zadok

On 4/11/2024 at 3:12 PM, Moxie15 said:

A few years back I read several articles that all said it rook 6 seconds to grade the average coin. Ten coins per minute 600 per hour 4800 per day. Figure 22 working days means 105,600 per month per grader. Three graders should be able to hit the 259,000 number. 

I wonder how many coins are submitted per month.

...i believe that question was already answered in one of the threads....

On 4/11/2024 at 3:34 PM, cladking said:

It is a foregone conclusion because many of these coins have everything going for them.   Circulating coins throughout history have appealed to lots of collectors which is why we have uncirculated barber dimes as well as ancients.  But we also have nice XF coins from series that became almost universally worn in large part because collectors also saved these coins from further circulation.  Most people seem to think that if they ignore moderns they'll just go away but AG 1889 indian cents don't just go away and neither will moderns despite abuse and neglect.   

Very few circulation issue moderns have done very well since WWII but some have seen stupendous increases not so much because they are "hot" or popular.  Indeed, many catalogers won't even report higher prices on moderns because they believe it offends the "real collectors" for who they print their guides.   Prices when they do increase increase because there is suddenly some little demand.  Thus we see higher prices on things like Chinese, Russian, and Indian coins.  There are many beautiful, historic, and important coins (most NCLT) made in the last 75 years with tiny mintages, even mintages well below most classics and they go begging as well. 

This can not persist.  It's already been 75 years so maybe another 75 years but don't bet on it.   There are a large number of new collectors and the only real difference between old coins and new is their age.    

...give me a list of 10 modern coins, legal tender, lets say after 1964 that r not rare varieties that u believe will appreciate in value, lets say double/triple in the next 75 years....

On 4/10/2024 at 6:20 PM, cladking said:

By most definitions of "hot" no moderns circulating coins has ever been hot.  If you extend the definition to include things like the '70-S sm date cent or the 1983 quarter in BU then no "hot" circulating modern has ever decreased in value. 

The reason for this is simple; most people hate moderns.  In order to be hot a lot of people need to buck that trend and then the coin can remain strong on its own merits.  

 

In 1975 a 1960 sm dt cent was the same price as the 1970 sm dt cent.  The value of the '60 cent has eroded to the point it's worth less $2 now if you can find a buyer.  The '70 wholesales at $40 and would be far higher but few people collect modern one cent coins.   Many 1960 sm dts are Gem so it's hard to get a premium.  Very very few '70 sm dts are Gem but few seem to even know it.  

 

As long as circulating moderns are ignored there might never be one that went from hot to not.   

...u mite need to broaden the thread to..."never will be hot..." ?....

On 4/10/2024 at 2:26 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Well, you know how I feel about the confiscation of the 1933 DE's but I've seen nothing abut the 1849 and some others being a target by the U.S. government.   There was some Treasury dunce talking about how the Liberty Nickel's should be seized...but that was some underling in the 1950's.

I maintain that just as FDR's EO on gold confiscation was eventually repealed, the seizing of the 1933's -- and any other coins with a target on their backs -- will also be repealed. 

...well as forrest said..."stupid is as stupid does..." n watching the trends in our elected officials the past few decades its just a matter of time before intelligence levels get below pond scum n some marooney will think its a good idea to revisit all assets for govt reconsiderations... what they dont know wont hurt them nor the rest of the numismatic community....

On 4/9/2024 at 6:16 AM, Fenntucky Mike said:

CAC is still beaning coins.

...yep did some last week n more to do....

On 4/9/2024 at 2:38 PM, VKurtB said:

Could be, or is it the attitude (in Philly)? Keep in mind, Philly Mint employees are probably over represented among Eagles season ticket holders. 

...plus a turd for qb, but then again we r stuck with qa....

On 4/8/2024 at 11:22 PM, VKurtB said:

They do generally produce stronger strikes on circulation coins. Frequent PL’s. 

...its the altitude....

