EagleRJO

Not as far as Federal laws (18 US §485 and 15 US §2101), interpretations by Federal courts, the Treasury Dept, Secret Service and US Mint is concerned. Look it up So the Moonlight Mint and Dan Carr are producing counterfeits, then the US Mint asks Dan to design several coins for them. Yea right, and I have a bridge to sell you.

How do we set this up as a sticky topic?

The US Mint is okay with what Dan Carr is producing, as they are not considered counterfeits by them. Even though he was already producing these overstrikes, the US Mint asked Dan Carr to submit an official finalist design for the new Sacagawea dollar, and he actually designed the 2001 New York and 2001 Rhode Island state quarters for the US Mint. I think how the Treasury Dept. views the overstrikes/tokens really ends the debate about if these are "counterfeits". Also AANACS will authenticate and grade the Dan Carr overstrike tokens/coins, and the funny thing is that there actually are unauthorized copies or "counterfeits" of his coins. 😜 http://www.moonlightmint.com/fakes.htm

Current spot hovering around $1,650 times 0.9685 ounces of gold for a Saint would be $1,600 plus that $100 would be a $1,700 hammer price you noted, plus a 10% BP at GC would be about $1,850. But they have been going for around or over $2,000 so I am taking a pass for now and will see what they are going for after the winter, and how much cash I have left over after filling holes in my Morgan collection and heating oil plus electric prices skyrocketing. But since I have a bunch of more modern gold bullion coins I may switch to first adding some gold Imdian head half eagles which I like more..

Just an FYI per Rod Gillis from ANA for grading you are suppose to initially just look at both sides of a coin using good lighting and no magnification to assess an initial grade, and then use a 5x to 10x magnification to check that as well as possible impairment. And then only use further magnification (e.g 30x to 40x) to check markers, possible rub marks from color changes, toning, etc. I think that approach makes sense (naturally with Rod) as you are really training yourself to asses a grade just looking at a coin. Similar approach with pics of a coin and not zooming in initially, although you are supposed to have multiple pics at different angles.

I do have two of the Moonlight Mint tokens, and they were a little more than a comparable common date BU grade coin struck by the US mint, and some go for quite a lot. There is a very high demand for these overstrikes/tokens in general and they usually sell out pretty quickly unless significantly overpriced. As I'm sure you know there is some controversy about these overstrike pieces or "tokens" and if they comply with applicable federal laws. Most, including me, believe they do comply with these laws. But there are some that do not.

I will admit that as I contiue with this hobby I am starting to "treasure hunt" more for valuable coins that I am collecting, like certain VAM's for Morgans (e.g. "spitting" or "happy feather" eagles) and older half dollars (e.g. "ulgy 3's" and toned ones), as well as continuing to look for errors or varieties with pocket change and rolls, which I have been doing for a while. I even have coin mats with most of the very rare errors or varieties printed on them for certain change or roll coins. But of course I have never "hit the jackpot" by finding a very rare and valuable coin, and that is not an expectation or primary reason for collecting the coins. I think the "problem" is with click-bait get rich quick vids. Most have no clue or are misleading, and are just trying to make money by maximizing views.

@WatchtowerI would also recommend reviewing the following thread which discusses additional coin resources ... https://boards.ngccoin.com/topic/428817-resources-for-new-collectors/#comment-9817530

There is a thread discussing having a sticky topic, maybe with the NGC Glossary, a link to Sandon's "resources" thread, and a few infographics like the doubled die one. Also, I do still use my scope occasionally to check hard to see markers and toning. I agree it looks a little curved, but at least it does label it as a "step". It is the best one I have found for MD vs DD, but I'm hesitant to do a photoshop correction since it's a credited infographic, and MD may actually leave somewhat of a sloped appearance on coins at the base of the "shelf" from movement of dies as a coin is struck.

