Bad Ebayer.BEWARE!

[eggbone]

I have had a terrible(still ongoing) with mas4220 in ebay.

First, he wanted to "pay me next Friday" for 13 different Walking

liberty half dollars, almost two weeks after the end of the auctions.

 

He then told me that I was unreasonable and should make every attempt to accommodate him.

 

After finally receiving the coins, he opened 13 cases against me for misrepresenting my coins. He said that he was expecting BRILLIANT UNCIRCULATED coins. I did not state anywhere that they were brilliant uncirculated.

I have talked with the Ebay reps multiple times. You may know this but they almost always side with the buyer.

 

Of course, Ebay sided with him. I am unmarried and have no girlfriend, but I just got f***ed

[jgrinz]

Welcome to the world of Ebay

 

[Dudley the 1st]

When you re-list, don't forget that you were charged your first listing fee's.

[thebeav]

I think that eBay sided with the buyer because you used the word 'Brilliant' in your title.

Something to consider.....

Paul

[e1cnr]

what did you mean when the title starts with BRILLIANT?

 

If I read this description, I would assume a BU coin, do you know what that is, - are most of those sliders?

 

 

This is a Brilliant, 1941-D Walking Liberty Silver half dollar that has all of its original mint luster. It appears to be uncirculated. Make your own determination in viewing the photos. This coin is very well struck. All details are sharp and well defined.

 

 

this 1941 seems weakly struck over the center and on leg and left arm, and looks like could have has luster breaks above IN GOD

 

 

I am not saying the buyer is right, as they did some annoying things like asking for 2+ weeks when you state 5 days and then filing a significantly other claim before asking you about their concerns

[noow]

That is just not right. They should make a thread just to name ebay buyers that rip you off.

[MarkFeld]

LInk to the listing, please?

[James_OldeTowne]

I STILL three years later celebrate the moment I decided to get off of eBay completely.

 

I've never looked back, and have never had even the slightest regret.

[Buffalo Head]

LInk to the listing, please?

 

Yep....Lets see the listing....

[brg5658]

LInk to the listing, please?

 

Yep....Lets see the listing....

 

I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing it is some of these? Ebay Link

[bochiman]

That is just not right. They should make a thread just to name ebay buyers that rip you off.

 

I'd like to hear the buyer's side of the story before jumping to the conclusion that someone is being ripped off. Would be good to get both sides, don't you think?

 

From the listings, it looks like the seller made a few mistakes as well, so likely neither side is completely blameless in an issue arising.

[jesbroken]

I agree with the others--your choice of the descriptive word "Brilliant" misled the buyer(not excusing their request for additional time).I cannot remember the term being used other than to describe an uncirculated coin. I didn't see your auctions so I can't say as to the pics matching the description. I believe in the future you would be wise to discard this term and perhaps use another descriptive phrase that is relevant to each coin.

Good luck.

Jim

[eggbone]

Here are two of the listings.

I admit that I did use the word BRILLIANT" in all of the Titles, and the words "appears uncirculated in a few. But in several, the words uncirculated does not appear anywhere in the listing.

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/BRILLIANT-1941-D-WALKING-LIBERTY-SILVER-HALF-DOLLAR-1-/290590501668?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item43a88b2b24

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/BRILLIANT-1941-D-WALKING-LIBERTY-SILVER-HALF-DOLLAR-1-/290590501668?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item43a88b2b24

 

This buyer Never asked for a refund, which I have given in the past and would have given him without hesitation.

 

[Chris1976]

After reading the auctions, I have to somewhat agree with ebays findings for two reasons:

 

1.) Brilliant being used in the title

2.) "Uncirculated" in full caps within the item description on some fo the listings and in other listings you say "appears uncirculated"

 

Even though you did tell the perspective buyers to make thier own opinions based on the pictures, the use of those two terms in the auctions made the coins sound better than they were.

 

The buyer was also in the wrong for the time it took for you to recieve payment, but you as the seller could of stuck to your listing where you stated payments needed to be recieved within 5 days from the end of auction. At that point you could of been the one to open the cases against the buyer for non payment.

 

-Chris#2

[19Lyds]

To avoid future SNAD, the word BRILLIANT needs to be taken off your listing titles unless you know for SURE that the coin is BU.

 

I think you've been lucky so far.

[MarkFeld]

To avoid future SNAD, the word BRILLIANT needs to be taken off your listing titles unless you know for SURE that the coin is BU.

 

I think you've been lucky so far.

