Conservation 1 1

[David Otto]

When a coin goes through conservation is it listed on the slab in any way, is it hidden in the cert number , thanks 

[USAuPzlBxBob]

No.

[Mike Meenderink]

No the coin when final graded will not have" conserved "on the label. If the coin qualifies for conservation it will be conserved and then sent to NGC grading. If the coin qualifies for grading it will be graded and encapsulated as the graders see fit.

[RWB]

"Conservation" will not be noted on the label. It will show in the conservator's in-house records, and the owner's invoice.

However, if a coin is "Composted" this might be on the label -- along with some old coffee grounds and a bit of tomato skin.

[David Otto]

@RWB I'm learning the lingo, your saying if it comes back cleaned or something it would be on the label or numbered in the cert number 

[Sandon]

    If the coin is determined to have been "cleaned"--which supposedly would have occurred before the coin was "conserved"--the coin will be given an adjectival "Details" grade, with "Cleaned" noted on the label. The coin's having been "conserved" is not noted, and the coin is supposed to be given a numerical grade if found to be unimpaired.  However, I do not recommend allowing NCS to "conserve" coins based upon my one experience with it.

Edited April 23 by Sandon

[Coinbuf]

Sometimes the conservation may reveal an old cleaning that the crud, haze, or artificial tone was hiding.   Thus a coin that has been conserved is not immune to receiving a details grade after the conservation.

[K Scott]

On 4/23/2024 at 12:02 PM, Coinbuf said:

Sometimes the conservation may reveal an old cleaning that the crud, haze, or artificial tone was hiding.   Thus a coin that has been conserved is not immune to receiving a details grade after the conservation.

Happened to me.  Submitted to Conservation, a Seated Dime which I believed had artificial toning.  They removed the toning, but it was returned with a Details/Cleaned 'grade'.  The evidence of cleaning was obvious with the toning now gone.  This was a "never again" experience for me.  I agree with Sandon.  Not worth the added expense.

[Jason Abshier]

Conservation service all they do is dip in a solution to remove toning and hazing . Really no need pay for that service you can dip your own coins … if it had some gunk or some some stuff on it you can soak it in acetone … grading companies act like it’s a secret lab basically all same chemicals and stuff dealers and collectors been using for year to restore coins and remove ugly toning and by NOT cleaning them which is when a coin is full of hairlines and rubbing marks

there’s a very fine line between what’s acceptable such as dipping coins (is not considered “cleaned”) VS a coin that was rubbed with a rag or paper towel leaving hair marks all over it … not all of us agree on what is cleaning and Not cleaning on the forums here … I accept dipping for certain coins with ugly splotchy brownish toning or ugly album toning and artificial toning needs removed I don’t consider that cleaning 

[USAuPzlBxBob]

My personal experience netted a "+" upgrade on my 1849 G$1 Dahlonega first year of issue.

In its NGC holder on the obverse side, just left of Liberty's bust, was a fiber… and on the reverse side, grime was seen in the lettering of UNITED STATES and the interior of the D mintmark.

I sent it off to NCS for conservation, and it was then to continue on to NGC for Scratch-Resistant reholdering.  When the coin came back to me, the fiber had been removed, but the grime still remained on the reverse side.  I sent it back to NCS yet again.  When it came back the second time it was gorgeous in the Scratch-Resistant new holder, and it had upgraded, slightly, from AU 58 to AU 58+.

[ldhair]

On 4/23/2024 at 12:27 PM, Jason Abshier said:

Conservation service all they do is dip in a solution to remove toning and hazing .

No. Every coin they work on is a different process. Many chemicals can come into play. They know the proper way and the order the chemicals should be used to leave the surfaces of the coin stable. A simple dip or an acetone bath is not what many coins need. Some coins require a really long bath in a solution to slowly remove a problem without damaging the coin.  

[RWB]

On 4/23/2024 at 11:18 AM, David Otto said:

@RWB I'm learning the lingo, your saying if it comes back cleaned or something it would be on the label or numbered in the cert number 

If the coin appears to have been cleaned, the TPG it will state "Cleaned" on the label and it will not have a numeric grade. They don't give refunds, either.

If the TPG "conserves" a coin, that is handled as a separate process. Afterward, it can be submitted for grading and the coin is supposed to be "dispassionately observed." If the surfaces appear normal, there is nothing on the label in the coin is called "straight graded."

["Conservation" is supposed to be removal of surface contaminants where not bonded to the coin, and chemical stabilization to prevent deterioration from anything that was present. Nothing will restore a coin to original condition.]

Edited April 24 by RWB

[Fenntucky Mike]

I have never requested NCS conservation but when NGC recommends it I've always approved it and have never been disappointed. Acetone won't remove all surface contaminants, I soak most of my coins in acetone for 24hrs or so and they come out looking better but not like after NCS conservation. Maybe if I placed the container on an agitator/orbital shaker or had a fountain the acetone soak would net better results, something I'll be trying at a later date.  I also, mainly, collect modern World coins which often don't have all of the pitfalls of U.S. coins like old cleanings, AT, and the like. 

To the OP's question, no, there is no way to tell if a coin has gone through NCS.

