• When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

1888 $3 gold piece

Started by zultar-migration,

71 posts in this topic

zultar-migration

zultar-migration

Posted
Posted

I aquired a 1888 $3 gold piece, among others, at a small town estate sale last weekend. I'm new to collecting and my goal is to obtain every antique gold coin minted in the US. A few questions I have are what is the best way to get them graded, and how what is safest way to ship them if I use NGC? I live in a small town so no coin dealers here. Also I heard there are some counterfeit $3 gold pieces running around so what is a good source for learning how to detect counterfeits. I have browsed the NGC website and haven't found any specific info. I am kinda suspicious that that $3 piece is fake, only because it is in such good condition- looks uncirculated and not even a tiny abrasion on it- and I'm not the lucky kind that finds good deals.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
stinkycheese1

stinkycheese1

Posted
Posted

There's a few good books you can get

 

Bill Fivaz counterfeit gold detection book is great, you can buy it on amazon.

 

PCGS Guide to grading and counterfeit detection is also good and focuses more on what geniune coins should look like, where bill's book focuses on what counterfeits should look like

 

Familiar yourself with alterations too...there are lots of fake 3 dollar pieces out there, but if it's real it should bring alot of money, they are pretty scarce.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
MarkFeld

MarkFeld

Posted
Posted

Welcome to the forum.

 

If you can post decent pictures here we can possibly/probably tell you if it's genuine or not. Odds aren't real good, though, based on what you said.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
James_OldeTowne

James_OldeTowne

Posted
Posted

If I were you, I would not waste even another minute. Get the coin packaged up and shipped off to NGC immediately. There are far too many fake three-dollar golds floating around to take excessive risk.

 

Good luck!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
MarkFeld

MarkFeld

Posted
Posted
If I were you, I would not waste even another minute. Get the coin packaged up and shipped off to NGC immediately. There are far too many fake three-dollar golds floating around to take excessive risk.

 

Good luck!

James, frankly that advice sounds silly. There are much less costly (as in free) and more efficient/quicker ways to have the authenticity checked out.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
BillJones

BillJones

Posted
Posted

I agree with Mark. If he could post a decent picture, we might be able to settle this one way or the other. Given the cost of registered mail both ways plus the cost of certification, he could go through $100 easy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
James_OldeTowne

James_OldeTowne

Posted
Posted
If I were you, I would not waste even another minute. Get the coin packaged up and shipped off to NGC immediately. There are far too many fake three-dollar golds floating around to take excessive risk.

 

Good luck!

James, frankly that advice sounds silly. There are much less costly (as in free) and more efficient/quicker ways to have the authenticity checked out.

Then for the benefit of our new member, why not mention them?? (And, I don't think "post images" is anywhere near foolproof advice. If we could reliably authenticate from images, that would be great.)

 

Sorry, but we definitely must agree to disagree. Authentication is an unsurpassed benefit of certification, and for a coin with as much risk as a three-dollar gold, I'd get that thing certified ASAP.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
MarkFeld

MarkFeld

Posted
Posted
If I were you, I would not waste even another minute. Get the coin packaged up and shipped off to NGC immediately. There are far too many fake three-dollar golds floating around to take excessive risk.

 

Good luck!

James, frankly that advice sounds silly. There are much less costly (as in free) and more efficient/quicker ways to have the authenticity checked out.

Then for the benefit of our new member, why not mention them?? (And, I don't think "post images" is anywhere near foolproof advice. If we could reliably authenticate from images, that would be great.)

 

Sorry, but we definitely must agree to disagree. Authentication is an unsurpassed benefit of certification, and for a coin with as much risk as a three-dollar gold, I'd get that thing certified ASAP.

Depending upon the coin and the images, posting them might very well be foolproof. We wont know that unless we have a look.

 

There might also be local dealers who could authenticate the coin. Or an upcoming show where free expert opinions could be solicited. And what's the big hurry at this point?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
stinkycheese1

stinkycheese1

Posted
Posted

When you get home, tilt the coin under a light. Look for luster filled depressions, these are contact marks when making the dies to strike the coin...what I mean is contact marks on the geniune coin which is used to create the dies....metal flows through the die onto the coin and because they are basically struck luster fills into the depression...there will also be die flow lines in it.

 

Since the depression is struck on the coin, it will have the same luster of the surrounding areas. A contact mark on the other hand, will be shiny, not have luster in the depression, and tends to not blend into the surroundings like the depressions.