I've seen many brilliant AU coins. But I still wouldn't use the term "brilliant" unless it were a slam dunk that almost everyone would agree.

[Buffalo Head]

I agree with the others--your choice of the descriptive word "Brilliant" misled the buyer(not excusing their request for additional time).I cannot remember the term being used other than to describe an uncirculated coin. I didn't see your auctions so I can't say as to the pics matching the description. I believe in the future you would be wise to discard this term and perhaps use another descriptive phrase that is relevant to each coin.

Good luck.

Jim

 

Well said my friend. I agree the word "BRILLIANT" in caps is the problem. It's your choice how to list, but this word leaves the door open for dispute. Not a good buyer for making ya wait, agreed. I also agree you've been lucky so far.....Joe

 

Just my opinion if your looking.....

[jom]

This buyer Never asked for a refund, which I have given in the past and would have given him without hesitation.

 

Here's the part I don't get. Why doesn't this buyer just ask for the REFUND? Why even bother whining to eBay? Was it because the seller didn't want to wait two weeks to paid?

 

There are faults aplenty here (starting with the auction description) but the buyer isn't any saint.

 

Sometimes I just don't understand people. Why create animosity by going to eBay? For that matter how about PAYING ON TIME? Unbelievable.

 

EDIT: Just to be clear my opinion is based on what is known here...I really do not know what actually went on here...

 

jom

[johnny9434]

Welcome to the world of Ebay

 

unfortanatly

[ultra-crepidarian]

I agree that your listings were misrepresentative but I have seen a lot more egregious puffery than you are guilty of. The major point is that you could still find yourself in this position even if your descriptions were 100% accurate. E-bay does not analyze disputes like we have on the Board. They are unwilling to allocate the resources necessary to do that. As you said, E-bay’s policies are definitely skewed in favor of the buyer, as a seller you need to know that and what it really means.

 

You were wrong in how you described the coins. The buyer was wrong in that he should have never bid on an auction that he couldn’t afford to pay for. You were wrong in that you should not have let the buyer delay payment for two weeks (a big red flag of potential trouble). You should have filed an unpaid item complaint at the end of four days and blocked the buyer – this would offer you the best protection for yourself. E-bay’s policy will not protect nice-guys trying to work with buyers – but of course, you know that now.

 

The buyer was VERY wrong in that, even after you worked with him and gave him 2 weeks to pay, he filed multiple cases for “item not as described”. You offered a very reasonable 7 day return policy. The seller should have invoked that policy and returned the coins (with confirmation of delivery). You would then have to refund 100% of the purchase price and would be wise to refund the cost of mailing the coins back to you. That is the cost of doing business on E-bay.

 

There is a tremendous amount of fraud on E-bay and E-bay doesn’t seem to care all that much. Unethical sellers rip off ignorant buyers and unethical buyers can easily rip off ethical sellers. For example, if the seller would have mailed back to you (with confirmation of delivery), a box of stones (weighing the same as your coins): Guess who could have lost all his coins AND all his money? That is the risk you assume when selling on E-bay. So things could be worst. That said, I am sorry that this has happened to you. I understand how upsetting it can be.

 

[mintcollector]

While I fully agree that both the buyer and seller were wrong in this case, as both a buyer and seller on eBay, I must state that even if a seller imposes a statement like 'payment due within five days', if a buyer pays late, even when a non- paying buyer case is open, eBay will close the case once payment is received.

 

After someone has already bid on an item it is impossible to prevent them from paying for that item. You can only prevent them from bidding on future auctions. Therefore, 'blocking' the user after five days, would have only strengthened the buyer's case even more.

 

As a seller on eBay I require immediate payment right away, or within three business days for items that are won via bid. I can tell you that even after I open a non-paying bidder complaint, once the buyer pays, the buyer can complain to eBay if the seller does not follow through with the transaction...

 

This is because all a non-paying buyer complaint does is, you guessed it, give the buyer more time to pay...

[Walkerfan]

Listing was a little misleading.

 

I agree, though, that the buyer should have tried to deal with you FIRST and asked for a refund.

 

That would have been the honorable thing to do.

[e1cnr]

once you get the coins back, you can slow pay the refund

 

I would consider opening the package at the post office in front of the postmaster for contents-

 

just to be sure you do not get some washers or rocks instead of your walkers

(eBay has turned many scammers to the buy side)

[eggbone]

Well,

The buyer is sending all of the coins back(that is he said he did). We will see.

