Wanted Honest Opinion on what you think these will grade at 1 1

[SatoshiSpeaks]

These were from PCIthe 1961 and 1962 were graded at PR 70 Deep Cameo and the 1962 was deemed a DDO 1962 Deep Cameo PR 69 would like to know if there worth going for a graded pr 70 for any thanks

[cobymordet]

Hi and welcome to the forum.  I don't see a 1961 coin, just 2 1962's.  Also, a couple of your photos are blurred.  Unfortunately, I cannot definitively see the DDO on either coin, but sometimes it can be deceptive with certain lighting.  If possible, please take clear and cropped photos of OBV/REV for each coin.  The first coin pictured seems discolored in the lower left field.  I am surprised it would get as high as 69/70, but I am not well enough versed in grading to provide a learned opinion.  Better photos will allow for additional inspection and a more accurate determination.

[SatoshiSpeaks]

Sorry it didn't let me add the pictures. Here are some of the others

[SatoshiSpeaks]

[SatoshiSpeaks]

[SatoshiSpeaks]

And I do notice the discoloring on the 1962 quarter as well but unsure if pcgs would identify a DDO if it was a proof coin. And unsure if it's even worth is since it has discoloring black will lower a grading score. But if it is a DDO then maybe it's worth more. But since it's a proof wouldn't it be not considered a DDO?

[SatoshiSpeaks]

Since I have not sent them out yet and I just cracked them out I don't want to retake pictures other then these available I'm to clumsy

[SatoshiSpeaks]

Since I have not sent them out yet and I just cracked them out I don't want to retake pictures other then these available I'm to clumsy  here them in the sleves

[cobymordet]

On 3/12/2024 at 1:54 AM, SatoshiSpeaks said:

And I do notice the discoloring on the 1962 quarter as well but unsure if pcgs would identify a DDO if it was a proof coin. And unsure if it's even worth is since it has discoloring black will lower a grading score. But if it is a DDO then maybe it's worth more. But since it's a proof wouldn't it be not considered a DDO?

I am sorry, but I can't answer that for you.  We will await the smart guys to chime in.  You may not want to crack out a coin if it has been authenticated, not until you know exactly what your going to do with the coin.  Better to err on the side of caution.  Allows you to have additional options.

[SatoshiSpeaks]

They all said Deep Cameo but again not sure if they will get that grade from pcgs or ngc. The 1961 and 1962 were PR 70 Deep Cameo.  And that 1962 with black was pr 69 Deep cameo DDO but idk if I'd get even Deep cameo I find it hard to see on the tails reverse sides on quarters but maybe that's just me... literally am sending them directly to them from 2 1/2 straight from the slab been in the slabs for years since

[SatoshiSpeaks]

Well The  slabs they came from were not a standard company that's note worthy so I have to go with ngc or pcgs do that I can get the grade for them to be worth anything. I'm hoping I get some info though. I know the 2 coins will most likely get pr 68 or 69 but not sure if the deep cameo will stick. The think I don't know tho is about the DDO with the blacking going on. If it's a DDO it will be worth something but to have DDO and cameo idk I'm not lucky enough for that to be deemed but who knows the image doesn't do it justice though. 

[SatoshiSpeaks]

Here's some pictures to show with lighting to tell if there cameo or not

Edited March 12 by SatoshiSpeaks

[Sandon]

   Welcome to the NGC chat board.

   Unfortunately, it is at best difficult to predict the numerical grades of mint state and proof coins based on photos, and to predict whether a coin would receive a numerical grade between "68" and "70" would, in my opinion be impossible to determine from photos. The grading of such coins involves in-person examination of the coin under good lighting from varying angles, both with and without magnification.  (Although you have provided a number of photos, none of them both shows each full side of each coin and is cropped to show only the coin and not the surface surrounding it, as we prefer.)

   NGC has never awarded a grade of "70" to a proof Washington quarter dated before 1964.  See  Washington Quarters (1932-1998) | Coin Census Population Report | NGC (ngccoin.com) (click "PF" at top right).  PCGS has graded a total of 29 pieces dated between 1960 and 1963 "PR 70" out of many thousands submitted. See https://www.pcgs.com/pop/detail/washington-quarter-1932-1998/112?ccid=0&t=3&p=PR. Just based on these statistics, your chances of receiving a "70" grade on any of these coins are at best slim and nil.  

   For NGC to award a coin a "70" grade, the coin must show "no post-production imperfections at 5x magnification".  NGC Coin Grading Scale | About Coin Grades | NGC. PCGS describes such a coin as "fully struck and lustrous, free of visual marks." https://www.pcgs.com/grades#grade70. Grading also involves subjective factors such as "eye appeal", which on a coin graded "70" would have to be exceptional. I note smudges and spotty toning on several of your coins, which could be regarded as negative factors that would prevent the award of a "70" grade.  I doubt that these common proof coins would be worthy of submission, especially if your sole criterion is that they grade "70". (One of the 1962 quarters may be worthy of a "cameo" designation, and if you concur on in-person examination, check current price guides to determine whether the value would make submission worthwhile.)

   Here are photos of a proof 1963 quarter in my collection that NGC graded "PF 68" and which, based on the photos, looks at least as nice as yours:

   

   

   

[Coinbuf]

Your decision to crack these out seems not a good one from your photos.   Granted photos don't always tell the full story, but just from photos I see your chances of anything over PF67 as remote.  In hand I might have a different opinion. 

You would have been better off submitting to PCGS for crossover at the current grade or perhaps one grade less.  NGC doesn't offer the crossover option except for PCGS graded coins.

I am unclear what motivated you to crack these from the PCI holders, but my opinion is you just lost a lot of value. 

In the future if you want a coin in NGC or PCGS plastic is is better to buy the coin already in that plastic unless you are an expert grader.

Edited March 12 by Coinbuf

[Mike Meenderink]

d

[Mike Meenderink]

[Mike Meenderink]

The coins above are for comparison to your coins. Each of these coins were submitted by me. Your coins are almost there. You should have left them in the holders. The value of some of these coins is not worth the submission costs unless you KNOW they will grade high. Knowledge is key.

[powermad5000]

I am not completely sure but I think PCI was a lower level coin grading and slabbing service that has been sold and resold numerous times. As far as I know about them, your original PCI grades are probably not as good as stated on their labels. My argument with their slabs stems from several years ago when a rash of Morgan dollars in PCI slabs appeared on eBay with too numerous of them graded as MS 68. MS 68 Morgan Dollars are typically 5-6 figure coins and there are very few graded that high. For many dozens of them to appear in the marketplace at that grade level threw a red flag at me and I inspected some of these listings using my own grading skills on one of the types I am very familiar with and have well over 100 NGC graded. I determined these PCI slabbed Morgans if graded by NGC would probably have graded no higher than MS 64 and most would have been 63 or 62. I am only saying this as I think PCI highly overgraded most of the coins in their slabs. While they may have gotten it right here or there, I would estimate overall, they are probably too high on 8 out of 10 slabs.

Your coins were probably in this population of PCI overgrades to begin with. That said, it is nearly impossible to tell from photos of proofs what they would grade as because one tilt of the coin in proper lighting could expose a single flaw that could diminish the grade by at least one point or possibly more.

As for Proofs having a DDO or DDR characteristic to them, it is wholly and entirely possible for that to happen. As an example, I own a 1957 Lincoln Cent NGC graded as a TDR (Tripled Die Reverse). You could look in NGC's Variety Plus if your proposed DDO matches a recognized variety that NGC would attribute.