 

Also look at the dentiles (denticals) of the coin, these are around the edge. Make sure they all look even, on counterfeits often you will find 'spikes' coming from the denticals..although on 3% of coins geniune coins have them too, but it's rare. Also counterfeit coins have uneven, 'toothy' denticals, look for that.

 

There may be tool marks too, these are caused when there is a blemish on the die the counterfeiter wants to get rid of , such as a lump. He tries to remove the lump, creating short stubby, raised lines on the finished coin. These are called tool marks, you can often find them in the recess of the neck on 2 1/2 dollar and 5 dollar indians, most of them (but not all) have these.

 

Just a few pointers, but most of all post a picture of it here.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bsshog40

bsshog40

Posted
Posted
Im new to this forum so forgive me if this doesnt work posting a pic. Ok FAQ are no help how do I post pics?

Welcome to the forum. Get a free acct. with photobucket. You will then be able to copy a link to your pics from there and paste them in your reply. I agree, also that a couple decent pics may save you time and money. If it is a fake and there are some recognizable characteristics, then someone here may be able to detect them instead of paying a bunch of money for something you already suspect.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
stinkycheese1

stinkycheese1

Posted
Posted

Well the denticals look weak...mal-formed

 

Also there appears to be a lump on the obverse at K-2

 

The letters in liberty on the headband also appear spaced too widely apart..is this normal? I'm not familiar with the series.

 

Also, It looks like there's a spike from the denticals right above the second"T" in "States" on the obverse. Anyone else notice this?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
MorganMan

MorganMan

Posted
Posted

If the coin is truly uncirculated, then I will say it is fake. There is nowhere near enough detail on the coins devices.

 

It looks as if it is a maybe au50 wear on it, maybe even xf45.

 

I guess it could have been polished somehow after the wear.

 

As for things in the right places, the last "s" being low in states is correct. However, if the coin was a copy of an original, all of that would match.

 

Just does not look right for an uncirculated coin....

 

But I am no $3 gold expert either... hm

 

MM

Link to comment
Share on other sites
bsshog40

bsshog40

Posted
Posted
Gilmer, Hell I lived in Longview! I worked there for 1/2 year after fellowship at Good shepherd, then moved back to central TX. Im a radiologist

We're almost neighbors. My step-kids live in Lufkin.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Coindude

Coindude

Posted
Posted
Gilmer, Hell I lived in Longview! I worked there for 1/2 year after fellowship at Good shepherd, then moved back to central TX. Im a radiologist
That's funny... I'm in Texas and work with radiation! :)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
prudden

prudden

Posted
Posted
If I were you, I would not waste even another minute. Get the coin packaged up and shipped off to NGC immediately. There are far too many fake three-dollar golds floating around to take excessive risk.

 

Good luck!

James, frankly that advice sounds silly. There are much less costly (as in free) and more efficient/quicker ways to have the authenticity checked out.

 

Since there are no experts in his area I think sending it in to NGC,PCGS would be a fine idea after posting pictures of course.But we all know not everyone is going to agree if it's a decent fake,right? The expense for a single coin is kind of high but what else is there? Next time maybe the OP should buy graded gold until he becomes familiar enough to catch the fakes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bugmann1974

Bugmann1974

Posted
Posted
I only saw the photo of the reverse and it didn't strike me as a fake. but I'll defer to those who saw both sides.

 

Click the link under the picture of the reverse. It will pull up a picture of the obverse.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bugmann1974

Bugmann1974

Posted
Posted

That is not quite a good comparison Bob, apparently there were changes made between 1854 and 1888. It looks like the most noticable being the size and font of the word dollars. It also looks like they were getting less detailed by the end of the run.

 

Here is one in the NGC registery from 1887 for comparison.

 

http://coins.www.collectors-society.com/registry/coins/CoinDetail.aspx?PeopleCoinID=549583&PeopleSetID=78084

Link to comment
Share on other sites
robec1347

robec1347

Posted
Posted
That is not quite a good comparison Bob, apparently there were changes made between 1854 and 1888. It looks like the most noticable being the size and font of the word dollars. It also looks like they were getting less detailed by the end of the run.

 

Here is one in the NGC registery from 1887 for comparison.

 

http://coins.www.collectors-society.com/registry/coins/CoinDetail.aspx?PeopleCoinID=549583&PeopleSetID=78084

 

You're right, I noticed the difference after I posted. :P

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Go to topic listing