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The Nerve of this guy ATS.. If anyone else asked for help I would in a heartbeat

Started by Yaha,

37 posts in this topic

JJSingleton

JJSingleton

Posted
Posted

Chinese counterfeit coins are old news and PCGS has never minded because counterfeit coin detection is a part of their business model. Therefore the more the merry. What has Hall's attention is not the counterfeit coins, it is the new counterfeit slabs. These have serious implications for PCGS and our host. So I am sure Hall is now going to try to blend the issues and is jumping on the counterfeit bandwagon in general.

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Buffalo Head

Buffalo Head

Posted
Posted
Chinese counterfeit coins are old news and PCGS has never minded because counterfeit coin detection is a part of their business model. Therefore the more the merry. What has Hall's attention is not the counterfeit coins, it is the new counterfeit slabs. These have serious implications for PCGS and our host. So I am sure Hall is now going to try to blend the issues and is jumping on the counterfeit bandwagon in general.

 

His personal gain, at our expense, I get it!!! If he, and Don Willis would hold true to "their word " I would probably put forth an effort to comply, but they don't. All I have received from the two of them are empty promises.....Joe

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Yaha

Yaha

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FatMan you are correct my friend.. I am just waiting for the company ATS to invest in the Hewlard Packard turbo twister sniffer 3000 counterfit slab detector to finally make this hobby fool proof so they will be the only company to trust. NOT!!!

 

NGC... Thanks for who you are..

 

Also, someone ATS should contact NASA to find a wise brilliant mind over there to discover a fail proof slab or label with a new plastic, Laser slabs could be it... This way we won't be ask for more money to get someone else to do the dirty work for them on Capitol Hill in DC.. Too much more serious stuff needs attention at this time in our country.

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Buffalo Head

Buffalo Head

Posted
Posted
FatMan you are correct my friend.. I am just waiting for the company ATS to invest in the Hewlard Packard turbo twister sniffer 3000 counterfit slab detector to finally make this hobby fool proof so they will be the only company to trust. NOT!!!

 

NGC... Thanks for who you are..

 

Also, someone ATS should contact NASA to find a wise brilliant mind over there to discover a fail proof slab or label with a new plastic, Laser slabs could be it... This way we won't be ask for more money to get someone else to do the dirty work for them on Capitol Hill in DC.. Too much more serious stuff needs attention at this time in our country.

 

Right on brother! You sure have that right and very well said!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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JIM F.

JIM F.

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This really is not that difficult to do. And you don't need NASA -- I once worked for NASA and most of those guys aren't all that smart, except when it comes to bureaucracy and in-fighting.

 

And yes, I really am a rocket scientist.

 

 

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Keigwin

Keigwin

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Too bad they don't just slap a cheap RFID chip into the slab. That'd stop counterfeiting in a heart beat.
It'd probably make it worse. RFID's are a dime a dozen. Simple for counterfeiters to duplicate.

Lance.

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Yaha

Yaha

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This really is not that difficult to do. And you don't need NASA -- I once worked for NASA and most of those guys aren't all that smart, except when it comes to bureaucracy and in-fighting.

 

And yes, I really am a rocket scientist.

 

 

Daamnit Jim, get to the drafting table and save the slabs.. Or as Captain Kirk said, Jim we need warp speed, Captain I am giving all she's got, not good enough we need more. :)

 

Jim, I hope you are getting my drift on why I am saying.

 

 

P.S. Jim if you were in NASA once, if you could offer to me in a pm or maybe go to the watercooler on the NGC forum. Why can't they stop that foam from the external fuel tank from falling off and hitting the bottom of the shuttle? This worries me, I do believe in the future of space flights we will still need the external booster fuel tanks correct.. Thanks George

 

 

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physics-fan3.14

physics-fan3.14

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I have a degree in rocket science, but I'm a nuclear engineer now.

 

Every attempt to foil counterfeiters will be met with new counterfeits. That's the problem the BEP has. They keep innovating, and the counterfeiters keep catching up. The fight has been going on for thousands of years, and will continue.

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Frank Provasek

Frank Provasek

Posted
Posted
Too bad they don't just slap a cheap RFID chip into the slab. That'd stop counterfeiting in a heart beat.
It'd probably make it worse. RFID's are a dime a dozen. Simple for counterfeiters to duplicate.

Lance.

 

Wrong. The counterfeiters would actually have to possess the original slab to read its RFID code to make a clone.

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PerryHall

PerryHall

Posted
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Would a slab with a RFID chip do the average collector any good? Is the average collector going to buy a reader for this chip? Very unlikely. If the slabbing companys had a high resolution photo data base of their products, a slab buyer could look up their latest purchase and compare their coin to the pic. It wouldn't work with high grade moderns since they wouldn't have any distinduishing features to allow the comparison.

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djdilliodon

djdilliodon

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Would a slab with a RFID chip do the average collector any good? Is the average collector going to buy a reader for this chip? Very unlikely. If the slabbing companys had a high resolution photo data base of their products, a slab buyer could look up their latest purchase and compare their coin to the pic. It wouldn't work with high grade moderns since they wouldn't have any distinduishing features to allow the comparison.

 

Ngc already has this. No the images aren't the greatest but they are good enough to tell if its the same coin or not. I feel cause of that we do not see the ngc fakes like we do the pcgs ones.

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JIM F.

JIM F.

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I actually have an idea that I think will work and it is not too complicated or expensive. The slab can easily be verified by the typical collector.

 

What should be done is to establish a prize pool and give cash awards to the 3 best (and of course viable) ideas, then a phase 2 to produce a prototype.

