Can Grading Company's Start Adding A #Number Grade to UNC Details Coins? 1 1

[Captain Murder]

I believe adding a 0-70 numerical grade to UNC Details coins would make them easier to buy and sell. Obviously the coin was tampered with, but what would it grade if it didn't matter? Some of the prettiest coins I have ever seen are Toned UNC Details, and deserve there #Number to go along with the UNC Label.

[Moxie15]

Of course they could. It looks as if they have no desire to open such a box, and I am not sure I blame them.I think it would be better to put a net grade than a 'what would be if' grade. That would create a whole other host of difficulties so it is ptobably best as Unc details cleaned etc.

[Coinbuf]

On 4/3/2024 at 2:17 PM, murder69 said:

I believe adding a 0-70 numerical grade to UNC Details coins would make them easier to buy and sell. Obviously the coin was tampered with, but what would it grade if it didn't matter? Some of the prettiest coins I have ever seen are Toned UNC Details, and deserve there #Number to go along with the UNC Label.

Grading is already highly subjective, TPG's do not (and should not) want to open themselves up to that kind of problem.    I personally think it is just fine the way it is, leave it to the market to determine the price of problem coins not the TPG's.

[Henri Charriere]

In deference to your User Name, I believe it would be prudent for me to abstain from formally responding.  On the other hand, I should like to suggest you rid yourself of all problem coins which always seem to demand an explanation, and direct your attention, if I may, to problem-free coins at the upper-grade tier you seem to be partial to.  Capiche?  

[Jason Abshier]

ANACS always put a numerical number grade along with detailed problem on slab …. IMO ANACS was and still is most toughest on cleaned coins I see tons and tons of ANACS coins detailed cleaned while PCGS and NGC will let some slide and straight grade … cleaned coins usually don’t sell very well , unless they are a key date or scarce coin they will exchange and sell …. Sadly there’s a lot cleaned coins out there which is very very common and PCGS alone detected like 16,000+ of them within last 30 days of grading out of 259,000 coins they graded in last 30 days 

[Henri Charriere]

On 4/4/2024 at 5:53 PM, Jason Abshier said:

.... PCGS alone detected like 16,000+ of them within last 30 days of grading out of 259,000 coins they graded in last 30 days 

This is by far one of the most interesting statistics I have ever come across in the field of numismatics, bar none.  

[Jason Abshier]

@Henri Charriere have a look at the link shows you how many coins PCGS graded within the last 30 days 

https://www.pcgs.com/statistics

[Captain Murder]

I still think it is the fair thing to do to add a # number grade, I mean they're real coins, not counterfeit, they deserve a grade regardless. 

 

[Henri Charriere]

On 4/4/2024 at 8:13 PM, Jason Abshier said:

@Henri Charriere have a look at the link shows you how many coins PCGS graded within the last 30 days 

https://www.pcgs.com/statistics

Sorry, Jason, you couldn't pay me to do that.  In my mind's eye, you are unquestionably the most brilliant person I have had the privilege of ever interacting with, on or off any platform.  

[zadok]

On 4/4/2024 at 5:53 PM, Jason Abshier said:

ANACS always put a numerical number grade along with detailed problem on slab …. IMO ANACS was and still is most toughest on cleaned coins I see tons and tons of ANACS coins detailed cleaned while PCGS and NGC will let some slide and straight grade … cleaned coins usually don’t sell very well , unless they are a key date or scarce coin they will exchange and sell …. Sadly there’s a lot cleaned coins out there which is very very common and PCGS alone detected like 16,000+ of them within last 30 days of grading out of 259,000 coins they graded in last 30 days 

...as one would expect no surprises there....

[RWB]

They already do --- they call it "MS-62" regardless of the size of truck that ran over it.

[Coinbuf]

On 4/4/2024 at 5:25 PM, murder69 said:

I still think it is the fair thing to do to add a # number grade, I mean they're real coins, not counterfeit, they deserve a grade regardless. 

