GoldFinger1969

Got it...so Hub Varieties is the same as types. Thanks, Roger.

Are there variations in production, survival, or financial numbers ?

This is another reason why I really want the key Commentary sections on my smartphone if not the entire book...not only do I not have to go running back to my library/bookcase in another roon, but all the info. is at your finger-tips PLUS you can search for key stuff so much more easily. Also saves wear-and-tear on the book.

That's where I got the types above. Must have missed the hub descriptive, I will go back. Thanks.

The 3 types are the Short Rays No Motto, the Long Rays No Motto, and the Long Rays With Motto.....right ? I just call them "types" didn't realize "hub variety" was the technical term. When there were only 2 recognized, there was no distinction between Short and Long Rays I presume, hence just No Motto and Motto (the 2 types), right ?

1926-D vs. 1927-D: Re-read the Commentary sections in the book regarding how these 2 coins "flipped" in the rarity rankings in the late-1950's. It's an interesting story, and RWB does a great job of primary research to give readers the nitty-gritty. The 1946 FCC Boyd Catalog by Kosoff & Kreisberg noted that at the time the 1926-D was #2 in the Saint series based on "....contacts with some of our finest cabinets." Not a bad source of information at the time, but largely anectdotal and based on memories, albeit from experts presumably with no incentive to lie or give inaccurate information. But no TPGs...no tabulated data on the internet....etc. Just "informed opinion." A 1949 sale of a 1926-D hit $2,500 -- if there are higher-priced sales of Saints up to that time, even the high-end expected for a 1933 Saint that never got off the ground -- I can't find it. I'll keep looking in the book as it is voluminous. But a few years later, once a few tiny hoards came back to the States from Europe, the price had fallen to about $500 for a top-quality 1926-D (The "Lima" Coin, MS-66+ CAC today). Meanwhile, no more 1927-D's came back from Europe...other rarities kept seeing a few more here-and-there hoards from Europe or S/Central America....and then by the end of the decade more-or-less the 1927-D had moved to the top of the rarity rankings and the 1926-D and 1926-S (among others) had fallen a few rungs each.

FYI...as a general rule, Super Gem 1908 NM's (MS-67) and MS-66's seem to cost about 1/2 the price of other commons once they reach condition rarity of the MS-67/66 level.

Is that over here or another totally entirely different website ?

I have the 2 main currency books for historical pricing. But I find Ebay, Great Collections, and Heritage Auctions to be fine for current pricing, especially GC and HA.

More MS-66 and 67 Saints over at Heritage seeing active bidding on Thursday. A couple of 1927 MS-67's went for $16,200 and $16,800, each with bp. A 1928 MS-67 went for $16,200.

No, something like that can never work longer-term. It's fraud. You might as well pass off gold paint-colored bars from City Slickers II as real gold bars. I suspect that is one reason why American Double Eagles later became the gold standard (literally as well as figuratively ) and so many were used and trusted by Central and South Americans. Not familiar with Stellas though I would like to maybe dabble in that area in the future and learn about them. Does anybody know why Quintus A. disappeared ? I miss his grammatically ambiguous posts !! Not sure what Dan Fogelberg has to do with monetary policy....but the reason nation's economies improved when they went off the gold standard is because a Central Bank needs flexibility to deal with economic downturns and exogenous shocks. You can solve a problem like that 2 ways: an internal devaluations or an external devaluation. The market adjustment mechanism MUST take place the key is which one. A gold standard -- or a fixed currency regime like the Euro -- forces and internal adjustment via lower wages and prices.....very difficult, painful, and tough to endure. An external valuation via inflation and a falling currency will cause problems with the price level and/or banking system, but it is easier overall on the economy as measured by nominal GDP. Beware The Denominator Effect !

Digital CCD imaging now.

Double Eagles/Saints were 1982. That's when Duckor/Akers struck.

Eliasberg 1 was 1982....why were the others so much later ? I believe one was 1996 or so, right ? They waited 14 years to finish it ? Assuming that was Part 3......wow.

Who is Dan Carr ? I've seen that name a bit last week or so..... And if a die was made....how does that explain any coins being struck ? How does any regular-level employee have access to the die....have planchets....get to turn the machines on....and strike a few coins ? I mean, did he do it when everyone was at lunch or did he sneak in at 3 AM ? Would seem that higher-ups must have been involved, or been given the OK, to strike a few for whatever reasons from the top people at the Denver Mint or Washington, DC.

Grading was all over the map pre-TPGs. I'm not sure who did the grading for Eliasberg '82 -- Bowers ? -- but either he graded very conservatively...OR....he knew it should probably be a Gem Uncirculated (MS-65) but the estate/auctioner told him to knock it down a bit. It was a recession in 1982....stock market was in the toilet....they might have thought there wasn't a market for "pricey" coins at that level. Dunno..........

I may reach out to my astronomy contacts. Not sure much work has been done on this. I'll let you know. Might also be some speakers at NEAF who talked about this (check the RAC NEAF Talks YouTube Channel). BTW, that quote above was a parody from Star Trek, for those who didn't get it.

The point was.....aided by the lack of number grades, and given that this was pre-TPGs (1982), and probably because they wanted to price it to sell.....it was way "undergraded" however they classified it (which I am pretty sure was Choice Uncirculated). When it was sent to the TPGs a few years later, it got an MS-66. I believe it is in the Top 2 Pop today for 1920-S.

Damnit, I'm a money manager, not an astrophysicist, Jim !!

I don't think so. The vets here can chime in. But I know from Akers/Duckor that MS-63 was called "Choice Uncirculated" and MS-65 was called "Gem Uncirculated" and MS-67 was "Superb Gem." Something like that. The CU coin they bought at Eliasberg '82 was ultimately graded MS-66. I can post the story if you want in the Saints thread(s).

Supermassive black hole is for the most part directly related to the size of the galaxy and presumably, galaxy mergers and collissions which is how many of these galaxies got so big (like M87).

I hope it is able to tell us why the supermassive black hole at the center of the Andromeda Galaxy is 100x bigger than ours, though the former is only 2x the size of our galaxy.

Obsession ? This is a coin forum, Kurt, and I talk about the coin(s) that interest me..... which for the most part are Saints. I don't have a large collection of coins, but the bulk of the value (if not the numbers) is probably Saints. If I weaved Saints into a discussion of the Russian move into Ukraine, the Baseball lockout, why inflation is rising, and the rising crime rate -- then you might have a point. But these forums are about coins and with a few dedicated Saint threads....plus others with topics that somewhat touch upon Saints....I don't think it's obsession so much as my area of focus to talk about them where appropriate. I could do a review of my posts the last month, 3 months, and year.....probably half are Saint-related ? Maybe more, maybe less. I really wasn't counting. You've made that clear. I'm not upset or offended by your stance, why are you with my choice ? And no, trying to weave DISLIKE of gold into the cause of WW I and/or WW II....now, THAT'S an obsession !!! Unless you are saying that Gavrilo Princip got sold an overgraded coin by Archduke Ferdinand ?

No, just relating what I've seen and read....I could opine on Franklins or Mercs but I have nothing to add there.

Please give them China's address. I hear they produce a counterfeit or two every now and then.