EagleRJO

From doing a little digging the NGC certification number on their slabs is a 6/7 digit number followed by a dash and a 3 digit coin number. The 6/7 digit number is actually an invoice number. Any regrade submittal would have a different invoice number, and therefore should have a different certification number. PCG$ apparently will also issue a new certification number with a re-grade submittal. So I'm not sure what LDH is referring to.

@JKKwould the doubling (from die deterioration) really be considered as an "error", as deterioration of dies can be considered a normal part of the coin production process over time, particularly for older coins where dies were not as well made and they tried to squeeze every last coin out of dies.

That must be what I was thinking of, but it is strange that a higher grade coin would have the same cert number. The plot thickens.

Someone may have cherrypicked the coin as undegraded, and I think when a coin is re-submitted the original certification number is retained.

BSCE with a minor in material science and structures for me, so welcome to the club. There are a number on the forum with scientific backgrounds. I think the engineering with an emphasis on scientific methods has helped me immensely in pursuing coin collection as a more serous hobby more than anything else.

Well, you got 2 out of 3 for the references correct. Since grading is so important try the "Official Guide to Coin Grading and Counterfeit Detection" as a substitute third. You know which one has to go.

... RWB's opinions. etc.

Definitely one for my "Good, Bad and Ugly" Parking Lot set with PMD if I had found that. May be heat damage combined with impact damage, as it also appears to have a bit of a "dryer coin" appearance.

The following thread has the various NGC slab styles used over the years. Doesn't give you a specific date but will give you a ball park of about when it was slabbed. https://www.sampleslabs.com/ That coin appears to have the latest NGC slab/label with left aligned label text and newer font, so its not addressed in the historical slab references.

You can clearly see a slab gasket around the coin. This may not be a TPG slab, but it is indeed a slabbed coin. I would bet the family ranch that the eBay listing for that coin which appears to be a legit 1909-S VBD penny on the surface at $26 by a seller with zero sales just has a pic of a slabbed coin grabbed from somewhere on the web for the scam listing.

Other reasons aside (ease of selling a coin, registry set requirements, etc.), I would look at value in deciding if you should submit raw coins to be slabbed, not grade. The all-in cost for grading is about $100 per coin, which will only increase the value of an average circulated coin somewhat as a minimum. So if you have say an average circulated raw coin that is worth about $100 and you submit it for grading, you have actually lost money, because you are left with a coin only worth a little more than $100, but you have spent about $100 on grading. Opinions vary on this, but I would say an average circulated coin needs a value of at least around $300 for it to be worth grading. Value is dependent on the coin series and the condition or grade, and in my opinion the grade of a coin is the most difficult to learn how to establish. Concerning that see the post and references by @Sandonabove as a good starting point.

Gee, ya think. I didn't realize before it was listed for $26 with no prior sales by that seller ... likely on eBay. For whatever it's worth the designer initials also seem to match. So either it's legit and the seller has no idea what they have, it's a Chinese knock-off, or just a bait-and-switch pic. But since the seller has zero sales it's likely a knock-off or bait pic. What a complete waste of your money.

https://coinweek.com/counterfeits/counterfeit-coin-09-s-vdb/ Looks like the "S" is shaped correctly and is in one of the known 4 legit positions, and the next thing would be to check the designer's initials. Also it would have to be verified that there was the requisite dot in the upper loop of the "S" mint mark, likely with the coin in hand

Looks like a very old ad for random year (1908 – 1915 & 1925 – 1929) quarter eagles. Look at the PCG$ holder.

Interesting that there was even a chopped 1881-S Morgan.

Interesting that I just stumbled onto a thread with info about upgrades to rail systems that I use.

Oh boy, now you are really dating yourself.

I am very interested in Trade Dollars that have chop marks and came across a very interesting article about them on the Littleton Coin website ... https://www.littletoncoin.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Display|10001|29555|-1||LearnNav|Chop-Marked-Trade-Dollars.html

They have a little bit of a discounted price for the IS storage boxes at Wizard Coin Supply ... https://www.wizardcoinsupply.com/product/intercept-shield-double-protection-box.html Pretty pricy still, and at least for me very valuable coins and bullion go in a safe or deposit box where they wouldn't fit.

I know valuable errors are hard to find. I have a sorting mat with the valuable quarter errors for the roll hunting I have been doing for many years and haven't found anything. Doesn't mean I will stop looking, you never know. My question was more if @JKK viewed a die chip, if it was that, as not being an error because it was more just a normal part of the coining process, which is how I would view it. In my mind anything that is a result of the normal coining process would not be an error, including strikes that have die deterioration with chips, cracks, etc. because that normally occurs, particularly with older dies. That could be a variety, but not an error.

@JKKAre you considering what appears to be a die chip as a normal part of the coining process, and therefore not an error.

I was curious what set that was.

I understand that low humidity storage is desirable, so that Is how I store mine in the OGP and a cardboard box. I just have the regular issue bullion and proof coins going back to 1986. If they were more valuable coins I might consider something like the Intercept Shield boxes if they have them for the proof coins that are kept in the OGP.

@Hoghead515I collect older German coins too, and I like the way they tone. Which set were you thinking about collecting? Slabs are not air tight. I don't know if something like that has happened to slabbed ASE's stored in the Lighthouse Intercept storage boxes in a dry place. I also find that kind of toning unattractive, but to each their own. I stopped collecting ASE's because of issues that have recently developed due to poor US mint procedures, like poor quality capsules and milk spots.

Patience is a virtue with coin collecting, particularly with more expensive ones.