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The "Consortium"

Started by Connecticoin,

226 posts in this topic

TomB

TomB

Posted
Posted
Haven't you heard of the magic felt pad $10 Indian? Or the AT Peace dollar? Or the AT gobrecht dollar? Or the puttied Saint of Laura? All slabbed.

 

It does indeed happen wayyyyyy too much.

 

Why don't you show us some evidence, photos, etc. of these. What was the grading service response when this was shown to them? I would have more respect for your argument if you could show some concrete evidence with photos. I thought your group was going to have a website by Sept 1 - where is it?

 

While I don't see CAC affecting the cheap, less than $1000 stuff I do, certainly it may benefit the guy who is putting together the MS 65 $2.5 Indian Set - just show me some verifiable data on (1) this fellows risk without CAC coins and (2) cost of your service. Rather than send such expensive material out in the mail won't he want to bring it to one of your reps in person? If so where?

The coins mentioned in the TDN post were fairly well documented on the PCGS boards. The $10 Indian eagle thread was deleted by the PCGS moderators, I believe, but the content of it was something along the lines of the coin had something on its surface and when PCGS broke it out of the slab and put it on a felt pad that the apparent contaminant disappeared and the coin looked pristine. The NGC AT Peace dollar was an awful AT job that was sold raw on ebay for $50-$100 only to subsequently get certified by NGC and then offered by one of the PCGS toned coin dealers, who happens to have a rabid following of both educated and completely naive customers, for $12,000 or $14,000 before it was pointed out that the coin was AT. I believe NGC took the coin off the market. The AT Gobrecth was more recent and the images might be on both the NGC and PCGS boards, but the coin was a white or nearly white example that was sold and then appeared shortly thereafter with significant toning in a Heritage auction. It was in a PCGS holder. The puttied double eagle that Legend owned was the subject of a thread on the PCGS boards a few years ago and the resolution was publicly posted, but I do not know if in the PCGS paranoia that has devoured the company in the last year or so if that thread was allowed to stay. Originally PCGS would not make good on any guarantee on that coin, if I remember correctly, but after Laura made a major scene on the boards, in my opinion, the coin was removed from the market by PCGS, I believe.

 

There is also the case of the Silver American Eagle with blatant AT that even PCI called AT, but was sent into PCGS where they graded it MS68 or some such nonsense. I think braddick owns that coin and he has graciously and openly shared the story and images on both boards, including the images in the PCI AT holder and PCGS holder.

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MarkFeld

MarkFeld

Posted
Posted
Regarding the concept of assigning a level of quality of a coin with letters such as A, B and C, which as far as I know, is only one of the possibilities floating around about how CAC could represent the results of their evaluation.

 

I guess first of all does anyone have or read any more information regarding that concept?

 

Secondly, isn't it true that graders at NGC used to internally and not publicly disclosed, the use A, B and C to designate the high, middle and low end of the spectrum of a grade such as MS 65A versus MS 65C?

 

Regardless of the acceptance or reluctance to accept CAC and it's purpose, it will be interesting I think to see what the final plan is and how it will work.

 

Rey

 

Rey, to my knowledge, CAC will NOT be using A, B and C qualifiers.

 

Some time before I started grading at NGC in 1991, at least some graders assigned A, B or C ratings to coins internally. While I graded there (from 1991-1998), as graders, we were free to include comments in our grade opinions when we entered them into the computer. And, while I didn't use letters, there were numerous occasions where, for example, I would type something like" 65.9" or "66.1" to indicate a just miss or just make it 66. Also, there were times where I would type something like "MS65 QT" to indicate I had a question about the coin's toning. Each of us had our own way/system of letting the other graders know what we thought about the coins.

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MikeInFL

MikeInFL

Posted
Posted
The AT Gobrecth was more recent and the images might be on both the NGC and PCGS boards, but the coin was a white or nearly white example that was sold and then appeared shortly thereafter with significant toning in a Heritage auction. It was in a PCGS holder.

 

Here are the before and after photos of the AT Gobrecht:

 

original.jpg

original.jpg

original.jpg

original.jpg

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James_OldeTowne

James_OldeTowne

Posted
Posted
Sorry, Here's the right one:

 

[images deleted]

 

And a link to the thread on it:

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1570443&page=0&fpart=1

 

My apologies....Mike

I remember this coin. It was an ugly coin before - and a hideous coin after. The sad thing is, it might have looked much better had it been allowed to patiently sit in an old time album for a few years.

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