On 4/9/2024 at 12:58 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Well...if you are saying it is illegal like the 1933 DE, yeah, I get your point.

The limited information I have seen says that any and all 1849's are legit.  Just that apparently only 1 survived. 

...besides the legit aspect, would u actually want anyone to even know bout it n that u had it...n would u trust our govt to not try n find a way to take it away from u, their track record is very tarnished...there r several coins out there that r not reflected in any archives, books or commentaries n will most likely remain that way...i have seen a couple that r not supposed to exist n respect the owners desires....

On 4/8/2024 at 10:00 PM, Henri Charriere said:

 

Your complaint will be reviewed when it is received.

At first blush, it appears you have made your feelings known on a number of occasions.

However, one cannot help but notice of the five emojis presently provided -- with the exception of two you used in the fall of 1937,.you seem to be partial to the one expressing sadness.

I was able to conjure 🐓  by simply typing in the word, Rooster.  You may wish to try the same.

...ill pass, there is already way too much gallus gallus domesticus poop on the forum now...n my emojis r all u for u n ur condition...fyi ngc declined to add my requests, oh well maybe next time....

On 4/8/2024 at 10:38 AM, cladking said:

We're talking apples and oranges here.   I'm talking about original BU rolls and you're talking about mint set rolls.  While most mint set rolls sell at a significant premium there are several dates that trade at Greysheet which is based on original rolls.  Greysheet price for the non-existent original rolls are so close to face value and the demand so limited that it's hardly surprising there would be no interest at your coin club.  It is a little surprising that you're seeing mint set rolls but it just goes to show what I'm saying; there are no rolls and the mint sets are gone.  

If you ever do see any original rolls I'd be interested in knowing what dates they are.  

While I like mint set rolls a lot potential buyers should be aware that most of these rolls are cast offs.  Cherry pickers go through large numbers of sets and remove the varieties and Gems.  Some will even cut deep into the chBU's.  You want to look at these rolls before buying them.   The best chBU rolls are missing only the top 1% of coins and the bottom 40%.   

There could be some sellers putting mint set coins into wrappers because there is all of a sudden some demand for clad BU rolls.   These will be easy to spot with some experience because most mint set coins do not look like the original roll coins.  A good rule of thumb is if you see a BU roll of these coins it is NOT an original roll and is merely another 40 or 50 cut up mint sets.  Original rolls are almost non-existent and tend to be low grade anyway.  

...no, im talking bout bank rolls that collectors ordered or got from their local banks each year not assembled coin rolls from mint sets...example, recent local estate...gentleman died like 20 years ago, his children just got around to selling his coin collection last year through several sessions of auctions due to volume of coins, 42,000 pocket change in coffee cans plus all his whitman blue trifolds n 3000-4000 mint sets n over 2000 bank rolls of nickels, dimes, quarters n halves...he started buying rolls soon after the big rush on 1950-D nickels, his bank rolls ran from 1952-1978 when he quit buying rolls...i attended every auction session n bought just about everything i wanted, silver sold for silver n post 64 sold for face, none of the local collectors wanted rolls of anything...a few came to me n wanted to know if i wanted to sell individual coins or could they go thru the rolls...nada...i wholesaled out the entire lot including the 10,000 circ wheat pennies i had to buy as a lot to get a couple of linc bank rolls i wanted...my one collector son wanted all the 63-64 wash qrts to check for varieties, i personally did not check any of the coins....

On 4/8/2024 at 10:20 AM, cladking said:

Banks were not set up to honor such requests.   No doubt some asked anyway and no doubt banks sometimes accommodated them.  But the fact is nobody wanted the coins so the number of requests was very limited.  There were more requests for pennies and nickels.  

Most of the banks I walked into refused me.   Even my own bank thought it was strange I wanted a bag of quarters and made me jump through hoops to get them.  

...i never had any issues with it, even with quarters n halves....

