Is this an MS67 ???

[TonerGuy]

I think I know grading of Peace $ pretty well but Im no expert. I havent actually seen all that many 67s in person - perhaps 2-3 over the years - so for the experts out there - is this really what a MS67 should look like ?

 

Sorry if this coin belongs to somewhere here...

 

Again, I know grading from photos is hard but I would imagine that a 67 would be free from just about any and all hits or nicks.

 

And if this isnt a MS67 does NGC get coins like this off the market ?

 

1925 NGC MS67 Peace $....

[najat]

I am no expert either, but I think it really depends on the coin and the strike. That is a nice looking Peace and I checked the number and it's listed with NGC so it appears to be the real deal that they graded. Another Peace may get a 67 grade and look a little different than that one. No two coins are exactly alike is how I see it, but they may still grade the same depending on too many factors to list.

[RWB]

My opinion, and I tend to be conservative in grading - at least by modern "standards," is that there are too many hits and scrapes on the nose, jaw and neck, plus reverse dings on the eagle to be a MS67 coin.

 

However, I often disagree with what any of the major companies put on uncirculated coins.

[mikew148]

I'm not an expert but, based on these images, that coin is not a 67.

 

Honestly, It doesn't appear to be a 66.

 

Too much chatter on the nose, cheek, jaw and neck. The hit on the nose appears to be fairly deep and it is distracting to me, even in the full slab pic.

 

 

[coinman1794]

I would argue no, it is not. However, late die state coins like this, with billowing frost, seemingly original surfaces, and strong eye appeal tend to get a bump over average Peace dollars. I could envision MS66+ on this piece, so it is not that far off.

[brg5658]

I saw that coin this morning. Based on those images, no. I'd put it at 65.

[MarkFeld]

I have seen quite a few 67's and based on the images, it looks to be of similar quality to many of them. Should it and/or the others be graded 67? That might be a different topic.

 

For those who think it is 1 or 2 points over-graded - my guess is that you would feel the same way about a majority of the others in MS67 holders.

[RWB]

Mark is likely correct on this.

[mikew148]

I have seen quite a few 67's and based on the images, it looks to be of similar quality to many of them. Should it and/or the others be graded 67? That might be a different topic.

 

For those who think it is 1 or 2 points over-graded - my guess is that you would feel the same way about a majority of the others in MS67 holders.

 

I would agree that most 67's that look like this one would be overgraded in my eyes.

 

They would also be overgraded to my pocket book as I would not be willing to give 66 money for this one.

 

 

[MarkFeld]

I have seen quite a few 67's and based on the images, it looks to be of similar quality to many of them. Should it and/or the others be graded 67? That might be a different topic.

 

For those who think it is 1 or 2 points over-graded - my guess is that you would feel the same way about a majority of the others in MS67 holders.

 

I would agree that most 67's that look like this one would be overgraded in my eyes.

 

They would also be overgraded to my pocket book as I would not be willing to give 66 money for this one.

 

 

If you wouldn't pay 66 money for that coin, there will be extremely few MS66's that you would like. And for what it's worth (which might be exactly $0) I think you're being too harsh on the coin.

[Hard Times]

As noted, grading by photographs is tough. The positives on this coin is thick mint frost, no obvious hits. Thus by photos alone, I see no reason why this cannot be a 67. I wouldn't pay 66 money for any Peace Dollar 'cause it is not my series, but I don't see why this can't be a 67 in hand.

 

Best, HT

[RWB]

As I've said repeatedly - the key is to examine the coin and deterimne if it meets your standards for quality and value, not those of someone else.

[mikew148]

I have seen quite a few 67's and based on the images, it looks to be of similar quality to many of them. Should it and/or the others be graded 67? That might be a different topic.

 

For those who think it is 1 or 2 points over-graded - my guess is that you would feel the same way about a majority of the others in MS67 holders.

 

I would agree that most 67's that look like this one would be overgraded in my eyes.

 

They would also be overgraded to my pocket book as I would not be willing to give 66 money for this one.

 

 

If you wouldn't pay 66 money for that coin, there will be extremely few MS66's that you would like. And for what it's worth (which might be exactly $0) I think you're being too harsh on the coin.

 

Let's agree to disagree.

 

For what it's worth, I have many 66's that I'm very pleased with

[MarkFeld]

I have seen quite a few 67's and based on the images, it looks to be of similar quality to many of them. Should it and/or the others be graded 67? That might be a different topic.

 

For those who think it is 1 or 2 points over-graded - my guess is that you would feel the same way about a majority of the others in MS67 holders.

 

I would agree that most 67's that look like this one would be overgraded in my eyes.

 

They would also be overgraded to my pocket book as I would not be willing to give 66 money for this one.

