RWB

The roosters, sovereigns, lira, etc were cycled through economies, melted, recoined into something else, bought, sold, and used for jewelry, plating 50 State quarters, contacts in your computer, etc. The form changed, but 29 million oz are mostly still around.

That is understood, and accepted. However, if the differences in surface color are important is some way, then the cause(s) of that difference should be explained. Likewise for alleged alloy changes. We have the technology to reduce or eliminate off-hand guesses and baseless claims. Use technology to solve these pesky issues, and then concentrate on the human parts of "why" and "when."

Do any of those who examined multiple 1933 DE have observations beyond mere "condition?" Thus far, it seems not.

Quintus' "domitus" was leading the cohort that caught Spartacus.

Cleaning with abrasives was commonplace. Many of the NNC coins have been harshly cleaned - made them look "bright."

Very nice example!

Nondestructive elemental testing would reveal alloy changes. Are there visible differences corresponding to the alloy changes you mentioned? One cannot assume al alloy change simply because the surface color seems different.

A change in alloy was assumed, but that is not necessary to change the visual color of coin gold for minting.

Excellent article and a remarkably clear translation from Mandarin. Interesting that molds were not fired at this site.

How so? What was done?

One Recipe for Ruining Coins. Here is another excerpt from Mason's Magazine quoting a letter to the editor. This method will, of course, quickly ruin any coin. “Providence, April 10, 1868 Mr. Mason, Dear Sir — As a collector of coins I feel great interest in the preservation of my favorites and wishing to do my part in keeping them from injury, I forward the following receipts for cleaning and keeping them bright: For cleaning them I make a kind of soft soap, by mixing 1 part of Ammonia to 3 parts sweet oil; I cover the coin with this soap and let it remain on for one day or more according to its condition, then wash in hot water with more soap and polish with the finest tripoli or Spanish white. For keeping Mint cents with all their original lustre, I make a varnish of proof alcohol and white shellac, heat the coin in hot water, wipe dry and while hot cover with a thin coat of varnish…. [N.W.P.]” (NOTE: “Spanish white” is finely ground chalk; “Tripoli,” also called “rotten stone,” is usually made from a finely ground mixture of weathered limestone, diatomite, and amorphous silica in light oil.)

Restriking roosters or sovereigns, etc. served the same purpose as Maria Theresa crowns. Additionally, British restrikes in 1947 were intended to establish the currency of the bullion tokens and reinforce the ability to prosecute counterfeiters.

What did each examiner see? What was the relevance of what they saw? Did they all See-Saw up and down, or merely run in circles 'round the mulberry bush?

Wold be interesting to learn what was seen in examining each of the coins.

Some things don't change --- In another issue, Mason had a contest and one of the awards was for the best method of cleaning coins not using acid.

That's a nice letter. Let's see...if the fine started at 1-cent per day, and doubled each day, what did the borrower have to pay 50 years later?

Yep.

Uhmmm... What are you doing with your hand in your buddy's pocket, fingering his coins...again ? (As for the dime, incorrect annealing temperature/cool down affects all of the coin not just parts of it. After softening, the planchets are cleaned, removing all but the most severe discoloration from copper oxidation. The only consistent visible effect is a coin with reduced detail because the planchet is too hard.)

CLEANSING AND BRIGHTENING COINS. As an evidence of the injury coins sustain by cleansing and polishing, we refer to the recent sale of coins by Messrs. Davis & Harvey, of this city, where a fine set of American Cents brought, at public sale, but $145 ! This set of coins, formerly the property of the late Mr. Brechemin, were originally uncirculated, and possessed a beautiful, natural bronze, which was brushed off for the purpose of giving the cents that bright appearance they possess when fresh from the dies. Had this set of cents—numbering 70 pieces—remained in their original condition they would have sold for $1000; for many of them were the finest specimens in the country. What a warning this should be to collectors having a predilection for brushing and cleaning uncirculated coins. The set above alluded to was purchased by Mr. Long for his museum in this city. [Extract from Mason’s Coin and Stamp Collectors’ Magazine. July 1867, page 32.]

Buyers of this sort of novelty NCLT will not touch a piece with spots. Each time the piece is exposed to air - even opening the original capsule - increases the chance of surface contamination which will eventually become a spot. Do what you want, it's your NCLT and your money.

If you find it, let me know. One of my daughters taught in France and is fluent in regular, technical, and "highfalutin" French. She can translate for you - for a fee, of course.

I have not requested anything from any owner of any alleged 1933 DE. I speculate that 4 or 5 remain at large.

Hopefully you were teasing. There was an extensive program for recoining light weight and mutilated gold and silver US coins. Coins were sorted by denomination, not date/mint. The non-legal tender pieces were melted and struck into coin of the current year. There was no back-dating of US circulation coins. Mintage figures are correct - but what happens after minting is up to the marketplace and circulation.

All U.S. circulation coins are "counted" by aggregate weight, not by the piece. This has been normal for most since removal of silver from coins. and for cents and nickels for even more decades. Samples of coins are pulled for weight, diameter and thickness checks, but nothing more.

The only US gold coins that were found in quantities in Europe were double eagles - and that was only because of size. Sovereigns, Francs, Lira, Napoleons (actually Roosters) were the most commonly saved by individuals, commercial banks, and central banks. Pure gold content was all that mattered. In the middle-East and elsewhere, U.S. gold coins were rarely seen. "During the weeks prior to the Allied invasion of North Africa on November 8, 1942 (Operation Torch), G-2 expert General Mark Clark carried one hundred Louis d’or coins as he and his small party secretly traveled to Algeria in North Africa. They met with Vichy officials including General Charles Mast, the French commander-in-chief in Algiers. The gold was used to bribe local Vichy officials and helped Clark determine if the Americans would be welcomed as liberators or opposed as invaders. Another use for gold coins was in escape kits carried by Allied aircraft during missions in North Africa and the Middle East. During the initial phase of Operation Torch, $700,000 in gold was authorized for use by the Twelfth Air Force in the kits and by General George Patton to reward native informers for speedy performance of essential services where natives would not accept paper currency.[1]" [1] Rundell. p.118. The French gold coins were likely “Roosters” of 20 and 40 Francs, not technically the earlier Louis issues.