GoldFinger1969

But those coins are close to IMPOSSIBLE to get. If not for the actual numbers (35 Eagles, 15 1927-D's, 1* 1933) then for the prices which can only be paid by a very wealthy individual or a dumbo who wants to spend his entire IRA on a coin or coins. I'd consider the 1907 High Relief to be "rare" especially in higher-condition. Yeah, I know there are thousands available....but they can't make any more of them and thousands is not millions when you compare it to the population of many collectible nickles, dimes, quarters, and pennies. But that's just me. * For now....

You know.....it's amazing that the phrase "phony as a $3 bill" is part of our lexicon and yet there really was a $3 coin. I'll bet that 98% of Americans don't know that.

And now you know why I am the Maxwell Smart of technology.

WC and KB, you are both definitely right. There is no doubt a premium paid by folks who want to get the coin NOW and not wait a few weeks....or months.....and as for a year ? Forget about it. For many collectors -- especially those with a few $$$ -- the greater fear isn't overpaying by 10% or 25% or even 50%....it's saying a year and a half later that they should have bid higher because nothing close to what they passed on has become available since.

Totally agree. If there are enough transactions, maybe throwing out the lowest and highest sales price (2 sales prices ?) would narrow the range a bit.

1928-P....what ? Saint-Gaudens 1928 (Philadelphia)? There's so many 1928's out there, there's wide variability particularly in the lower grades below MS65.

FYI, I bought a 1923-D MS66 in an OGH at FUN a few months ago.

I haven't seen to many Saints in the OGH or Rattler holders, dating to 1995 or before. I presume you've checked HA, Stacks, and GC ? Even a common Saint in MS67 in a rattler/OGH is going to sell like it is already CAC'd. And if it has that......

Wait a second.....after gold was raised to $35/oz., the smuggling would have ended, right ? So that wouldn't have been a factor. And regardless of the price of gold, what does the Treasury care if a dealer (or even a non-dealer) is melting used gold, scrap, coins, or bars ? As long as smuggling has stopped -- which presumably it has, since the domestic price is now higher -- would they have cared what the few dealers or licensees did with various forms of gold ? They just wanted to prevent hoarding and export -- which reduced the domestic stock and by implication, the money supply.

Thanks Mark....that's interesting because I guess I just assumed that every dealer, even if they look at it as a business, have to have some emotional attachment to the hobby and "collect" at least SOME coins. But maybe not. I guess when you see all the coins passing through your inventory, maybe it's not as special to those of us who are strictly collectors.

Can the human naked eye even SEE that depth ? After a certain point, the increased resolution just isn't processed by our cones and rods.

Agreed, it's not that hard to get recent auction data from some online sources, including NGC. It's the actual CHART going back several years -- and longer -- that is very useful, IMO. That's what I liked so much about Roger's new Saints book -- a 1976-2015 price table for every year/mint.

Roger, when did gold get revalued up to $35/oz. ?

Any particular reason for the rattler ? Or is any older slab good ?

I see the same "lag" on other Saints too, WC, and they are sold pretty frequently. It looks like they have the raw data -- recent auctions -- uploaded, whatever they do to calculate price is just off. Maybe it's a smoothed monthly average or something, dunno.

What's up with the chart and numbers for the NGC Price Guide, NGC ? This is -- or could be -- a REALLY USEFUL tool for collectors and investors, especially novices. Instead the numbers are all over the place. Let's check out an MS62 1907 High Relief. Should go for about $12,000 give-or-take. But the chart has it at $19,000: https://www.ngccoin.com/price-guide/united-states/gold-double-eagles/70/history/19135/62/ I'm not sure what the algorithim is to calculate the latest prices, because I only see sales data from late-2019, but even that isn't anywhere near $19,000: https://www.ngccoin.com/auction-central/us/saint-gaudens-20-1907-1933-pscid-70/auctions/1907-high-relief-20-ms-fgrade-62-tgrade-62-coinid-19139 Am I using this tool correctly ? I don't expect it to be super-accurate, but within 5-10% shouldn't be a problem. 30-40% seems really off. I think the trend of the chart is still useful over longer periods of time, but it would be better if the end-point for the recent data was closer to reality.

Fair points, Mark.....like you said, HA doesn't set the price. But it sure is strange not to see any commentary below on ANY special or unique or pricey coin detailing the lineage, what makes it special, etc. I'm going through some of the catalogs from HA I picked up at FUN -- it's amazing what you guys have on some of those coins.

Both you guys should report back and share your information/reports. The Survey Monkey site is down....I'll try again later.

Can Heritage maybe speak up as to why a coin that has appeared twice on their system in less than 8 years is suddently worth 20-30x as much ? It does nobody any good -- including HA -- if some sucker with lots of $$$$ buys this at the asking price. BTW...it IS an asking price. It hasn't been sold for that amount. And for any coin costing over $10,000 -- let alone $100,000 -- you better have a few paragraphs below indicating something special about the coin. There's nothing there except "Learn More At The Newman Numismatic Portal."

If that book was published in 1954...and he was offering to buy (sell ?) 1930-32 Saints for only $100, that is really a ripoff. And like Roger said, he's buying numismatic coins with $33.86 worth of gold for $30, and that doesn't take into account the numismatic value. Mehl died in 1957, BTW.

Who were some coin dealers from the 1930's, 1940's, and 1950's who had good reputations for paying fair prices and not ripping off someone whose coins might be more valuable than they thought ? Any names come to mind ?

Yes, I saw that name a few times along with Parmount (I think David Akers worked there). It's fascinating to read about the gold dealers and collectors from the 1920's, 1930's, and 1940's. Israel Switt's jewelry shop is still around I think....alot of the coin collectors like Mehl and FCC Boyd had associates or themselves active in the 1950's-1970's. Do Heritage, Legend, or Great Collections trace their lineage to any of the older gold dealers as far as you know ? Clearly, Stacks is still around from 1937. Would be interested to read a book -- or maybe an internet posting, more likely -- tracing the creation and dissolution of all those classic firms including which of today's firms they may have morphed into today.

I have a 1970's Red Book for pre-1973 gold prices. I am trying to collect all current and past books which have yearly reviews on Saint-Gaudens and Liberty Double Eagle coins.

(1) Does anybody know who "Ira and Larry Goldberg" are ? Their names keep coming up in the sales records. Are they dealers or collectors ? (2) Sometimes coins didn't sell in the listings for Akers and Roger's books. Isn't that kind of strange, since they are the top-of-the-line pieces ? You would think the auction companies knew the market and their buyers and wouldn't set the reserve too high. Unless maybe the collector set an unreasonable price and the auction house had no choice but to hope for a miracle ?

Thanks Conder....Roger's book mentioned the bullion vs. coin backing of certificates and I had forgotten about it. What still is somewhat intriguing is why SanFran Saints ("S") would end up in European banks -- I would think that the Philly coinage would head across the Atlantic to Europe, and the SanFran coins (if needed) headed over to the Pacific for Asian settlements, if any. I doubt we ever ran short of Philly coins and NEEDED SanFran or Denver coins. It certainly didn't make sense cost-wise or time-wise to ship coins from SanFran or Denver over to Europe vs. Philly (unless maybe some were already shipped to New York ?).