End of the National Parks Quarters is soon, what's next??? 2 2

[erwindoc]

Anyone got a definite answer?  I have quite a collection of Washington quarters, but the modern ones have been really tough to keep up with and Im losing steam making the effort to fill the albums!  Personally, Id like to see the thing change to the Laura Fraser version or even get redone completely!  Looking at Google says that it might still be up in the air. 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2020 by erwindoc

[physics-fan3.14]

Wow. I really didn't realize that 2021 (next year) was the last year. I haven't followed the series.... and I have honestly had absolutely zero interest in the series. 

I hope they don't decide to do another series. I hope they stop all these silly "50" series. I couldn't tell you what most of the States coins are, and I absolutely couldn't tell you what the ATB series are at all (except for SC). I guess there's a dollar series too? Why? 

Just kill them all. One *well designed* obverse and one *well designed* reverse...... and no dead people. Is that too much to ask? 

[bsshog40]

Yea, I lost interest after the statehood quarters myself. I have about 4 albums of them and all of them are basically only worth a quarter. I would like to see it just go back to a nice design and stay there. But, the mint will find something else that no one cares about to spend a few more years on. 

[coincorgi]

25 minutes ago, erwindoc said:

Anyone got a definite answer?

This is the current status...

from wikipedia (because I am too lazy to type/paraphrase anything)...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America_the_Beautiful_quarters

"According to the legislation, once the America the Beautiful Quarters Program ends in 2021, the obverse of the quarter will revert to the original Flanagan design used from 1932 until the start of the 50 State Quarter Program. However, the reverse will be redesigned to feature General Washington crossing the Delaware River, the same theme that was used on the 1999 New Jersey quarter."

H.R. 6184 (110th): America’s Beautiful National Parks Quarter Dollar Coin Act of 2008 (link to pdf)

Edited September 10, 2020 by coincorgi

[physics-fan3.14]

3 minutes ago, bsshog40 said:

But, the mint will find something else that no one cares about to spend a few more years on. 

You know, it isn't the mint. I'm sure the mint would rather not do this. It's a whole lot more work for them. 

They are being instructed to do this by Congress. The mint has no choice, they have to do what the Congress tells them to. The Congress told them to do 50 States, they told them to do ATB, they told them to do Presidential dollars, they told them to do American Innovation Dollars.The mint has to do what they are told. 

Seriously, does anyone here actually care about any of these series? I'm sure the percentages are extremely low! 

[bsshog40]

9 minutes ago, physics-fan3.14 said:

You know, it isn't the mint. I'm sure the mint would rather not do this. It's a whole lot more work for them. 

They are being instructed to do this by Congress. The mint has no choice, they have to do what the Congress tells them to. The Congress told them to do 50 States, they told them to do ATB, they told them to do Presidential dollars, they told them to do American Innovation Dollars.The mint has to do what they are told. 

Seriously, does anyone here actually care about any of these series? I'm sure the percentages are extremely low! 

Yea I know. I just mentioned the mint cause they'll be making them. I would think that with the new year being close that some sort of bill has already been passed but not brought to public yet. I don't care what they start next year, not enough for me to spend all my time collecting a bunch of worthless quarters that will only remain a 25c value. 

[Conder101]

This question AGAIN!  (Sorry but this question comes up frequently , and the three forums I;m on I'm sure I have seen it at least six times so far this year.)

The answer can be found in the legislation that authorized the state quarters way back in 1995, and again in the legislation authorizing the ATB quarters which was either 2007 or 2008.  At the end of the series the obv will revert to the original 1932 design by Flannagan.  On the reverse will be a depiction of Washington crossing the Delaware.  This will be the new permanent design.  The design for the reverse has already been selected.

How permanent this will be is uncertain, no legislation has been approved yet but there has been suggested a commemorative reverse redesign for all the coins for the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence in 2026 (probably one years only) and there has been a suggestion for a five year, one design per year of animals, and a similar program depicting youth sports.

[Coinbuf]

I'm sure that we are doomed to see several "political correct" designs in the coming years likely on many different denomination coins.  I would be very surprised if congress does not draft legislation to depict a series of black lives matters coins soon.

[bsshog40]

8 minutes ago, Conder101 said:

This question AGAIN!  (Sorry but this question comes up frequently , and the three forums I;m on I'm sure I have seen it at least six times so far this year.)

The answer can be found in the legislation that authorized the state quarters way back in 1995, and again in the legislation authorizing the ATB quarters which was either 2007 or 2008.  At the end of the series the obv will revert to the original 1932 design by Flannagan.  On the reverse will be a depiction of Washington crossing the Delaware.  This will be the new permanent design.  The design for the reverse has already been selected.

