Online Sales Tax passed in Senate...whatcha think?

[JOBESSI]

So the online sales tax passed overwhelmingly in one house, and will no doubt pass in the next house. Do you think a lot of online coin retailers will start unloading inventory to save on taxes?

 

I dream of a "Perfect Storm." Silver & Gold at low prices, and sellers that want to liquidate...in a mass exodus all at once!

[rons]

We can only hope the House has more sense than the Senate. Let me rephrase that: The House has more sense than the Senate but have they been paid off ???? That certainly is a nice dream to have

[bsshog40]

I'm sure it will pass. I just wonder how they will go about collecting it. Will Ebay and/or Paypal collect the taxes? Will the seller be responsible for paying the taxes? Here on the news, La. Claims to be losing $300 million a year. Just more hands in my pockets I say!!

[halfpint]

 

I'm sure it will pass.

 

...with all due respect, boss, I hope you're wrong. this would be just as big of a debacle as the health care fiasco!!!

[RWB]

The $1 million revenue exclusion will help some small businesses, but the huge increase in paper work for the states and on-line sellers could have noticeable impact on state budgets and some business budgets.

 

The large on-line sellers are already set for this, so it is the mid-size business that will be most affected. For a business with a couple of stores in only one state, it will mean having to register and file returns for at least 54 state/state-like. The maximum has been reported at over 9,000 taxing local jurisdictions, but most of these actually piggy-back on state-wide filings.

 

Each state, however, could suddenly acquire several million new sales tax accounts and have to manage many times the current work load. How that will balance against the extra revenue is unknown. Large states, New York, California, Texas, etc. apparently have capacity, but what about North Dakota, or Mississippi or Arkansas?

 

[MBA101]

A lot more people will be out of work that is for sure!

[brg5658]

A lot more people will be out of work that is for sure!

 

Care to explain how you come to that conclusion or what that has to do with an online sales tax??

 

 

 

[brg5658]

So the online sales tax passed overwhelmingly in one house, and will no doubt pass in the next house. Do you think a lot of online coin retailers will start unloading inventory to save on taxes?

 

I dream of a "Perfect Storm." Silver & Gold at low prices, and sellers that want to liquidate...in a mass exodus all at once!

 

I don't see why sellers would care. When they sell items, the sales tax gets passed on to the buyer. I don't forsee there being any mass-unloading of inventory. The only place I see that as being an option is if the retailer wishes to get out of the coin business all together before they are required to keep track of the accounting nightmare associated with tracking sales-tax in 50 states + territories.

[Deerefan8420]

It passed in the Senate but it is highly unlikely to pass in the House. Something I have also wondered is- Will it change the tax rules for some states that do not collect sales taxes on numismatic items or bullion? If not, then I don't think many coin dealers have much to worry about. But if it does change the rules, what will that do for companies like Heritage or Stacks, and even some of the smaller auction venues, as far as sales go?

[johnny9434]

im wondering if feebay has to collect the taxes for what ever government is in charge at the time then how long will it take for them to raise their fees to cover the expense of it? just wondering is all

[JOBESSI]

So the online sales tax passed overwhelmingly in one house, and will no doubt pass in the next house. Do you think a lot of online coin retailers will start unloading inventory to save on taxes?

 

I dream of a "Perfect Storm." Silver & Gold at low prices, and sellers that want to liquidate...in a mass exodus all at once!

 

I don't see why sellers would care. When they sell items, the sales tax gets passed on to the buyer. I don't forsee there being any mass-unloading of inventory. The only place I see that as being an option is if the retailer wishes to get out of the coin business all together before they are required to keep track of the accounting nightmare associated with tracking sales-tax in 50 states + territories.

 

That's why made sure to use the word "Dream"...

[mumu]

A lot more people will be out of work that is for sure!

 

Care to explain how you come to that conclusion or what that has to do with an online sales tax??

 

 

 

Money is finite.The more the government takes away, the less there is to go around. Less money = less jobs.

[brg5658]

A lot more people will be out of work that is for sure!

 

Care to explain how you come to that conclusion or what that has to do with an online sales tax??

 

 

 

Money is finite.The more the government takes away, the less there is to go around. Less money = less jobs.

 

People affected by sales tax being collected online are not those with tight budgets and living in poverty. The majority of internet users in the USA are college educated, and make well above median salaries.

 

If anything, the online sales tax will help local smaller businesses and get the internet shoppers back at their local stores, as the "advantage" of shopping online would be lessened. More money spent locally will increase jobs/work locally...which prompted my original question -- how does one make the leap from collecting online sales tax to fewer jobs?

 

Finally, these sales tax revenues are going to the states, not the federal government. As such, the dollars are much more likely to end up funding social programs, roads, and other projects that one can actually witness in their state. If people want to gripe, they should be doing it about federal tax money being spent on things like more tanks and fighter jets, instead of supporting the social fabric of this country like the retiring baby boomers, the broken healthcare system, and sustainable energy.

[coinman_23885]

The $1 million revenue exclusion will help some small businesses, but the huge increase in paper work for the states and on-line sellers could have noticeable impact on state budgets and some business budgets.