 

The notion of sending money to Washington DC is a total joke, and frankly an insult to one's intelligence. The solution will not come from our government.

 

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19Lyds

19Lyds

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My opinion on the subject is that I find it very difficult to understand WHY folks need to pay a "Political Action Committee" (PAC) to hire a Professional Lobbyist (read expensive party animal) just to get Congress to "ENFORCE" existing laws?

 

I find it difficult to understand why the FTC has not contacted eBay to "enforce" existing counterfeiting laws for coins sold from China.

 

I also find it difficult to understand why Chinese Counterfeiter Web Sites (we all know who they are) are allowed in the US.

 

I fully understand that Chinese Counterfeit coins in Counterfeit PCGS Slabs are a problem but isn't this supposed to be addressed by the Federal Trade Commission? How did Gucci address this problem?

 

I guess until I fully understand whose responsibility the enforcement of US Counterfeiting Laws with regard to Coins belongs to, I won't be sending any money to support a PAC which hires a Professional Lobbyist to sweet talk some Congressman/Congresswoman into actually doing his job.

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PerryHall

PerryHall

Posted
Posted
Would a slab with a RFID chip do the average collector any good? Is the average collector going to buy a reader for this chip? Very unlikely. If the slabbing companys had a high resolution photo data base of their products, a slab buyer could look up their latest purchase and compare their coin to the pic. It wouldn't work with high grade moderns since they wouldn't have any distinduishing features to allow the comparison.

 

Ngc already has this. No the images aren't the greatest but they are good enough to tell if its the same coin or not. I feel cause of that we do not see the ngc fakes like we do the pcgs ones.

 

The only problem is there are millions of older slabs that haven't been photographed for the data base. Does NGC have a program to photograph and add these older slabs to their data base?

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JIM F.

JIM F.

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Here's where this is likely going....high dollar coin sales will be contingent upon TPG verification/re-verification. The counterfeit situation may result in a windfall for the TPG's, which is fine with me, at least we have TPG's to protect our interest.

 

This whole idea of sending money to Washington still has me disgusted. In my opinion, the originator of that notion either has a hidden agenda or is simply out of touch.

 

 

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coinman_23885

coinman_23885

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Too bad they don't just slap a cheap RFID chip into the slab. That'd stop counterfeiting in a heart beat.
It'd probably make it worse. RFID's are a dime a dozen. Simple for counterfeiters to duplicate.

Lance.

 

Wrong. The counterfeiters would actually have to possess the original slab to read its RFID code to make a clone.

 

RFID chips can be read from a distance, granted it can be a few yards. Large convention anyone?

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djdilliodon

djdilliodon

Posted
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Would a slab with a RFID chip do the average collector any good? Is the average collector going to buy a reader for this chip? Very unlikely. If the slabbing companys had a high resolution photo data base of their products, a slab buyer could look up their latest purchase and compare their coin to the pic. It wouldn't work with high grade moderns since they wouldn't have any distinduishing features to allow the comparison.

 

Ngc already has this. No the images aren't the greatest but they are good enough to tell if its the same coin or not. I feel cause of that we do not see the ngc fakes like we do the pcgs ones.

 

The only problem is there are millions of older slabs that haven't been photographed for the data base. Does NGC have a program to photograph and add these older slabs to their data base?

 

You are a 100% correct. Ngc has a ton of coins in old holders but when have you seen a fake of one of those? The counterfeiters are having a field day with the pcgs slabs so im sure they are gonna stick to what works for them!

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Keigwin

Keigwin

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There are credible studies on RFID cloning and other weaknesses. Yes, technology will improve, but so will crooked engineers.

 

It is folly to think counterfeiters won't invest in compromising security systems, particularly when the rewards are high and risks low. Ironically, it becomes even more rewarding when beating anti-counterfeiting measures...victims get complacent.

 

I would love technology and collectors to win this battle but I figure we have a better chance of exterminating cockroaches.

Lance.

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Oldtrader3

Oldtrader3

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Doesn't donating money to form a PAC in order to give more money to Lamar Smith to do something that the Secret Service should be doing as part of their job, seem to be a waste of money to anyone else here?

 

Someday those guys who are running ATS are going to drown in their Cool Aid!

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Conder101

Conder101

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Wrong. The counterfeiters would actually have to possess the original slab to read its RFID code to make a clone.

Attend lot viewing at a few major auctions with a concealed reader, That should give you enough RFID codes to last awhile, and at every auction you can increase your database. Over a year or twos time you will have a chance to "possess" almost every rarity, date, and mintmark in the US series.

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e1cnr

e1cnr

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I got an email a couple days before 'that guy' asked for help

 

 

mine came from NGC, stating basically the same stuff

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Yaha

Yaha

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I got an email a couple days before 'that guy' asked for help

 

 

mine came from NGC, stating basically the same stuff

 

Now that's a whole different story.. Is it the same GOP In D house? After his "Cut" out of the Pork worries me.. thanks

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Frank Provasek

Frank Provasek

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Wrong. The counterfeiters would actually have to possess the original slab to read its RFID code to make a clone.

Attend lot viewing at a few major auctions with a concealed reader, That should give you enough RFID codes to last awhile, and at every auction you can increase your database. Over a year or twos time you will have a chance to "possess" almost every rarity, date, and mintmark in the US series.

 

Each RFID code is UNIQUE. You would have to have access to THE EXACT SLAB that you are counterfeiting, not just one of the same date and mintmark.. The RFID code not only must be valid, but must be correct for that serial number.

 

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