[Jason Abshier]

On 4/23/2024 at 7:27 PM, ldhair said:

No. Every coin they work on is a different process. Many chemicals can come into play. They know the proper way and the order the chemicals should be used to leave the surfaces of the coin stable. A simple dip or an acetone bath is not what many coins need. Some coins require a really long bath in a solution to slowly remove a problem without damaging the coin.  

Ahhh the good ol’ MS70 coin brightener trick ? Just kidding around … I do agree and stand corrected there is much more depth to conservation services offered by TPG at PCGS and NGC and the solutions that they use… 

[David Otto]

Thanks for the response guys, i knew the answer but merely looking for confirmation, although I do have a coin submitted for conservation ( I don't know if it was accepted or not ) It's not why I asked, I asked because it was stated that conservation was put on the label and I wasn't going to argue about it so I came here, thanks again for all the responses 

[ThePhiladelphiaPenny]

On 4/23/2024 at 11:07 AM, RWB said:

However, if a coin is "Composted" this might be on the label -- along with some old coffee grounds and a bit of tomato skin.

Hmm. Always a comedian. LOL

[LOCK34]

On 4/23/2024 at 6:27 PM, ldhair said:

No. Every coin they work on is a different process. Many chemicals can come into play. They know the proper way and the order the chemicals should be used to leave the surfaces of the coin stable. A simple dip or an acetone bath is not what many coins need. Some coins require a really long bath in a solution to slowly remove a problem without damaging the coin.  

Agree. I had a Morgan Dollar go through conservation after soaking and agitating it in acetone. The conservation process made a difference even after the acetone soak. When I soak a coin in acetone, I put it in a mason jar with the lid on that. With that you can shake and spin and agitate the coin in the acetone without a risk of scratching or abrading the coin. 

[powermad5000]

To the OP, you have gotten answers, but I noted through the responses, nobody touched on your mention/question if anything is "hidden" in the certification number. I think you mean the submission number by this. 

There is no "secret coding" in the submission number on the slab. It is simply the way NGC keeps track of your coins through their processes at their facility, keeps coins from getting lost, and makes sure the coins you send to them get back to you and not get mixed up and sent to some other collector/submitter.

[David Otto]

thanks for the answers everyone, while I'm here I do have a question regarding my own coin submitted for conservation, so I sent in a ngc slabbed morgan for regrade-economy+conservation (first time submitting so it's a learning curve) coin was received on the 22nd and today it hit the status of scheduled for grading, 2 days later ?, I read that ncs takes 20+ days so I guess it's safe to assume it wasn't eligible for conservation, but then I read if an already slabbed ngc coin is submitted for conservation + regrade and ncs declines conservation it wouldn't be regraded unless you write regrade regardless of ncs decision on the submission form (which i didnt), so it's easy to say I'm a little confused, i will eventually understand the process in due time tia

[VKurtB]

On 4/24/2024 at 11:23 PM, David Otto said:

i will eventually understand the process in due time

If you do, you’ve COMPLETELY lost touch with reality. 
 

[David Otto]

@VKurtBI'm simply referring to the submitting process with the forms and steps, a phone call helped me understand, thanks for your response 

[powermad5000]

I also sent in an NGC slabbed Morgan with some unattractive toning for NCS conservation and regrade. NCS declined conservation on the grounds that if conserved it would affect its grade negatively and therefore declined conservation. It was not scheduled for grading since they left it in the original slab.

I don't watch my submissions like a hawk so I can't tell you in a similar fashion what happened to mine. Not sure why your coin would be scheduled for grading unless it was actually conserved. The NCS turnaround time is stated as such as I could only imagine when they are at full capacity so people don't think it only takes a day or so, and I am sure that turnaround time can be considerably less if there not many coins coming into their system. If it was not conserved they will only charge the $5 fee so if you have any statements showing a charge for only $5 then it was not conserved. It sounds to me though like NCS already turned your coin back to NGC after conservation and it is in the system now to be graded.

[David Otto]

@powermad5000would you happen to know if the charges from ngc and ncs would be separate, I ask because ngc has charged my cc but the charge was missing the conservation fee, if they are separate I don't know how ncs would charge me without a method of payment

[USAuPzlBxBob]

On 4/26/2024 at 12:15 AM, David Otto said:

would you happen to know if the charges from ngc and ncs would be separate, I ask because ngc has charged my cc but the charge was missing the conservation fee, if they are separate I don't know how ncs would charge me without a method of payment

The charges will be separate.  They may have decided to do nothing on the conservation, and then you might still have a handling fee.

They're very meticulous, so be patient.  They'll generate whatever paperwork they need to get your order done.

With my submittal, the paperwork came back, and they had penned a strikethrough on what was wrong with my submittal, and they then straighten everything out — writing on the original submittal by them — so there was no doubt on how how they were going to proceed with things, and not mix things up.

[powermad5000]

On 4/25/2024 at 11:15 PM, David Otto said:

would you happen to know if the charges from ngc and ncs would be separate, I ask because ngc has charged my cc but the charge was missing the conservation fee, if they are separate I don't know how ncs would charge me without a method of payment

The charges are separate but I believe the NCS charges are billed through NGC so that is how NCS gets paid. As stated by @USAuPzlBxBob, you will be able to see these charges come through in your statements NGC sends to your email under the original submission number as well as on the paperwork that gets returned to you when your coins come back.