 

This. And unless you are dealing with Legend or a dozen other coin dealers, for most coin transactions, I do not believe that this will affect the final price because of the revenue exclusion clause cited by RWB.

[bsshog40]

A lot more people will be out of work that is for sure!

 

Care to explain how you come to that conclusion or what that has to do with an online sales tax??

 

 

 

Money is finite.The more the government takes away, the less there is to go around. Less money = less jobs.

 

People affected by sales tax being collected online are not those with tight budgets and living in poverty. The majority of internet users in the USA are college educated, and make well above median salaries.

 

If anything, the online sales tax will help local smaller businesses and get the internet shoppers back at their local stores, as the "advantage" of shopping online would be lessened. More money spent locally will increase jobs/work locally...which prompted my original question -- how does one make the leap from collecting online sales tax to fewer jobs?

 

Finally, these sales tax revenues are going to the states, not the federal government. As such, the dollars are much more likely to end up funding social programs, roads, and other projects that one can actually witness in their state. If people want to gripe, they should be doing it about federal tax money being spent on things like more tanks and fighter jets, instead of supporting the social fabric of this country like the retiring baby boomers, the broken healthcare system, and sustainable energy.

That's funny, as most people I know that shop online are not college educated at all. Most shop online because its cheaper for the normal working class. Not too many local shops offer consumer items at auction or overstock prices. Most are gougers and then add the 8% to 11% state tax that's usually charged and you will see less spending. The majority of state taxes go to support education and healthcare, both of which are costing taxpayers more and more every year. Very few dollars go to road care!!! To be honest, most people will never actually see what these tax dollars fund.

[mtnstyne]

I fail to see how increased taxes will help small businesses. It may help antiquated local sellers sell to their very small local customer base, but it will undoubtedly hurt the small businesses who survive through online sales. Adding additional cost in accounting and maybe software investments, not to mention lost interstate sales that were previously made specifically because there was a tax benefit.

 

Second, I seriously doubt there will be a flood of inventory to avoid the taxes for coin purchases. I think for the most part coins and bullion sales are not taxed in most states and this bill doesn't create new taxes.

 

Lastly, eBay puts the burdon on the seller to collect the taxes if I understand it correctly. The problem is going to be enforcement by the states to get their money from the sellers. As it is there are sellers on eBay already charging sales tax who are unknowledgeable about state laws and who are most likely just charging sales tax as a means to increase their own profit margin. I doubt they are remiting the taxes collected to the state..and the state would be wasting more money trying to collect from small sellers.

[Hard Times]

All for leveling the playing field by forcing online vendors to charge sales tax. No one wants to pay more taxes but this is simply something that makes sense over the long haul, which is why it is not a partisan issue in congress but instead both sides are largely for it. As in any new law, some will win, some will lose. But what is good for the long term health of the country? B and M small buisness owners will be the winners here and there are alot of these around. As Brandon noted, these taxes will get back into the state economies by supporting infrastructure, social programs, etc. I agree if one wants to gripe, see how the feds are wasting money hand over foot on war, etc. What this will do for the price of gold, silver? I hope they crash so I can afford to by a nice double eagle. As noted, SMALL SELLERS will be exempt, no money trying to collect from them will be spent so mstyne I am not sure you concern is valid.

 

Best, HT

[RWB]

In most states the retail merchant acts as the sales tax collection agent for their state. They receive a commission for doing this and the tax payments are not part of their revenue. In situations such as ebay, they are not the merchant, but merely the commissioned broker of transactions. As a convenience to sellers and buyers, ebay might calculate the tax due, but it is the seller's responsibility to collect and remit the funds to the buyer's locality.

 

This whole thing gets complicated -- state sales taxes were commonly interpreted as local and restricted only to a physical nexus. Chain stores from each state had to deal with this for their specific locations in any state, but not for every store in every state.

 

[mtnstyne]

When I retire back in Montana you all can have your expensive items shipped to me and avoid the state sales tax and I will in turn mail your items to you for a small handling fee.

 

HT, my point is that small sellers WILL charge the sales tax....but not remit it to the states. It has happened to me twice in the last year on coin purchases online. I reside in a state that does not have a sales tax on coins or bullion yet sellers sent me invoices with sales tax included. I am sure the majority of their customers pay the sales tax without question and the merchants then just keep it as a 7% profit.

 

I also don't think it will level the playing field but time will tell. I will still be selective when making purchases and large online venues will almost always be able to have reduced operating costs to a B&M. For items that do rate sales tax it just means I will purchase less of it so the merchants will now get 7% less. Adding sales tax to my purchase doesn't increase how much money I have to spend it just means I get less for my money and in turn the vendor gets less money. And I am sure that the local and state government are good stewards of my money....

[Hard Times]

 

HT, my point is that small sellers WILL charge the sales tax....but not remit it to the states. It has happened to me twice in the last year on coin purchases online. I reside in a state that does not have a sales tax on coins or bullion yet sellers sent me invoices with sales tax included. I am sure the majority of their customers pay the sales tax without question and the merchants then just keep it as a 7% profit.