This has been a learning lesson for me. I have never had such a heartache with Ebay(customers that is) in over 13 years with ebay.

I have sold many, many coins with the same or similar format, thinking that people will read and interpret the listings. Oh, boy how naive. I will certainly be more specific with my listings with NO possibility of misinterpretation.

More to follow when I receive the coins.

[Hard Times]

I agree that your listings were misrepresentative but I have seen a lot more egregious puffery than you are guilty of. The major point is that you could still find yourself in this position even if your descriptions were 100% accurate. E-bay does not analyze disputes like we have on the Board. They are unwilling to allocate the resources necessary to do that. As you said, E-bay’s policies are definitely skewed in favor of the buyer, as a seller you need to know that and what it really means.

 

You were wrong in how you described the coins. The buyer was wrong in that he should have never bid on an auction that he couldn’t afford to pay for. You were wrong in that you should not have let the buyer delay payment for two weeks (a big red flag of potential trouble). You should have filed an unpaid item complaint at the end of four days and blocked the buyer – this would offer you the best protection for yourself. E-bay’s policy will not protect nice-guys trying to work with buyers – but of course, you know that now.

 

The buyer was VERY wrong in that, even after you worked with him and gave him 2 weeks to pay, he filed multiple cases for “item not as described”. You offered a very reasonable 7 day return policy. The seller should have invoked that policy and returned the coins (with confirmation of delivery). You would then have to refund 100% of the purchase price and would be wise to refund the cost of mailing the coins back to you. That is the cost of doing business on E-bay.

 

There is a tremendous amount of fraud on E-bay and E-bay doesn’t seem to care all that much. Unethical sellers rip off ignorant buyers and unethical buyers can easily rip off ethical sellers. For example, if the seller would have mailed back to you (with confirmation of delivery), a box of stones (weighing the same as your coins): Guess who could have lost all his coins AND all his money? That is the risk you assume when selling on E-bay. So things could be worst. That said, I am sorry that this has happened to you. I understand how upsetting it can be.

 

Not only are there these issues, but some of the major dealers that list quality, NGC and PCGS slabbed coins, are without a doubt using shills to amp up the auction prices. Because they apparently contribute significant funds to the ebay bottom line, ebay does not seem to care that these dealers are violating ebay policy. If you bid on an auction listing, check who else has bid on it, how many times suspect bidders have bid on that dealers auctions and others, before you commit to a high bid. There is one dealer in particular, who even advertises in CW and NN, that appears to be using multiple shills. I like what that dealer offers on the bay but I simply won't bid on his/her offerings knowing that shills are being used. So be careful, find honest dealers on the bay (or off) and stick with them. Be suspect and investigate.

 

Best, HT

[jom]

I like what that dealer offers on the bay but I simply won't bid on his/her offerings knowing that shills are being used. So be careful, find honest dealers on the bay (or off) and stick with them. Be suspect and investigate.

 

I would not at all be surprised if what you say it true. However, I don't think you have to avoid the auction altogether. To me I would just bid up to what you think is the correct value. That way shilling is somewhat irrelevant. Sure, it may mean you'll never get a deal but you did at least get the coin at what it's worth...according to your own guidelines anyway.

 

I'm not in any way saying it is OK to shill (in fact I've always thought it was illegal...but what do I know) just that you don't have to avoid auctions outright. I'm sure there is shilling going on in some way at Heritage or Stacks..."self shilling" even...who knows? That doesn't stop me from bidding...that's just me though.

 

jom

[PerryHall]

For all intents and purposes, I don't think bidding against a shill is all that different than bidding against a reserve. In both cases the owner is protecting himself from selling his coin too cheaply. Just bid what you think the coin is worth to you.

[19Lyds]

Just bid what you think the coin is worth to you.

This concept is just beyond the grasp of the shill whiners Perry!

[PerryHall]

Just bid what you think the coin is worth to you.

This concept is just beyond the grasp of the shill whiners Perry!

 

If the shill gets greedy or unrealistic as to the value of his coin, he will usually wind up buying back his own coins and paying all the eBay fees.

[jackson64]

Just bid what you think the coin is worth to you.

This concept is just beyond the grasp of the shill whiners Perry!

 

Disdain for unethical sellers who try and circumvent the system and save some money on reserve fees does not make one brainless and " unable to grasp the concept" or a "whiner"--it just makes one a person of higher integrity who naively expects those of low character to play by the rules.....such a low price to sell one's integrity and self respect...