Hey I'm back. 1 1

[Hammersred]

Thanks to those who didn't poke as much fun as they could at me. I get it. I'm back tho. No assumptions on super value. Just a question about an error I have only seen one of. Or maybe I just don't have the experience y'all have. Yet. So please, in the numismatic way, what the heck do I have? And what up with his nose? Is it a broadstrike?

Edited, what's up with the rim? Looks sloped.

Edited August 14, 2023 by Hammersred
Forgot to ask first question

[Hammersred]

Some less clear shots

[Hoghead515]

Looks like a very minor die chip on Roosevelts nose. They are very common. They happen alot when the dies start to wear out. 

Edited August 14, 2023 by Hoghead515

[Hammersred]

So what's the difference between that and a cud?

[Hoghead515]

A cud is where a piece of the edge of the die breaks off and leaves a big blob that connects to the rim of the coin. The metal from the planchet fills up that space where part of the die is missing. There are other members on here that will chime in eventually and explain it better than I can. 

[Hammersred]

On 8/13/2023 at 9:25 PM, Hoghead515 said:

A cud is where a piece of the edge of the die breaks off and leaves a big blob that connects to the rim of the coin. The metal from the planchet fills up that space where part of the die is missing. There are other members on here that will chime in eventually and explain it better than I can. 

Nah, freaking nailed it for me. Ty. What's up with the lower right edge\rim? It's 45°

[Just Bob]

How does the reeding look on the edge? is it consistent all the way around?

[Hammersred]

BOB! My favorite! 

The reeding is super inconsistent and nearly non existent and smooth around the 'error'

[powermad5000]

@Hoghead515 is correct. The area of the nose is a die chip common in modern high speed presses where the dies begin to wear out and small pieces break off allowing metal to flow into that empty space newly formed in the die. A cud is when the edge of the die breaks off and allows metal to flow into a larger volume of space near the rim. Cuds always involve contact with the rim. Often on cuds, especially very large ones, there will be a weakness in the details on the reverse aligned with the cud as more metal flows into the cud space and there is less available to fully flow into the spaces on the reverse die. Die chips, cracks, and cuds do not add premium to the coin (typically only extremely large cuds that affect the greater elements toward the center of the design will gain some value).

The rim of your dime is within mint tolerance in my opinion. The coin was struck maybe very slightly off center to produce a "wider" rim on one side (it is actually the same size dime off center if that makes more sense to you). As for the "angle", it may have received a slightly stronger strike than other dimes, but once again is in mint tolerances.

A broadstrike happens when the coin is struck without being in the collar. Without the collar in place the coin expands in size as there is nothing to retain the shape during the strike. I don't think your coin is broadstruck, but if you put another normal dime on top of it and the coin in question protrudes out as in the coins don't "stack" perfectly, it may have been.

Edited August 14, 2023 by powermad5000

[Just Bob]

On 8/13/2023 at 10:40 PM, Hammersred said:

BOB! My favorite! 

The reeding is super inconsistent and nearly non existent and smooth around the 'error'

Any chance you could post some clear pics of the edge - especially at LIBERTY and directly opposite? And, are the letters in LIBERTY higher than the adjacent rim?

[JT2]

looks a little off center to me that could lead to the wider rim on the liberty side.  and @Hoghead515  is correct on the die chip 

[zadok]

On 8/13/2023 at 10:25 PM, Hoghead515 said:

A cud is where a piece of the edge of the die breaks off and leaves a big blob that connects to the rim of the coin. The metal from the planchet fills up that space where part of the die is missing. There are other members on here that will chime in eventually and explain it better than I can. 

...pretty much right on, most cuds do occur adjacent to the rim, there r some that occur on the interior of the coin when the die approaches catastrophic terminal failure n portions of the die literally fall out, these r however pretty rare but i have seen n owned a few over the years, usually in the earlier US series when die supply was often critical n used long past their shelf life, i guess u could call such a cud a really big die chip....

[Hammersred]

On 8/13/2023 at 10:50 PM, Just Bob said:

Any chance you could post some clear pics of the edge - especially at LIBERTY and directly opposite? And, are the letters in LIBERTY higher than the adjacent rim?

You betcha.

 

I think it is, the micrometer says it is. And the L I are kinda gnarly, they slope right into the slide . I would think, environmental, but just in that spot? It's not a dryer coin for sure. You see that ding right above E R ?

[Hammersred]

Blurry I know, but, doubling? I am rookie, I see it in TRUST, W, N

 

 

Edited August 15, 2023 by Hammersred
Add pics

[Hoghead515]

I cant tell a whole lot by the pics but, looks like it may have a little mechanical doubling. Its not the true doubling. Its often caused by die detiriation. Its also very common. Hope I spelled that right. As most has seen on here Im not the best speller. I know some pretty fancy words I can use on here sometimes but, I dont because I dont know how to spell them. 

Edited August 15, 2023 by Hoghead515

[Hammersred]

On 8/15/2023 at 4:36 PM, Hoghead515 said:

I cant tell a whole lot by the pics but, looks like it may have a little mechanical doubling. Its not the true doubling. Its often caused by die detiriation. Hope I spelled that right. As most has seen on here Im not the best speller. I know some pretty fancy words I can use on here sometimes but, I dont because I dont know how to spell them. 

So what's the visual difference between mechanical and true doubling? 

[Hoghead515]

On 8/15/2023 at 5:39 PM, Hammersred said:

So what's the visual difference between mechanical and true doubling? 

Mechanical doubling is shelf like doubling and can be pretty dramatic sometimes. True doubling usually has split serifs and widens the letters sometimes. Ill tag @EagleRJO. Hes got a diagram that shows thr difference in them. Whenever he comes back on here Im sure he wouldnt care to share it with you. @Sandon may have it saved also. They are better at explaining things more than I am. 

Edited August 15, 2023 by Hoghead515

[EagleRJO]

On 8/15/2023 at 5:44 PM, Hoghead515 said:

Ill tag @EagleRJO. Hes got a diagram that shows thr difference in them.

The attached infographic is from the following topic, which also has a few links about doubling and other errors/varieties ... https://boards.ngccoin.com/topic/430263-basic-resources-glossary-for-those-posting-questions/

On 8/15/2023 at 5:44 PM, Hoghead515 said:

Mechanical doubling is shelf like doubling and can be pretty dramatic sometimes. True doubling usually has split serifs and widens the letters sometimes.

True doubling is usually just as high as the doubled elements, which is best to look for with the coin in-hand, and also look for notching at corners per the doubling infographic.

Edited August 15, 2023 by EagleRJO

[Sandon]

On 8/15/2023 at 5:39 PM, Hammersred said:

So what's the visual difference between mechanical and true doubling? 

   Your question would be better phrased as, "What is the difference between mechanical doubling (also known as machine doubling and strike doubling) and die doubling"?

    NGC has a good article describing this difference at Double Dies vs. Machine Doubling | NGC (ngccoin.com).  The significance of the difference is that a coin struck from a doubled die may be worth a premium, especially if it is prominent enough to be popular with collectors, whereas a coin with mechanical doubling isn't worth a premium to a knowledgeable collector.  Another form of "worthless doubling" is die deterioration doubling, which presents itself as a weak or ghostly secondary image due to a worn and eroded die.