Lowball coins
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Can anyone explain how clad Kennedy's and Ikes get legitimately worn to Poor and Fair condition? Is it because they circulated so heavily (sarcasm)? Will someone say it was a "pocket piece", and the owner played pocket pool 24/7 for 30 years? How can these things get certified as legitimate?

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Gambling machines took a toll before casinos switched to paper chits. But, you're right to be skeptical about any modern coin with extensive wear. Rock tumblers plus encouragement from flat grinders, help a lot.

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Rock tumbler and very fine grit media, then a little artificial aging. 

I have never seen any clad coin or post 1960 nickel in change that would grade worse than VG.  If people are going to pay ridiculous amounts for low ball coins, somebody will find a way to supply the market.  You can't turn a VF coin into an MS, but you can turn it into a PO-01

Too much cynicism, too little time

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On 4/28/2022 at 11:25 AM, Treeman said:

Can anyone explain how clad Kennedy's and Ikes get legitimately worn to Poor and Fair condition? Is it because they circulated so heavily (sarcasm)? Will someone say it was a "pocket piece", and the owner played pocket pool 24/7 for 30 years? How can these things get certified as legitimate?

I've often thought about that as well.  Do you have any you can post pictures of?  I have several of those clad Kennedy's you're talking about.

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On 4/28/2022 at 11:20 AM, Oldhoopster said:

Rock tumbler and very fine grit media, then a little artificial aging. 

I have never seen any clad coin or post 1960 nickel in change that would grade worse than VG.  If people are going to pay ridiculous amounts for low ball coins, somebody will find a way to supply the market.  You can't turn a VF coin into an MS, but you can turn it into a PO-01

Too much cynicism, too little time

The more cynical you are, the more you understand about the coin market. 

Edited by VKurtB
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On 4/28/2022 at 1:04 PM, zadok said:

...i have been looking for a 2022 silver eagle in PO-01, if i can find one labelled first day of issue i want to give it to Hoghead for his birthday....

Thank you my friend. If u really want one I can probably make you one. I can think of a few ways.  I dont know about the FDOI label tho. Speaking of birthdays. I got one coming up in a few days. May 15. First day of frog gigging season. That helps me remember my birthday. lol

Edited by Hoghead515
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On 4/28/2022 at 4:09 PM, bsshog40 said:

I've been carrying the same 1879 morgan in my pocket since 2007 and it ain't even close to PO1. Lol

Can you tell that its worn very much since you started? Ive been curious. Ive got a Morgan that someone tooled on and been thinking about packing it as a pocket piece. 

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On 4/30/2022 at 2:41 PM, VKurtB said:

The entire idea of lowball collecting is so bizarre that I can’t even think about it without getting really angry. It is the antithesis of this hobby. 

Its definately not my thing. I try to get the nicest coins I can afford. I do actually want to start packing a pocket piece to see how much it wears down over time. Its already damaged. One of the very first I ever bought when I started collecting. I got burned on it. Cant tell from the picture but it looks like someone took a pick or something sharp and scratched at the gouged out area behind the eye. 1904 OLumii_20220430_151136996.jpg.4598ab3e2051f3de4b1485603600e346.jpgLumii_20220430_150718087.thumb.jpg.971de971bbdafe01d1d7005b6e7c0ca2.jpg

Edited by Hoghead515
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On 4/30/2022 at 1:59 PM, Hoghead515 said:

Its definately not my thing. I try to get the nicest coins I can afford. I do actually want to start packing a pocket piece to see how much it wears down over time. Its already damaged. 

I own an ASE that somebody else supposedly used as a pocket piece for years. It’s still I’d say about an XF. Creating a PO-1 HAS TO INVOLVE a whole stinking bunch of intentional damage. 

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On 4/30/2022 at 1:59 PM, Hoghead515 said:

Its definately not my thing. I try to get the nicest coins I can afford. I do actually want to start packing a pocket piece to see how much it wears down over time. Its already damaged. One of the very first I ever bought when I started collecting. I got burned on it. Cant tell from the picture but it looks like someone took a pick or something sharp and scratched at the gouged out area behind the eye. 1904 OLumii_20220430_150718087.thumb.jpg.971de971bbdafe01d1d7005b6e7c0ca2.jpg

Brain tumor surgery. 

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On 4/30/2022 at 3:10 PM, VKurtB said:

I own an ASE that somebody else supposedly used as a pocket piece for years. It’s still I’d say about an XF. Creating a PO-1 HAS TO INVOLVE a whole stinking bunch of intentional damage. 

Its hard telling how many of those have been intentionally rubbed down. Even if they are not they are still not my thing. All I see are worn out ugly coins. It amazed me while back when I seen how much people paid for one at auction. I remember making a thread about it to see what I was missing. Thats fine if others enjoy them but I just dont get it. I could buy something very nice with the price they paid for it. Wish I knew people who liked worn out sox and underwear. Im sitting on a gold mine of those. lol

Edited by Hoghead515
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On 4/30/2022 at 2:27 PM, Hoghead515 said:

Its hard telling how many of those have been intentionally rubbed down. Even if they are not they are still not my thing. All I see are worn out ugly coins. It amazed me while back when I seen how much people paid for one at auction. I remember making a thread about it to see what I was missing. Thats fine if others enjoy them but I just dont get it. I could buy something very nice with the price they paid for it. 