How permanent this will be is uncertain, no legislation has been approved yet but there has been suggested a commemorative reverse redesign for all the coins for the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence in 2026 (probably one years only) and there has been a suggestion for a five year, one design per year of animals, and a similar program depicting youth sports.

Thanks Conder!. I don't like the Rev. I would like to see the Eagle come back!

[coincorgi]

12 minutes ago, Conder101 said:

the legislation authorizing the ATB quarters which was either 2007 or 2008

I provided a link to a pdf of the bill in my post. 2008, BTW.

[Cat Bath]

I think coins could come back if they represented a meaningful amount of money, were pretty & not political in any way.

I'm thinking we could get by with 3 of them.

5 cents...a little smaller than cent size, picture of an eagle on the obverse & rose on the back (national flower)

25 cents...a little bigger than Nickel size, mountain lion on obverse & oak tree on the back.

Dollar....Innovation dollar...same size...No change.

Eliminate the paper dollar, cent & dime. Massive confusion over size would get people actually looking at the coin. (old coinage would be collected by the banking system)

[World Colonial]

9 hours ago, Coinbuf said:

I'm sure that we are doomed to see several "political correct" designs in the coming years likely on many different denomination coins.  I would be very surprised if congress does not draft legislation to depict a series of black lives matters coins soon.

Exactly what I was thinking.  Postponed but planned with the $10 or $20 (can't remember which one) and already many stupid themes on recent modern commemoratives.

When (not if) it happens, I think it's more likely on currency than coins.  I'm ok with one if it's someone such as MLK who was legitimately historically prominent but not otherwise.

[VKurtB]

2 hours ago, World Colonial said:

Exactly what I was thinking.  Postponed but planned with the $10 or $20 (can't remember which one) and already many stupid themes on recent modern commemoratives.

When (not if) it happens, I think it's more likely on currency than coins.  I'm ok with one if it's someone such as MLK who was legitimately historically prominent but not otherwise.

BLM. Belt Loops Matter. Pull up your pants.

[VKurtB]

16 hours ago, erwindoc said:

Anyone got a definite answer?  I have quite a collection of Washington quarters, but the modern ones have been really tough to keep up with and Im losing steam making the effort to fill the albums!  Personally, Id like to see the thing change to the Laura Fraser version or even get redone completely!  Looking at Google says that it might still be up in the air. 

 

 

Will you be celebrating the end of the ATB quarter series with me at Tuskegee, Alabama? I was one of the people who were part of ending that series and the beginning of the Innovation Dollar series, by our recommendation.

[VKurtB]

Yet another reason that Jason Poe and I will never be "sympatico". He comes on here on actively denigrates the American Innovations Dollar series, and I was on the committee that recommended it at the 2016 Mint Forum. Some people are simply fated to not ever get along with each other.

[gmarguli]

4 hours ago, VKurtB said:

BLM. Belt Loops Matter. Pull up your pants.

Don't you know that anti-saggy pants laws are institutionalized racism? There is a whole chapter on it in The Wokeness Monster: How I Stopped Thinking for Myself and Just Repeat What Others Tell Me.

 

1 hour ago, VKurtB said:

He comes on here on actively denigrates the American Innovations Dollar series, and I was on the committee that recommended it at the 2016 Mint Forum. 

Sorry, but these are horrific. Just mind-blowingly awful. The designs are bad. The choices of what to commemorate are awful. I'm going to assume that Wikipedia is not trolling me and these are real. First Patent? Annie Cannon who apparently worked on classifying the stars (apologies to the ancient Greeks and Romans). The Edison Light Bulb with no mention of Swan and ignoring the fact that Edison was a total scumbag and stole many of his ideas.Trustee's Garden? Hey, let's plant s*** and see if it grows. Septima Clark? WTF does she have to do with innovators? 

Edited September 10, 2020 by gmarguli

[VKurtB]

2 minutes ago, gmarguli said:

Don't you know that anti-saggy pants laws are institutionalized racism? There is a whole chapter on it in The Wokeness Monster: How I Stopped Thinking for Myself and Just Repeat What Others Tell Me.

 

Sorry, but these are horrific. Just mind-blowingly awful. The designs are bad. The choices of what to commemorate are awful. I'm going to assume that Wikipedia is not trolling me and these are real. First Patent? Annie Cannon who apparently worked on classifying the stars (apologies to the ancient Greeks and Romans). The Edison Light Bulb with no mention of Swan and ignoring the fact that Edison was a total scumbag and stole many of his ideas.Trustee's Garden? Hey, let's plant s*** and see if it grows. Septima Clark? WTF does she have to do with innovators? 

The states all made those choices, both and what and how to honor them. No federal input at all OTHER THAN help from the CCAC in choosing from designs submitted. The Pennsylvania one came down to the Salk Polio Vaccine or the Pennsylvania Turnpike. I had hoped Delaware would choose nylon. Imagine the naughty possibilities.

