ANA election 1 1

[Zebo]

Any thoughts on the ANA election? Anyone watch the Zoom presentation? I did and am still debating on a couple of the choices. 

The President selection should be interesting to watch. 

[zadok]

3 hours ago, Zebo said:

Any thoughts on the ANA election? Anyone watch the Zoom presentation? I did and am still debating on a couple of the choices. 

The President selection should be interesting to watch. 

politics as usual...hidden agendas....hence close associations tween present n past board members...more closely aligned with the money side of numismatics than the collectors side....not receptive to outliers....

[World Colonial]

I don't believe the ANA is nearly as relevant to most collectors as it might have been in the past, assuming it was ever relevant at all.  I see no relevance to my collecting.  I was a member for a few years but declined to renew.

It isn't an accident that membership has purportedly been flat at around 25,000.

[Henri Charriere]

Can anyone fault someone for expecting more from an organization with a lofty title like the American Numismatic Association?

This "problem," if indeed there is one beyond general perception, is going to have to be solved by the upcoming generation.

Coin collecting has changed.  Grading has changed.  How coins are marketed has changed.  We've got the keepers of the high-profile Crown Jewels whose population has become increasingly more defined, key dates, auction houses to keep the adrenaline pumping, and everything else. The young numismatists will have to set the tone and direction of the hobby for the years to come.

[RWB]

New ANA Slogan: "Delivering less every year!" Or maybe "Out of Touch, Out of Mind"

[World Colonial]

1 hour ago, Quintus Arrius said:

Can anyone fault someone for expecting more from an organization with a lofty title like the American Numismatic Association?

This "problem," if indeed there is one beyond general perception, is going to have to be solved by the upcoming generation.

Coin collecting has changed.  Grading has changed.  How coins are marketed has changed.  We've got the keepers of the high-profile Crown Jewels whose population has become increasingly more defined, key dates, auction houses to keep the adrenaline pumping, and everything else. The young numismatists will have to set the tone and direction of the hobby for the years to come.

Well, the Numismatist used to be good, though of less interest to me than the collectors who (mostly) buys US coins.

The Library?  I never used it and it's not relevant for anything I have collected since 1998.  However good it is, it's less useful now with the NNP and any future improvements to it.  There is also a lot more published material than when I started collecting in 1975 or even pre-internet.

For someone who has the money, there are the seminars.  I'd find the one on counterfeits useful and most collectors might get something out of the grading course especially if they collect US coinage.  I did buy the grading CD a long time ago but never even watched it.  It's a lot cheaper but I don't believe any of this is practical to the "typical" collector based upon my assumption of their annual budget, $500 or less..

As far as joining to "give back", I know some volunteer their time but my vacation is allocated elsewhere.  I also already expressed my opinion on the pointlessness of charitable giving in another thread, so someone else can do that if they believe in it because I do not.

The ANA isn't relevant to most collectors, especially in the internet age.  For the beginning collector, you can get the online version of one or more courses (if you have the money) but otherwise can get a lot more information on the internet for free whenever you want it.  For the "advanced" or specialist collector, I see no incremental benefit to joining it in addition to or instead of a specialty club, like EAC, CONECA or Bust Half Nut Club.  I presume the most active ANA members are club members anyway but are active more for social reasons.

I have thought about joining the ANS as it's a lot more relevant to my collecting and I believe it to be a much better run organization.  I intended to schedule a visit to view their Spanish colonial collection for the areas I collect which is an option for a $50 administrative fee, a bargain for the knowledge I would gain.  

[gmarguli]

I just looked at who is running. Is there any difference since last year or the year before or the year before that or...

[RWB]

30 minutes ago, gmarguli said:

I just looked at who is running. Is there any difference since last year or the year before or the year before that or...

This year, all candidates were required to wear two left shoes as they ran.

[dollarfan]

2 minutes ago, RWB said:

This year, all candidates were required to wear two left shoes as they ran.

LOLOLOLOL

[zadok]

3 hours ago, gmarguli said:

I just looked at who is running. Is there any difference since last year or the year before or the year before that or...

nope, same clique same agenda same small circle....running headlong towards irrelevancy, numismatist doing same thing...minimal collector value...very limited reasons for new collectors to join other than just belonging or getting free ngc membership...few decent classes for yn members...

[Zebo]

I think there is only one new candidate that has not served before. The pursuit (push) to eLearning has been a step forward. A bit more world presentations - I think.

 

[VKurtB]

I can wholeheartedly endorse Charles Morgan for one seat, and the unopposed Joe Bolling for Veep. I'd vote for him for Prez if he were running. Both Presidential candidates are decent fellows and will be a huge improvement over the incumbent. One thing keeps bugging me. If this is the AMERICAN Numismatic Association, why is a French woman running? (and serving presently?) How many votes do you think an American who speaks very broken French would get in an election for the French national numismatic organization? Or even the same for the Brits or anyone else?

