GoldFinger1969

UK Telegraph thought that Russia would dump all gold bars including the Czarist ones in their vaults. Felt it could plunge 20% in coming days but instead Russia is a buyer. Up $22 to $1,910 today. I think Eastern Europeans will want a few gold coins rather than 1 BitCoin if they are worried about future incidents.

For a modern gold Eagle coin, the appearance in regular vs. proof is striking. For the matte proofs (I presume you mean Saints)....the difference vs. a regular business strike is less apparent, at least to me (I guess the dealers/collectors of that time kind of agreed).

Yeah....coin-wise, they are nice. I just grew up with a different ideal of "proofs" and that to me is the highly-mirrored, polished surface we've had since about 1960.

Nice coin, but the smaller fields and the lack of a mirror surface make the proof appearance a bit underwhelming. At least to me.

Overseas Hoards vs. Domestic Holdings: I re-read the sections on sources of gold coin at the end of the book. I was looking for but did not find a direct answer to this question: what % of the Saint coins that we have today came from overseas hoards vs never left the States (but avoided melting) in the 1930's ? I know the table you have on P. 603 says just over 1 MM coins from Europe/South America, which is about 30% of the total of 3.7 MM coins. What I'm confused about is the 591K and 2 MM coin lines. Are these coins that were in the hands of collectors/dealers and others who held their coins but didn't turn them in after the recall ? The numbers seem high. I read somewhere (but can't remember where) that 90% or more of the Saints we have today came from overseas (Europe or South/Central America). I can't prove verify that number but considereing how many people in the 1930's would risk violating the Gold Recall Law and how few dealers/collectors there were, it could be. Here's the table/data from Page 603: Estimated Survivors..............................................591,665 (1907-1933, excludes the next 2 lines) Estimated Survivors...........................................2,028,000 (1908 Type 1 & 1922-1928 Philly Mint) Estimated Survivors...........................................1,088,310 (Europe, South America) TOTAL ESTIMATED SURVIVORS..............3,707,975

Gail Godot ? HOT DAMN !!!!

For me, to track the production....usage.....shipments.....of Double Eagles (Liberty's and Saints, but mostly Saints since the numbers are higher)...... from 1907 (Panic) through 1933 (Depression/End of Gold Standard) is fascinating. That's what makes your chapters on gold and trade so interesting. There isn't as much "story" in the history of the Liberty DEs compared to the Saint DEs, aside from the former's much lower survivor numbers. At least that interests me. Biggest thing I was disabused of in reading about Saints was how few circulated and/or were saved/collected. I thought it was ~10% based on my mid-1980's economics learnings, and it is of course much, much lower. 0.1% or less seems to be a good number for the entire number that circulated on average each year.

I have no problem with this, but that's MODERN INFORMATION or story-telling about modern or older (1933 Saint) coins. I want the story AT THE TIME regarding these coins. If a 3 or 4 or 5 Saint series in a row ended up in Treasury vaults and getting melted in the 1930's, then I want to know why the 6th one went to South America as part of some balance of trade deal. Or why one particular batch of coins from San Francisco stayed domestically to back Gold Certificates but the Philly and Denver issues went South of the Border. That kind of thing. Maybe some folks today have that information off the tip of their tounges, but I venture not many. I don't know too many people who can spit out data and facts that stream like Aker's 1907-33 Gold Coin book or Roger's Saints book. I'm sure the Mint Director gave you their POV and their legal approach on the 1933 Saints, but I strongly doubt he had the depth of knowledge from documents that were available and incorporated in Roger's chapter on the 1933's such as on die varieties, striking dates, Coin Exchange policies, etc. (let alone provide alternate perspectives on holding the 1933 Saints that RWB and Bowers both advocated for).