 

 

Now that is something I would have never thought of, but I bet you are right, some small sellers will see this as an opportunity to make that profit..... Good point to bring up, thanks Mtntyne.

 

Best, HT

[Mark T]

http://thecoinologist.com/sales-tax-state-by-state-breakdown/

[MBA101]

A lot more people will be out of work that is for sure!

 

Care to explain how you come to that conclusion or what that has to do with an online sales tax??

 

 

 

Money is finite.The more the government takes away, the less there is to go around. Less money = less jobs.

 

People affected by sales tax being collected online are not those with tight budgets and living in poverty. The majority of internet users in the USA are college educated, and make well above median salaries.

 

If anything, the online sales tax will help local smaller businesses and get the internet shoppers back at their local stores, as the "advantage" of shopping online would be lessened. More money spent locally will increase jobs/work locally...which prompted my original question -- how does one make the leap from collecting online sales tax to fewer jobs?

 

Finally, these sales tax revenues are going to the states, not the federal government. As such, the dollars are much more likely to end up funding social programs, roads, and other projects that one can actually witness in their state. If people want to gripe, they should be doing it about federal tax money being spent on things like more tanks and fighter jets, instead of supporting the social fabric of this country like the retiring baby boomers, the broken healthcare system, and sustainable energy.

 

Government only gets money by taking it out of the economy that produces the money (i.e.-we the people). Government does not create wealth. If you have to pay more for the things you want, either you need to somehow earn more, or buy less. The latter is more likely. So if everyone out there buys less items because the items cost more (taxes) then businesses obviously are selling less by default. Maybe not everyone will be impacted that much, but those in the business of selling luxury items will get hit the hardest, perhaps closing or laying people off. (Remember Bill Clinton's Luxury Item tax in 1993 that was putting Yacht builders and high end jewelery manufacturers among others out of business so they repealed it soon after)

 

All you people thinking that this levels the playing field, why are you so concerned about punishing us, the consumers, and the businesses that we are patronizing? How about this to help the brick and mortar shops: Lower their taxes so that they can increase their business and increase sales? Why is it always we that have to do with less and not the government?

[Conder101]

I think for the most part coins and bullion sales are not taxed in most states and this bill doesn't create new taxes.

25 states charge sales tax and 6 more charge sales tax on sales under a certain amount. So a majority of the states charge sales tax on coins

 

All for leveling the playing field by forcing online vendors to charge sales tax.

Great, lets further level it by requiring the B&M's to charge shipping even though the buyer will be carrying the purchased items out of the store themselves.

[halfpint]

 

Great, lets further level it by requiring the B&M's to charge shipping even though the buyer will be carrying the purchased items out of the store themselves.

 

... (thumbs u

[RWB]

"Government only gets money by taking it out of the economy that produces the money..."

 

Actually, that's a common fallacy.

 

All the $$$ that are paid in as taxes and fees - local, state, Federal - are all paid out for community services, materials and wages. Private companies and governments add value to the economy in some of the same ways, and in others that differ. The companies that blend and sell asphalt to a contractor who builds a road add direct and indirect private value, and the government that pays the contractor adds indirect public value and direct wage value.

 

This is one of the reasons the so-called "supply side" approach does not work. People make individual and family decisions, and do not consult economists, ideologues or Ouija boards before they do so. Tax cuts and tax increases have relatively small long-term impacts unless they are drastic - but drastic changes, create instability and increase speculation. Neither the Reagan nor Bush II tax cuts ever created enough economic increase to reverse the Federal and state deficits they created. Add a needless war built on Bush’s emotional feelings of inadequacy, and a depression built on banker and mortgage lender greed and you end up with the present dire numbers. The only process that has succeeded in the past (without a huge war) is moderation and stability built on gradual, rational change in tax and deficit rates.

 

[World Colonial]

After the federal government, the biggest waster of funds are the state and local governments. The idea that there is any virtue in their spending habits and that this creates a net "win" is completely unsubstantiated.

 

Regardless of whether one is or is not in favor of this bill, the fact is that most government spending past a minimal level makes any economy poorer because it is wasted to a large degree, regardless of whether it is supposedly "necessary" or not. There is a huge amount of "slippage".

 

Today, most government spending is on income transfers including effectively paying many not to work who could produce something of value (whatever it is and whether it is paid or not). At the federal level, another large portion is on the department of offense (aka, Defense Department) which both removes resources out of the private economy and intermittently destroys wealth through foreign glorious misadventures. Lastly, governments at all levels hire legions of drones many of whom not only do not enhance economic performance but actually actively reduce it.

 

On the tax side, the main deficiency I see in the tax cut efforts is in the marketing. Populist demagogues who believe in higher taxes to "soak" the rich or to pay for government departments such as formal schooling (aka "education") are much better at it. There is no need to provide any justification whatsoever for any tax cut because everyone has a right to their own money.

[pianoman]

What do I think? My state is one of those large ones that started gouging in the hobby a couple years back. It is one of the reasons why I am buying less from Stack's and Heritage because I need to factor 8.75% sales tax after the commission the auction houses take on top of every bid I make.

BTW our infrastructure is crumbling in this state and we have some of the highest taxes in the nation