[Henri Charriere]

On 9/9/2020 at 10:45 PM, Conder101 said:

This question AGAIN!  (Sorry but this question comes up frequently , and the three forums I;m on I'm sure I have seen it at least six times so far this year.)

The answer can be found in the legislation that authorized the state quarters way back in 1995, and again in the legislation authorizing the ATB quarters which was either 2007 or 2008.  At the end of the series the obv will revert to the original 1932 design by Flannagan.  On the reverse will be a depiction of Washington crossing the Delaware.  This will be the new permanent design.  The design for the reverse has already been selected.

....no legislation has been approved yet but there has been suggested a commemorative reverse redesign for all the coins for the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence in 2026 (probably one years only)....

Legislation, appropriation, design contests and engraving all take time. The 250th anniversary sestercentennial of the signing of the Declaration of Independence would be a perfect opportunity to resurrect some old classic designs, for both coin, currency -- and even stamps. 

[VKurtB]

11 hours ago, Quintus Arrius said:

Legislation, appropriation, design contests and engraving all take time. The 250th anniversary sestercentennial of the signing of the Declaration of Independence would be a perfect opportunity to resurrect some old classic designs, for both coin, currency -- and even stamps. 

It takes nowhere near as long as you think. It takes the will to work across the aisle, and that’s in short supply.

[RWB]

Next will be the "State and Territory Annelids."

[VKurtB]

The Mint management, now of BOTH political parroties (See what I did there?) have convinced themselves that the “People“, whoever they are, absolutely LOVE these types of series. It’s hard to get them doing only one denomination at the same time this way. I view getting them to limit this to only a dollar coin as the best we’re ever again going to see. 

[Henri Charriere]

1 hour ago, VKurtB said:

The Mint management, now of BOTH political parroties (See what I did there?) have convinced themselves that the “People“, whoever they are, absolutely LOVE these types of series. It’s hard to get them doing only one denomination at the same time this way. I view getting them to limit this to only a dollar coin as the best we’re ever again going to see. 

To resuscitate a hobby, you have to think Big. I like what the USPS has done with stamps -- even throwing in a 32-cent triangular Clipper (Pacific 97) ship and that now 2-Dollar "Inverted Jenny" circa 1918.

What we have with coins, to borrow from N.J.'s former Gov. Kean, is a "failure of imagination." All three hobbies -- coins, currency and stamps, can be revived with sweeping across-the-board changes. I don't trust the generations after mine (baby boomers) to get it right.  That's why I suggested revisiting the classics. To-ga! To-ga! TO-GA!!!

Edited September 11, 2020 by Quintus Arrius
Delete letter

[World Colonial]

2 hours ago, Quintus Arrius said:

To resuscitate a hobby, you have to think Big. I like what the USPS has done with stamps -- even throwing in a 32-cent triangular Clipper (Pacific 97) ship and that now 2-Dollar "Inverted Jenny" circa 1918.

What we have with coins, to borrow from N.J.'s former Gov. Kean, is a "failure of imagination." All three hobbies -- coins, currency and stamps, can be revived with sweeping across-the-board changes. I don't trust the generations after mine (baby boomers) to get it right.  That's why I suggested revisiting the classics. To-ga! To-ga! TO-GA!!!

I wouldn't describe the coin hobby in the US as in trouble.  I'm not sure anyone is any position to measure it accurately.

I also don't believe the US Mint can do anything to noticeably increase interest and while it's my opinion that the seemingly endless numismatic mediocrity they put out adversely impacts the price level of a noticeable proportion of lower to mid-priced US coinage, not sure it's a negative either.  South African collectors sometimes say the same thing and I have repeated this message, since both mints follow the same business model.

These series are just another gimmick.  The SQ program was a big success mostly due to the novelty factor; there had been no material change in circulating coinage designs my entire life.

Since 1999, the quarter changes every few months and the cent and nickel had numerous changes.  Dollars change regularly but don't even circulate.  How many US collectors (as it sure isn't hardly anyone else) even bother to keep track of most much less all of this stuff?  

I don't believe it does much of anything to promote interest in collecting as too much change (pun intended) is only marginally better than none prior to 1999.  I presume I'll get disagreement on this as it can't be proved one way or the other but anecdotal evidence better demonstrates that existing collectors don't find the designs attractive or themes interesting.  From those who measure the health of the "hobby" by the price level, it's evident that attracting collectors through NCLT is a lot more important, as these people are far more profitable customers.

Retreading classic designs is unlikely to make much difference either.  People ultimately either like collecting enough or they don't.  There are far more recreational alternatives for the public's time and money than when US collecting was supposed to have been at peak popularity.  That's my first explanation for any decreased interest.