On 4/8/2024 at 12:14 PM, VKurtB said:

I’m starting to feel a little bulletproof/immortal. This is my fourth cancer event and I keep “winning”. I have to thank the good people of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania for state government retiree health insurance coverage that makes NOT going to doctors silly. I think about my sister’s situation on “Obamacare” wherein she HAS TO AVOID getting medical care due to obscene deductibles and co-pays. She worked as a private businesswoman her whole life, is now 60, and she literally can’t afford to go to a doctor because she has Obamacare. 
 

The other thing is nobody in Alabama can even CONCEIVE of medical coverage as robust as I have. My policy allows for 100 home health visits per year, paid in full. The specialist who made my wife’s orthotic inserts never had even one patient with coverage for them. I had it due to PA government service. 
 

Even though I was never union, my coverage was mirrored from union negotiated contracts in a union-friendly state for the union-friendly party’s employees. My coverage is, (how do they put it?) fire. 

...u r very fortunate n u need it as well...obamacare is neither care nor cure more of oscrewucare...i am equally fortunate n have no premiums nor co-pays n covered head to toe, eliminates a lot of stress that other folks who worked all their lives n cant afford nor receive adequate care have to deal with, i reflect on that often when buying something i dont need (read coins) n think bout others trying buy food or medicine for their families, not a fair world, but i earned what i have...Godspeed on ur surgery....

On 4/8/2024 at 12:21 PM, Mike Meenderink said:

Ok thanks for your permission that is very nice of you to let me do something. I feel free now.

...ur welcome....

On 4/8/2024 at 10:10 AM, cladking said:

Just to be clear I like the post 1999 coinage and save some of it myself.  I collect some as well.   I believe opportunities abound to both make money and learn a great deal from collecting the coins.  But the fact is all of the coins since 1999 have been saved in some (limited) quantity and some in vast quantities.  I believe all coins are collectible but it seems I might be the only one who believes pre-'99 clad is collectible.  

...i think u may be onto something there in that last part....

On 4/8/2024 at 10:02 AM, cladking said:

You can also find some penny and nickel rolls dated from '68 to '99 but it's not like you can trade in 5 1969 nickel rolls for a roll of '69 quarters.  

You can also find rolls of '76 quarters without too much trouble.   I'd be surprised if '97 and '98 quarters are really scarce.  

I've been in dozens of coin shops and scoured coin shows for decades and haven't seen even a couple hundred rolls and NONE AT ALL in 25 years.  What I do see is pennies, nickels, and the occasional half or dollar.  I see stacks of pre-1965 BU rolls and since 1999 I see vast numbers of post-'99 coinage.  

Maybe it's hard to see what's not there.  

...theres a reason they r not in the shops or at the shows, there r no buyers n they dont sell n the dealers r not going carry them around or take up space with them....

On 4/8/2024 at 10:03 AM, cladking said:

Until 1999 the mint sold no rolls.  

...but u could go into ur local bank n request they obtain mint boxes or bags before then....

On 4/8/2024 at 9:52 AM, cladking said:

...And how many 1965 to 1999 dime and quarter rolls do you see?   

...more than i can carry, as mentioned these sell at face....

...this thread has been done before but go for it...no real down side to it....

...we definitely need a broader variety of emojis on this forum....

On 4/7/2024 at 10:39 PM, VKurtB said:

I am still an ANA Life member. I am still on the Membership and Outreach Committee. I am still on the Exhibiting Committee. I recently (at the March show) renewed my membership in the George F. Heath Society ($1,000 contribution per annum). But I am no longer a National Volunteer. That means I am no longer OBLIGATED to be at every show for all days plus two on the front end, and frequently one on the back end. Rosemont simply does not work for me like it did when I could hop on Amtrak and kick back. I MIGHT go again, if there is something adequately compelling to see or do. As of now, this year is NOT looking like one of those shows. Getting to and through Chicagoland from the Deep South is a pain in the backside I’d rather not do again. It needs to be an awesome thing. 
 