Some people like bashing their heads against brick walls, too. That doesn’t mean brick masons or neurologists should encourage it. 

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On 4/30/2022 at 2:59 PM, Hoghead515 said:

 

Its definately not my thing. I try to get the nicest coins I can afford. I do actually want to start packing a pocket piece to see how much it wears down over time. Its already damaged. One of the very first I ever bought when I started collecting. I got burned on it. Cant tell from the picture but it looks like someone took a pick or something sharp and scratched at the gouged out area behind the eye. 1904 OLumii_20220430_151136996.jpg.4598ab3e2051f3de4b1485603600e346.jpgLumii_20220430_150718087.thumb.jpg.971de971bbdafe01d1d7005b6e7c0ca2.jpg

Could that also be some type of lamination? 

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Hog, VKurtB-

I understand your thoughts and feeling about these lowball or PO-1 coins.  There are some guys (not me) that only collect coins with holes in them. There are also guys that collect coins that have been make into tools.   I think the "challenge" for these PO-1 collectors, is finding a coin with just enough meat on the bone to identify it with a date.  Plus being straight graded, problem free with not damage.  

 

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On 4/30/2022 at 2:59 PM, Hoghead515 said:

 

Its definately not my thing. I try to get the nicest coins I can afford. I do actually want to start packing a pocket piece to see how much it wears down over time. Its already damaged. One of the very first I ever bought when I started collecting. I got burned on it. Cant tell from the picture but it looks like someone took a pick or something sharp and scratched at the gouged out area behind the eye. 1904 OLumii_20220430_151136996.jpg.4598ab3e2051f3de4b1485603600e346.jpgLumii_20220430_150718087.thumb.jpg.971de971bbdafe01d1d7005b6e7c0ca2.jpg

...u could always just say its a chop marked morgan....porkchopped maybe?...

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Posted (edited)
On 4/30/2022 at 10:26 AM, Hoghead515 said:

Can you tell that its worn very much since you started? Ive been curious. Ive got a Morgan that someone tooled on and been thinking about packing it as a pocket piece. 

To be honest, it looks like it has only gotten shinier over time.  Lol

Edited by bsshog40
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On 4/30/2022 at 5:58 PM, tj96 said:

Could that also be some type of lamination? 

It could be. I thought maybe even a strike thru. But someone took something sharp and scratched at it. Quite a bit. 

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Posted (edited)
On 4/30/2022 at 6:13 PM, tj96 said:

Hog, VKurtB-

I understand your thoughts and feeling about these lowball or PO-1 coins.  There are some guys (not me) that only collect coins with holes in them. There are also guys that collect coins that have been make into tools.   I think the "challenge" for these PO-1 collectors, is finding a coin with just enough meat on the bone to identify it with a date.  Plus being straight graded, problem free with not damage.  

 

Some really get into it. Thats great they like those. Ive not got a thing aginst them. Its just not my thing. If I had a good chunk of money I could spend Id rather get a MS Washington or something like that. Im not the one to tell people not to collect what they like and are into. Im just saying I prefer  coins as close to mint state as I can afford. 

Edited by Hoghead515
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On 4/30/2022 at 9:30 PM, Hoghead515 said:

Some really get into it. Thats great they like those. Ive not got a thing aginst them. Its just not my thing. If I had a good chunk of money I could spend Id rather get a MS Washington or something like that. Im not the one to tell people not to collect what they like and are into. Im just saying I prefer  coins as close to mint state as I can afford. 

I understand.  There are just so many different aspects of collecting coins. 

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On 4/30/2022 at 9:39 PM, tj96 said:

I understand.  There are just so many different aspects of collecting coins. 

Yessir. Everyone likes their own thing. And thats the wonderful thing Ive found about it. Theres something for everyone to enjoy. Everyone can enjoy it no matter what kind of budget they are on. And so many types and conditions to choose from. 

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On 4/30/2022 at 9:45 PM, Hoghead515 said:

Yessir. Everyone likes their own thing. And thats the wonderful thing Ive found about it. Theres something for everyone to enjoy. Everyone can enjoy it no matter what kind of budget they are on. And so many types and conditions to choose from. 

Yes, that's very true.

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I should probably start a new thread but since the thread subject is Lowball Coins and the OP mentioned clad Kenney's, I thought I would post these.  I can't figure these out.  They are both clad.  What are your thought, damage??

 

20181215_S20181215_014-ccfopt.jpg

20181215_S20181215_015-ccfopt.jpg

S20200228_067.jpg

S20200228_023-ccfopt.jpg

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On 5/4/2022 at 5:42 PM, tj96 said:

I should probably start a new thread but since the thread subject is Lowball Coins and the OP mentioned clad Kenney's, I thought I would post these.  I can't figure these out.  They are both clad.  What are your thought, damage??

 

20181215_S20181215_014-ccfopt.jpg

20181215_S20181215_015-ccfopt.jpg

S20200228_067.jpg

S20200228_023-ccfopt.jpg

Completely phony appearance.

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On 5/4/2022 at 5:53 PM, RWB said:

Completely phony appearance.

Yes, we can all agree with that I'm sure.   I pulled them out of rolls from boxes.    I guess we can use our imagination on how to happened.   I just need a reality check that there's no way they could have come from the mint like this?  Have you ever seen test pieces like this?

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On 5/4/2022 at 6:01 PM, tj96 said:

Have you ever seen test pieces like this?

What would they be testing?

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