 

 

If you wouldn't pay 66 money for that coin, there will be extremely few MS66's that you would like. And for what it's worth (which might be exactly $0) I think you're being too harsh on the coin.

 

Let's agree to disagree.

 

For what it's worth, I have many 66's that I'm very pleased with

 

Re-grade them

[mikew148]

I have seen quite a few 67's and based on the images, it looks to be of similar quality to many of them. Should it and/or the others be graded 67? That might be a different topic.

 

For those who think it is 1 or 2 points over-graded - my guess is that you would feel the same way about a majority of the others in MS67 holders.

 

I would agree that most 67's that look like this one would be overgraded in my eyes.

 

They would also be overgraded to my pocket book as I would not be willing to give 66 money for this one.

 

 

If you wouldn't pay 66 money for that coin, there will be extremely few MS66's that you would like. And for what it's worth (which might be exactly $0) I think you're being too harsh on the coin.

 

Let's agree to disagree.

 

For what it's worth, I have many 66's that I'm very pleased with

 

Re-grade them

 

Several of them are as much of a 67 as this coin is, but I don't think any of them truly are.

 

Re-grade them? No, I think they're accurately graded at 66.

 

Besides, TPG companies can, and often do, get it wrong anyway - Which brings us back to the coin in question.

[coinman1794]

I have seen quite a few 67's and based on the images, it looks to be of similar quality to many of them. Should it and/or the others be graded 67? That might be a different topic.

 

For those who think it is 1 or 2 points over-graded - my guess is that you would feel the same way about a majority of the others in MS67 holders.

 

I agree that this piece is very much like many other MS67s. However, I tend not to grade most of those coins MS67.

[mumu]

I think this coin is being rewarded a point, whether intentionally or not, for that slight orange peel effect it has which make is look almost like the sandblast proofs.

[coinman1794]

The orange peal effect is created by erosion of the die. These late die state coins will often have ridiculously nice luster, which can drown out other distractions.

[zboyle04]

i dont like that one, looks like a pretty big hit on the nose, reverse is better, but still kinda ugly coin

[Afterword]

"However, late die state coins like this, with billowing frost, seemingly original surfaces, and strong eye appeal tend to get a bump over average Peace dollars."

 

It does seem like copious amounts of frost in one area of a Peace dollar, such as between the tendrils of Liberty’s hair on the obverse and between the feathers of the eagle on the reverse (where it can sometimes look like the frost has been applied with a trowel), can somehow compensate for a lack of frost, and/or contact marks, in another area or areas of a coin.

[bsshog40]

I really thought it looked pretty good except for the hit on the nose. That pushes me to 66 for the grade. If it wasn't for that, the very small marks didn't phase me for a 67 grade.

[Walkerfan]

It looks pretty smooth to me. I am not really surprised by the grade.

[mikew148]

I wish the OP would have listed this in the "spare a grade" section.

 

I think we would have had some very different opinions on this one had the grade not been revealed. I think most would have said - 64 chance at 65.

 

That chunk out of the nose is no beauty mark.

 

 

[rmpsrpms]

Wow, IMO that one is for sure overgraded based on seller's pics. It is probably one of those coins that has great, "dripping" luster in-hand. Too bad that luster like that only comes from heavily-worn dies. I personally don't agree with what I perceive as the general consensus of all TPGs to favor luster over all other aspects of a coin's condition when assigning lofty grades. This results in technically overgraded coins with "eye appeal" that are mushy and often have flaws that would drop the grade a couple points if the luster was not hiding / compensating them. Eye appeal is nice, but marks are marks and should not be overlooked. Plus, I'm a die state / details / strong strike snob, and dripping luster is nearly mutually exclusive with these characteristics.

[RWB]

Q: If you own a coin with "dripping luster" do you have to wipe up after it?

[TonerGuy]

I have seen quite a few 67's and based on the images, it looks to be of similar quality to many of them. Should it and/or the others be graded 67? That might be a different topic.

 

For those who think it is 1 or 2 points over-graded - my guess is that you would feel the same way about a majority of the others in MS67 holders.

 

Is this typical of NGC or also of PCGS ?

 

Ive always believed that NGC (on the older coins) were very conservative in regards to grading Peace $ in the MS63-65 range. I have seen many 65s that could be 66s (in regards to strike & surface quality). Perhaps those coins did not have the dripping luster that the above example has but they were very nice coins.

 

I would expect an MS67 to have all 3 - luster, strike and surface preservation.

 

[rainbow roosie]

Peace Dollars never look really nice. That said, I have two in 65 that look better than this coin.

[James_OldeTowne]

I suppose I've seen at least twenty MS-67 Peace dollars from both services, and this one appears to be on-par with all of them. A Peace dollar in MS-67 simply will not look as nice as a Morgan dollar in the same grade, and for that matter, that seems to be true of these coins in all the MS grades.