 

You could always start your own grading service and offer this service.

[Jason Abshier]

On 4/4/2024 at 8:25 PM, murder69 said:

I still think it is the fair thing to do to add a # number grade, I mean they're real coins, not counterfeit, they deserve a grade regardless. 

 

At one time grading companies used to body bag coins for cleaning , alter surfaces and so on …. Problem was sleazy people would take body bagged coin out on eBay or something pass it off to another sorry collector they would send it in too it would come back body bagged again !!! So in theory it’s somewhat a good idea showing a coin is detailed sitting in holder keeps it from spreading around as a raw coin … not saying they can’t take it out of holder and still pass it on as raw coins … when it comes back detailed they mostly accept it and try to sell it , sometimes budget buyers buy up a lot detailed coins but the common stuff nobody wants them regardless of grade number on them or not 

Edited April 5 by Jason Abshier

[VKurtB]

On 4/4/2024 at 7:25 PM, murder69 said:

I still think it is the fair thing to do to add a # number grade, I mean they're real coins, not counterfeit, they deserve a grade regardless. 

 

Actually, no. They do not.

[Mike Meenderink]

On 4/4/2024 at 7:17 PM, Coinbuf said:

You could always start your own grading service and offer this service

MURDERED COIN GRADING CO.   Might work ....😆 

Edited April 6 by Mike Meenderink

[Mike Meenderink]

My comment is that a grade on a coin is nothing more than a reasonably educated subjective opinion of the actual condition of a coin. A coin with damage or cleaning is not numerically graded because it is considered impaired. If the coin is to damaged it won't be encapsulated at all. Many coins with very minor impairments get  Details grade. This does not always immediately make the coins worthless. Many years of experience are needed to accurately value Details coins. Some coins are still worth buying in Details but that is in the eye of the beholder. So to wrap up just because its Details doesn't always mean its junk its just a real phorensic evaluation of the coin.

[ldhair]

I'm happy with the way the services are doing it now. Much better than it was years ago. The slab offers good protection and the label gives you a good idea of what is going on with the coin. A number grade is not needed.

[Dave1384]

On 4/4/2024 at 9:45 PM, RWB said:

They already do --- they call it "MS-62" regardless of the size of truck that ran over it.

Ridiculous. And frankly I’m surprised , coming from you. It’s a lie. 
Unless you’re in sarc mode…

Edited April 7 by Dave1384

[VKurtB]

On 4/6/2024 at 7:15 PM, Dave1384 said:

Ridiculous. And frankly I’m surprised , coming from you. It’s a lie. 
Unless you’re in sarc mode…

He is. Trust me on that. But it has an element of truth, albeit a tiny one. 

[Henri Charriere]

On 4/6/2024 at 8:15 PM, Dave1384 said:

Ridiculous. And frankly I’m surprised , coming from you. It’s a lie. 
Unless you’re in sarc mode…

Aw pipe down!  What a waste of a perfectly good joke!  No wonder I have been kicked off this Board more times than I can shake a stick at!  Now, take @Mike Meenderink 's rendering of forensic, a few posts upthread, as phorensic.  I believe he did that intentionally to get my dander up!  But I certainly wouldn't give him the satisfaction of knowing he subtly reached out and touched me. No siree, not me!!!  

[J P M]

On 4/4/2024 at 5:53 PM, Jason Abshier said:

ANACS always put a numerical number grade along with detailed problem on slab …. IMO ANACS was and still is most toughest on cleaned coins I see tons and tons of ANACS coins detailed cleaned while PCGS and NGC will let some slide and straight grade … cleaned coins usually don’t sell very well , unless they are a key date or scarce coin they will exchange and sell …. Sadly there’s a lot cleaned coins out there which is very very common and PCGS alone detected like 16,000+ of them within last 30 days of grading out of 259,000 coins they graded in last 30 days 

If these numbers are close than PCGS and NGC on an average grade over 1000 coins an hour. That must be a tough environment to work in and meet a quota.