I’ll be in Atlanta next February, Okie City in August 2025, and Pittsburgh in August 2026. But as of NOW, not Rosemont this year, nor perhaps any other. I’ll get my “freak on” at Summer FUN instead. 
 

One note: if I survive until Pittsburgh, I will have outlived my mother, and I am having cancer surgery #4 on this coming Wednesday. A melanoma in the middle of my back. Either that, or a gunshot wound I missed. 

...my prayers r with u...u still have much to contribute....

On 4/7/2024 at 10:20 PM, VKurtB said:

In that case, allow me to introduce myself. Solid BU rolls are LEGION in central Pennsylvania. Every coin club auction, every public coin auction, every flea market table, virtually EVERYWHERE. I currently hold about 700ish solid BU rolls. Various dates. My most recent purchase was, all by itself, in excess of 100 rolls.  And other than those, there are about five GALLONS of miscellaneous cents. Am I “normal”. Aw hellz naw. 

...ditto central ohio, western pa, western wv, southern ind, northern ky...i go to several weekly coin auctions in that geographical area, bank rolls of wash qrts, roos dimes, jeff nickels, linc cents r always being sold often by the bank boxes...the post '64 dates sell for face plus auctioneers 10%, the pre '64 silver wash n roos normally silver plus 5-10 % sometimes under melt plus auctioneers 10 %...i buy the silver if under n ship to my refiner when silver moves the post '64 stuff just sell in bulk to local flea dealers, never open any of them, there r often several hundred rolls sold i see no dearth of any of these if one wants them....

On 4/5/2024 at 7:06 PM, Henri Charriere said:

Before you affix that epitaph to stone, I present you with one brain teaser and one brain twister.

1-  The ampersand (&) was once the 27th letter of the alphabet.

2-  DAVID RICE ATCHISON was once President of the United States.

If you or anyone else requests, nay, DEMANDS an explanation or the legitimate source of these assertions, I shall be happy to oblige after a decent and appropriate interval.

...more classic textbook...feeble attempts at deflection...so sad....

On 4/5/2024 at 6:25 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

1849 Double Eagle:  It's generally said that there is only 1 survivor (might be another 2-3 struck but destroyed)....it's in the Smithsonsian.

But Bower's Red Book says there was talk of another 1849 DE struck for Treasury Secretary William Meredith (d. 1873)...his estate handing it down to Philly dealer William Nagy, who told Breen in the 1950's that it was in a private collection. 

I know Breen's reputation for hyperbole and outright falsehoods but I was wondering if anybody has read or heard of anything regarding the possibility of a 2nd coin being struck.  You would think that with over 70 years since the story came out -- and over 175 since it was last seen -- that it would have come public by now. 

The references to Meredith and Nagy in the Bowers Red Book are the only ones I have come across.  And it IS 20 years old, so maybe stuff has come out to debunk this since.  But I haven't seen it. 

...if u owned this coin today, would u publicize ur ownership?...think bout it....

On 4/5/2024 at 9:05 AM, Jason Abshier said:

Maybe so … But if it wasn’t for the two top dogs , CAC wouldn’t have existed . Why doesn’t he accept ANACS coins ? Everyone blows them off , I was once at coin show a buyer asked dealer why he marked his ANACS coin up so high close to PCGS coin … dealer told him the coin is PQ regardless what holder it was in !!! It was a nice coin , but the buyer still demanded price should be dropped simply because it’s in ANACS holder … common kool-aid drinker’s remarks I’ve heard over the years … PCGS / NGC / CACG/CAC are all market grading for their financial gains in the market whatever float someone’s boat so be it 

...everyone sees this issue thru their own lens...i just go by what i see in the fundamentals, what my own personal experiences show me n from what some of the founders of all 4 of those organizations have related to me...other persons experiences often have personal biases involved...time will tell all....

On 4/5/2024 at 8:37 AM, wfisher said:

Is this anything special?

...nope....