[zadok]

2 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

I can wholeheartedly endorse Charles Morgan for one seat, and the unopposed Joe Bolling for Veep. I'd vote for him for Prez if he were running. Both Presidential candidates are decent fellows and will be a huge improvement over the incumbent. One thing keeps bugging me. If this is the AMERICAN Numismatic Association, why is a French woman running? (and serving presently?) How many votes do you think an American who speaks very broken French would get in an election for the French national numismatic organization? Or even the same for the Brits or anyone else?

trois-quatre

[VKurtB]

Oh, also a vote vote Cliff Mishler should be obvious. Mike Ellis' ego knows no bounds, also the same for Barry Stuppler.

[Zebo]

32 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

I can wholeheartedly endorse Charles Morgan for one seat, and the unopposed Joe Bolling for Veep. I'd vote for him for Prez if he were running. Both Presidential candidates are decent fellows and will be a huge improvement over the incumbent. One thing keeps bugging me. If this is the AMERICAN Numismatic Association, why is a French woman running? (and serving presently?) How many votes do you think an American who speaks very broken French would get in an election for the French national numismatic organization? Or even the same for the Brits or anyone else?

Charles is on my list. I believe he will bring many new and proactive ideas to the board.  

Kurt - you about ready for your UK trip?

[gmarguli]

4 hours ago, VKurtB said:

One thing keeps bugging me. If this is the AMERICAN Numismatic Association, why is a French woman running? (and serving presently?) How many votes do you think an American who speaks very broken French would get in an election for the French national numismatic organization?

Mon dieu! Qu’est-ce que ce monde est venu à?

I looked up her platform: She would like to make it [ANA] evolve and integrate as well as possible the globalized context in which we live since the emergence of the Internet. Sounds like she is advocating open boarders! 

Also, it appears she works for Spink. Spink sounds like it could be some sort of racial epithet. Hey Spink, don't come around my neighborhood anymore.

Due to my complete and total apathy with the ANA elections and the fact I never actually vote in them, she will not be getting my vote.

[VKurtB]

49 minutes ago, gmarguli said:

Mon dieu! Qu’est-ce que ce monde est venu à?

I looked up her platform: She would like to make it [ANA] evolve and integrate as well as possible the globalized context in which we live since the emergence of the Internet. Sounds like she is advocating open boarders! 

Also, it appears she works for Spink. Spink sounds like it could be some sort of racial epithet. Hey Spink, don't come around my neighborhood anymore.

Due to my complete and total apathy with the ANA elections and the fact I never actually vote in them, she will not be getting my vote.

I get the Spink U.K. books every few years. 

[World Colonial]

4 hours ago, gmarguli said:

I looked up her platform: She would like to make it [ANA] evolve and integrate as well as possible the globalized context in which we live since the emergence of the Internet. Sounds like she is advocating open boarders! 

I'd be curious to know what this actually means.

If it's what I infer, she is guaranteed to fail.  However many demographic groups anyone wants to list, only a few have much of any propensity to collect.  The rest do not due to a lack of interest, not for any other reason.

[VKurtB]

12 hours ago, World Colonial said:

I'd be curious to know what this actually means.

If it's what I infer, she is guaranteed to fail.  However many demographic groups anyone wants to list, only a few have much of any propensity to collect.  The rest do not due to a lack of interest, not for any other reason.

Every candidate, every blessed one of them, wants to make the ANA more relevant to today’s collectors in any way they can. People shouldn’t bash the ANA. They should be telling them how to do that. If you aren’t an ANA member, tell the ANA why not. Do it here. Do it everywhere. Call their bluff.

[RWB]

21 hours ago, Zebo said:

If this is the AMERICAN Numismatic Association, why is a French woman running?

Unless there is some obscure fine print in the charter or by-laws, any member can run for the Board or presidency.

[World Colonial]

43 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

Every candidate, every blessed one of them, wants to make the ANA more relevant to today’s collectors in any way they can. People shouldn’t bash the ANA. They should be telling them how to do that. If you aren’t an ANA member, tell the ANA why not. Do it here. Do it everywhere. Call their bluff.

I have given my reasons scattered in numerous posts and threads, including here.

I acknowledged what I believe is the benefit some of the courses/seminars provide but you do not have to a member to buy those and even if required now, it's a "one shot" deal and not an incentive for renewing or lifetime membership.  

It's incumbent on those who hold a contrary opinion to make the sales pitch for membership, not me to explain to anyone why it is not.  The flat or declining membership is proof enough that most collectors see limited or even no value from it.