[Jason Abshier]

On 4/7/2024 at 7:59 AM, J P M said:

If these numbers are close than PCGS and NGC on an average grade over 1000 coins an hour. That must be a tough environment to work in and meet a quota.

I’m not sure how many coins NGC graded within last 30days I only gotten the results from PCGS … yeah it does sound extreme …. They have US graders who specialize in gold and silver classic coinage , they have graders who specialize in world coinage , as well as medals and Exonumia…. It takes a huge group of graders in different sectors to push those coins through process just give you idea how big they are …. 

[Mike Meenderink]

On 4/7/2024 at 3:16 AM, Henri Charriere said:

Now, take @Mike Meenderink 's rendering of forensic, a few posts upthread, as phorensic.

Stupid spell check

[Moxie15]

A few years back I read several articles that all said it rook 6 seconds to grade the average coin. Ten coins per minute 600 per hour 4800 per day. Figure 22 working days means 105,600 per month per grader. Three graders should be able to hit the 259,000 number. 

I wonder how many coins are submitted per month.

[zadok]

On 4/11/2024 at 3:12 PM, Moxie15 said:

A few years back I read several articles that all said it rook 6 seconds to grade the average coin. Ten coins per minute 600 per hour 4800 per day. Figure 22 working days means 105,600 per month per grader. Three graders should be able to hit the 259,000 number. 

I wonder how many coins are submitted per month.

...i believe that question was already answered in one of the threads....

[Captain Murder]

On 4/11/2024 at 3:12 PM, Moxie15 said:

A few years back I read several articles that all said it rook 6 seconds to grade the average coin. Ten coins per minute 600 per hour 4800 per day. Figure 22 working days means 105,600 per month per grader. Three graders should be able to hit the 259,000 number. 

I wonder how many coins are submitted per month.

Makes sense. My submission I just got back and my morgans from last January look like they were graded once, quickly, give generic grades with no second opinion for superlatives such as high levels of sparkles in the Wreaths, star quality and percentage of high quality stars to overall number, etc. NgC grading is worth the money, but a lot of grades are unfairly low and it's not worth resubmitted. 

NGC should also Buy and Sell Coins.

[Captain Murder]

On 4/6/2024 at 3:40 PM, ldhair said:

I'm happy with the way the services are doing it now. Much better than it was years ago. The slab offers good protection and the label gives you a good idea of what is going on with the coin. A number grade is not needed.

If I didn't want a written grade for coin value I wouldn't even submit. I try to purchase certain grades of coins raw, hoping that when they come back they are that same grade or higher. Takes all the fun out of collecting when u feel as if your coin received an unfair low grade. And the surface was damaged at NGC on purpose to lower grade.

[Captain Murder]

On 4/6/2024 at 11:10 AM, Mike Meenderink said:

MURDERED COIN GRADING CO.   Might work ....😆 

I sell coins, that's it. I would work for PCGS CAC version provided by NGC. CAC is the investment wave of the future. N.G.C Numeric Grade Check by NGC - Jaymurdem@ eBay

[ldhair]

On 4/13/2024 at 12:46 AM, murder69 said:

Takes all the fun out of collecting when u feel as if your coin received an unfair low grade. And the surface was damaged at NGC on purpose to lower grade.

That's not true. There is no reason they would ever do that. Be careful of what you say about our host. We are only guest of this site. The words/terms you have used in this thread tell me you have much to learn about grading. Grading is an art and a science that takes many years to learn. 

I have had about a thousand coins graded over the years and use the services as a learning tool. I study the coins that come back different than what I thought they would grade. Most of the time that study teaches me why the coin received the grade it did. 

[Just Bob]

On 4/13/2024 at 12:46 AM, murder69 said:

Takes all the fun out of collecting when u feel as if your coin received an unfair low grade. 

Or, you could try to learn from the experience and see where your grading skills need improving.