[bsshog40]

I don't know why they keep changing things to peak interests while the economy moves towards a cashless society. 

[Henri Charriere]

It seems to me one way the U.S. Mint can increase collector interest is by dispensing with its line of "seemingly endless numismatic mediocrity."

Then again, what percentage of the U.S. population (333 million) has numismatic inclinations?

Anybody remember the 1984 square quarter [which I only just now discovered has since been slabbed]? That's what I think I am going to do.  Make my own coins and currency. Ars longa, vita brevis!

 

[VKurtB]

16 hours ago, World Colonial said:

I wouldn't describe the coin hobby in the US as in trouble.  I'm not sure anyone is any position to measure it accurately.

I also don't believe the US Mint can do anything to noticeably increase interest and while it's my opinion that the seemingly endless numismatic mediocrity they put out adversely impacts the price level of a noticeable proportion of lower to mid-priced US coinage, not sure it's a negative either.  South African collectors sometimes say the same thing and I have repeated this message, since both mints follow the same business model.

These series are just another gimmick.  The SQ program was a big success mostly due to the novelty factor; there had been no material change in circulating coinage designs my entire life.

Since 1999, the quarter changes every few months and the cent and nickel had numerous changes.  Dollars change regularly but don't even circulate.  How many US collectors (as it sure isn't hardly anyone else) even bother to keep track of most much less all of this stuff?  

I don't believe it does much of anything to promote interest in collecting as too much change (pun intended) is only marginally better than none prior to 1999.  I presume I'll get disagreement on this as it can't be proved one way or the other but anecdotal evidence better demonstrates that existing collectors don't find the designs attractive or themes interesting.  From those who measure the health of the "hobby" by the price level, it's evident that attracting collectors through NCLT is a lot more important, as these people are far more profitable customers.

Retreading classic designs is unlikely to make much difference either.  People ultimately either like collecting enough or they don't.  There are far more recreational alternatives for the public's time and money than when US collecting was supposed to have been at peak popularity.  That's my first explanation for any decreased interest.

Whichever way Congress and/or the Mint would go, in order to please some current numismatists, it would have to some combination of a homage to history, possibly rare, and hopefully, for some odd reason, have silver in it. Those are not going to happen. History is now taught in schools as something evil.

[World Colonial]

2 hours ago, VKurtB said:

Whichever way Congress and/or the Mint would go, in order to please some current numismatists, it would have to some combination of a homage to history, possibly rare, and hopefully, for some odd reason, have silver in it. Those are not going to happen. History is now taught in schools as something evil.

Yes, makes sense.  My post was long, but it's my opinion that anyone who is looking to the US Mint (or any other mint) to "rescue" the hobby has got it backwards. 

[World Colonial]

17 hours ago, bsshog40 said:

I don't know why they keep changing things to peak interests while the economy moves towards a cashless society. 

The best explanation I can think of is that they are acting like a private business maximizing profits.  Especially with NCLT but also with circulating coinage.

Recently in replying to a thread ATS, I looked at US Mint sales data covering proof sets, mint sets, bags and boxes of rolls. 

it's the last one that sticks out to me.  Maybe it's coin roll hunters looking for condition census TPG grades, errors and die varieties who mostly dump the leftovers after they search it.  I don't see how many dealers are buying it for resale.  There aren't ever going to be enough collectors who will want this volume much above face value, as it's tens to hundreds of thousands for each coin at minimum.  It's far too common, will never be scarce in any timeframe which matters to anyone buying it now, and there is no reason to believe it's preference will noticeably change either.

[World Colonial]

16 hours ago, Quintus Arrius said:

Then again, what percentage of the U.S. population (333 million) has numismatic inclinations?

I have guesstimated 2MM active collectors but it depends upon someone's definition of "collector".

I have no idea if the number has been increasing or decreasing, but I'm confident the proportion has been shrinking and will continue to do so.  It's shrunk as a recreational activity due to more numerous competing alternatives which has only been partially been offset by financially motivated buying.

The proportion will continue to shrink because the demographic groups who are projected to account for most or even all population growth (per US Census Bureau forecasts) have a much lower propensity to collect or even none at all.

It is likely to be even worse particularly for the coins most US collectors have collected in the last 90+ years because a much larger proportion of future collectors will have little if any cultural connection to this coinage whatsoever.

[Henri Charriere]

1 hour ago, World Colonial said:

....but it's my opinion that anyone who is looking to the US Mint (or any other mint) to "rescue" the hobby has got it backwards. 

For the record, I became disenchanted with "the hobby," not long after JFK's body lay in a catafalque.  I now accept that one cannot rescue anything beyond resuscitation.  If embrace the "change" means embrace the "clad,"  sorry, I'm not buying.  (Time to get back to work. Now, where's my slide ruler, protractor and No. 2 leads...?)