Well, to be perfectly honest, the story of the Saint-Gaudens coins that I follow most closely ARE about story telling, Kurt. It's part of the appeal...the intrigue....what makes them interesting, at least to me. Quite frankly, there aren't that many stories about modern or recent coins, right ? So what besides simply "collecting" and "getting all the coins" could the chase and study of the coins be about ? Not much, IMO....hence my interest in Saints and probably the reason others here like Early Copper, or Franklins, or Walkers, or Trade Dollars, or Morgans, or Mercury Dimes, etc...etc...etc. I WANT to read about specific stories regarding the 1920-S and the CT State Library, knowing that the specifics of this coin, or the ~130 Saints from 1932 or any other year, are part of the intrigue. The auctions...the sales....the yanked coins (1933 and others)....the experts' favorites coins, years, and mintmarks....etc. It's part of the history of the coins and in general, I love reading about history period. I have a story on all of my favorite coins. It's not just a coin from a particular year or mint in a plastic slab.

Still have to organize it and present it in an interesting fashion. The lawyout for RWB's Saints book makes the information digestible to interemediate collectors like me. You have to present interesting information in the proper context othewise it just stands out and doesn't flow with any narrative.

Can I inquire as to the topic of the article, TJ ?

Maybe someone can answer quickly....I'm confused.....how or by whom did Trade Dollars continue (to be struck, I presume) after the U.S. Government (I presume no private parties could strike them ?) ceased minting them ? Is this something unique to Trade Dollars that is confusing me ? I admittedly know nothing about the series. EDIT: NEVER MIND....I see it is for PROOFS only.

Congrats on the article, TJ good luck on yours. I'd like to write an article if I can find the time later this year.

Ugg...if you buy any in size at .800 fine silver, you're losing money from Day 1. That's scary.....

Most of those fakes are made at least of real silver though, right ? So if you pay spot, at least you are not getting taken too badly.

Yes, I agree Mark. My Morgan experts and others say it is definitely broad-based. And again, the biggest % boosts have been at the lower-priced end.

Speaking of Peace Dollars....have you seen any uptick in your Peace Dollar book since the Mint released the new Peace Dollars ? I have to think that the 2021 coins are causing people to look at classic Peace and Morgan dollars. Prices are certainly up, especially for toned, PL, and DMPL Morgans < $500.

At least it wasn't Al Capon'e safe.....

Very well said. I should say this is also the key to good investment and financial research.

Maybe an example can help....can you give an example from the Saints or RoAC books of some original research that you did that debunked something that had been accepted as fact which wasn't the case ?

OK, that proves the CURRENT Mint workers don't know everything....I don't think that means you can't gather useful information from documents that are 100 years old or more.

I agree documents can have errors in them and maybe even an occasional deliberate mislead....but short of inventing a time-travelling machine and hovering over the people in real-time....I don't even think that observing the coins will be 100% fool-proof. The point is to reasonably be certain -- 95% confidence level, something as a lawyer you should appreciate -- that things are as they appear to be and were claimed to be. I think the documents that RWB uncovers are fascinating. Not all of them interest me, but they are all chock full of information. They provide SOME information -- sometimes definitive, sometimes not. It depends on the coin and circumstances.

Well, I'll let him speak for himself but if finding coins to actually match documents takes YEARS than it delays the book a long time. And sometimes the coins might be tough to track down. I know Roger posted in the long Saints thread that he observed many of the coins for the sections on die varieties.

Nope, alive and kicking, come on over !! PMG is the leader in currency grading, I believe, so it would be kind of weird if NGC (PMG's owner) got rid of the Boards here. They are definitely less active than the coin section.

Roger explained it above, Alex, but in the book he has 3 different sections for various "No Motto" / Motto 1908 Saints. Not paragraphs, but given the same status in the book as mintmarks or year strikings. I myself wasn't aware of the Long vs. Short Rays dichotomy until I read his book. Never saw it on a lable....a description...or any of the HA/GC commentaries. And if it was mentioned in Akers or Bowers' books....it was a 1-line sentence that didn't stand out and I forgot about. Roger's book really drills stuff into you. Of course, you can get overloaded which is why a re-reading of the book a 2nd time is essential, IMO. Or the smartphone version of the Commentaries which I hope to do this year.