What exactly do most collectors get out of membership and why should they want to spend it on ANA dues instead of coins or something else?  I know the reasons the ANA provides on it's website but it's evidently not sufficiently persuasive. 

I'm a specialist collector who doesn't even collect US coinage at all.  I don't see that the ANA will ever be relevant to my collecting or anyone like me.  I don't see that it's that different for more "advanced" collectors of US coinage.

The main reason I can see for joining is for those who are interested in being socially actively like you.  In a prior thread, you told me that your vacations are organized around the show locations and schedule.  I suspect that active involvement is substantially attributable to local club membership which also describes your collecting based upon your prior posts.  If you are representative, then more local club members would result in more ANA members.  Not sure the ANA can do anything directly about that.

If the typical collector has an annual budget of less than $500 as I believe, it's unreasonable to expect them to spend in the vicinity of 10% for membership.  Apparently, the ANA thinks they should spend it on this, local clubs presumably want more collectors to pay their dues, collectors are supposed to subscribe to other numismatic periodicals, "buy the book before the coin" and lastly, pay grading fees to TPG for coins that aren't even worth having graded.

The primary point is that it's a trade-off.  Most collectors would rather spend their (very limited) budget on coins, not a noticeable proportion on fees or services they do not need.

[Zebo]

5 hours ago, RWB said:

   On 5/4/2021 at 2:10 PM, Zebo said:  If this is the AMERICAN Numismatic Association, why is a French woman running?

 

Unless there is some obscure fine print in the charter or by-laws, any member can run for the Board or presidency.

Roger  - not sure how you captured the above -- but that is not my comment.  Zabo

 

[RWB]

Sorry. Someone must have copied the quote into a post of yours, which I then copied and commented upon.

[DWLange]

The ANA has had two Canadians as president over the years, I believe, though these both served before establishment of the CNA in 1950. John Jay Pittman was simultaneously president of both organizations 50 years ago, but that's more a reflection of the man than the organizations.

[Zebo]

anyone see this?

[gmarguli]

55 minutes ago, Zebo said:

anyone see this?

Hey everyone, we're unloading the junk. Anything nice that would bring significant funds will be kept, even if it is redundant. 

[Morpheus1967]

19 minutes ago, gmarguli said:

Hey everyone, we're unloading the junk. Anything nice that would bring significant funds will be kept, even if it is redundant. 

On eBay no less. 

[VKurtB]

Who wants to take bets on special NGC slab labels for them?

[VKurtB]

On 5/5/2021 at 10:50 AM, World Colonial said:

I have given my reasons scattered in numerous posts and threads, including here.

I acknowledged what I believe is the benefit some of the courses/seminars provide but you do not have to a member to buy those and even if required now, it's a "one shot" deal and not an incentive for renewing or lifetime membership.  

It's incumbent on those who hold a contrary opinion to make the sales pitch for membership, not me to explain to anyone why it is not.  The flat or declining membership is proof enough that most collectors see limited or even no value from it.

What exactly do most collectors get out of membership and why should they want to spend it on ANA dues instead of coins or something else?  I know the reasons the ANA provides on it's website but it's evidently not sufficiently persuasive. 

I'm a specialist collector who doesn't even collect US coinage at all.  I don't see that the ANA will ever be relevant to my collecting or anyone like me.  I don't see that it's that different for more "advanced" collectors of US coinage.

The main reason I can see for joining is for those who are interested in being socially actively like you.  In a prior thread, you told me that your vacations are organized around the show locations and schedule.  I suspect that active involvement is substantially attributable to local club membership which also describes your collecting based upon your prior posts.  If you are representative, then more local club members would result in more ANA members.  Not sure the ANA can do anything directly about that.

If the typical collector has an annual budget of less than $500 as I believe, it's unreasonable to expect them to spend in the vicinity of 10% for membership.  Apparently, the ANA thinks they should spend it on this, local clubs presumably want more collectors to pay their dues, collectors are supposed to subscribe to other numismatic periodicals, "buy the book before the coin" and lastly, pay grading fees to TPG for coins that aren't even worth having graded.

The primary point is that it's a trade-off.  Most collectors would rather spend their (very limited) budget on coins, not a noticeable proportion on fees or services they do not need.

If a collector has an annual "coin budget" of less than $500, that collector is more in need of numismatic education than I can possibly relate here. Maybe they need (badly) to collect less junk and invest more in educational opportunities. If my coin budget were $500, I'd buy or acquire nearly nothing but books, travel, and seminar attendance.

Edited May 7, 2021 by VKurtB

[VKurtB]

Why the sad emoji, @JKK? It's not about assembling tons of junk, or is it? Heck, my NGC dues budget alone is a three-figure number!