 years of collecting 

Ooh, 15 years?!?!! Since 2007?!?! I have shirts older than that. In fact, I have American Numismatic Association convention shirts older than that. 

Edited November 1, 2022 by VKurtB