I agree with Sandon that beginning from scratch with a glossary is prolly a non-starter. Maybe start with a link to the NGC one and just add further definitions as needed (or ask NGC for an update), as well as a link to Sandon's "resources" thread Plus, I would include the coin term graphic I posted above as well as the following on doubling and a 1982 Lincoln Cent which are very common questions.

They are clueless at the NYT, even though I would agree that bullion bars/coins is a distinct "asset class". What does the WSJ say?

Many sellers on eBay are in fact using them (both slabbed and raw coins from my own personal experience and communicating wilth sellers), and prolly quite a few buyers on eBay and auction sites as they are mostly PCG$ slabs going for stupid prices often. NGC slabbed coins have been going for more reasonable prices. Also, I would have been okay with a hammer price around $75 to $100 over spot with a Saint being slightly less than 1 troy ounce.

I agree it looks like machine or "shelf" doubling. The attached may help the op with confirmation, having the coin in-hand, that the doubled part of the mark and letters appears to be lower and have a shelf like appearance. It does look like a "far date", but a VAM-5 with a doubled die CC mark is out. It's likely a VAM-10/10A which is another far date VAM from this site ... http://www.vamworld.com/wiki/1884-CC_VAMs The pics are blurry and I'm just on my phone for a few days, so I can't really tell if the toning has good color progression or pull-away, which is better to check with the coin in-hand anyway. I would check that as well as check that the variety indicators are present from VamWorld. Bottom line is I don't think it would be worth it having a TPG identify the variety.

There are also all kinds of things you can check out with your new toy also like a strand of hair, bugs, etc. I went a little nvts when I first got my scope, including being able to see all kinds of things on my coins. After that I only get it out to check specific things with coins.

@JT2you forgot coins! I would consider those an asset (but usually not an "investment")

@MSGT_PThe NGC price guide includes values for many of the VAM's which, along with auction results from Great Collections or Heritage Auctions, can assist in figuring out if it's worthwhile to have a TPG attribute the VAM's. https://www.ngccoin.com/price-guide/united-states/dollars/49/ Also if you have questions about any particular VAM's you can post clear pics of both sides with your question as there are several active members familiar with those. But, some are difficult to ID without the coin in hand.

[Duck]

The I-Series bonds don't have a classic "maturity" like the older paper savings bonds (e.g. doubles or reaches face value in 20 yrs). They are issued for whatever amount you choose (up to $15k) and earn interest for the 30 yr term or maximum life of the bonds. You can get up to $10k outright (electronic) and another $5k through returns (paper) per year. I look at it as a way to park excess cash and at least earn a little above the inflation rate (i.e. the total rate for I-Series is a fixed rate set when you buy them plus a variable inflation rate).

About these coins it was said the 1885 Morgan was an end coin from a 20 yr old roll. Some questions about that. Where did this roll come from? Was it an older style grey colored paper with crimped ends that would leave most of one side exposed? And was the 1886 Morgan from the other end?

Yea, but he did trash everybody who thought it was a no/details grade due to issues, so a wash.

Sounds like "speculation" to me! I did notice that both of the big boys are dropping their guide prices, with NGC at a more realistic $1,950 for common Saints now, but still over-valued imo. Savvy dealers are also lowering prices to clear stale inventory (e.g. several LCS's and larger online dealers like Apmex). However, PCG$ still has their head stuck in the sand at over $2,500 for common Saints as well as across the board out of touch values.

All the markets (stocks, bonds, precious metals) are trash right now, which is why I went with the I-Series for some extra cash I had in a statement account which was essentially loosing money due to high inflation.

There is a pretty comprehensive NGC coin collecting glossary here ... https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/2202/Glossary/ Plus there is a thread on Resources for newer collectors by@Sandonhere ... https://boards.ngccoin.com/topic/428817-resources-for-new-collectors/#comment-9817530 Also, I like the attached diagram of a coin, which I think is a little better as there is more info. Maybe these could be combined into one thread and pinned.

You can cash in the I-Series after 12 months and only lose the prior 3 months interest if before 5 years.

I put excess cash into I-Series bonds at 9.62%