Do you think these matte proofs can be helped? 0

[ldhair]

I'm not sure that NCS would even touch these. I don't see many good results with prints and spots on copper. 

[RWB]

The top coin appears the have been handled and is not uncirculated, that is, it would be PR58. I agree that it might be too far gone for  conservation to help.

The bottom coin might be helped - esp the reverse.

[gmarguli]

Neither the fingerprint nor the carbon spots are coming off. 

The haze on the 1911 could likely be removed and get a better looking coin. The 1914 looks like someone already tried to make it look better and failed. 

[VKurtB]

I would like to see the results of several chemical baths used on these matte proofs, but they're not my coins, so it's easy for me to say. How old are the fingerprints on the 1911?

[Henri Charriere]

🐓:  I know of no one, "mad scientist" or not, who would dare tamper with these vintage, much-vaunted proof cents.  I do not know how old the 'prints are, but, relying on the standard eight points of identification, believe they belonged to Henrietta ""Hetty" Howland Robinson Green, better known as "The Witch of Wall Street," the richest woman in America at the turn of the century, circa 1901, who amassed a fortune of $100 million ($2.5 B in today's dollars). One of her sons owned one of the 1913 Liberty Head nickels; another lost his leg when he was denied entry to a charity hospital when his miserly mother adamantly refused to have him admitted to a private hospital in NYC.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 1/5/2024 at 10:51 PM, Henri Charriere said:

🐓:  I know of no one, "mad scientist" or not, who would dare tamper with these vintage, much-vaunted proof cents.  I do not know how old the 'prints are, but, relying on the standard eight points of identification, believe they belonged to Henrietta ""Hetty" Howland Robinson Green, better known as "The Witch of Wall Street," the richest woman in America at the turn of the century, circa 1901, who amassed a fortune of $100 million ($2.5 B in today's dollars). One of her sons owned one of the 1913 Liberty Head nickels; another lost his leg when he was denied entry to a charity hospital when his miserly mother adamantly refused to have him admitted to a private hospital in NYC.

You think those coins once belonged to Hetty Green ?

If someone is selling them as proofs, not knowing their provenance, then they could be worth purchasing based on the lineage of ownership alone.

But I wonder how one would trace these to the Colonel and his mother. 

[robec1347]

What a shame. I don’t know of anything that would totally bring them back. 

[Henri Charriere]

On 1/5/2024 at 10:56 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

You think those coins once belonged to Hetty Green ?

If someone is selling them as proofs, not knowing their provenance, then they could be worth purchasing based on the lineage of ownership alone.

But I wonder how one would trace these to the Colonel and his mother. 

 

On 1/5/2024 at 10:56 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

You think those coins once belonged to Hetty Green ?

🐓  Certainly not!  But as the Great z once observed, the operative word is "believe."  At the risk of incurring the further wrath of the OP who recently stated he was interested in downsizing his holdings, I am providing a possible narrative. When you are talking about damaged goods, you need one. (This in no way detracts from the fact the quintessential Quintus punked you a la Ashton Kutcher!) 🤣   

[GoldFinger1969]

LD, do you own these or are considering buying them ?

What did you pay for them if you own them and what are they worth if you could somehow get them back to their original, un-stained condition ?

[ldhair]

On 1/6/2024 at 9:33 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

LD, do you own these or are considering buying them ?

What did you pay for them if you own them and what are they worth if you could somehow get them back to their original, un-stained condition ?

I have owned them for about 30 something years. I'm still at FUN and can't get to my records but I don't have that much in them. I didn't see the print when it went to PCI. It started to show over the years. The spots on the 1914 were very minor when I bought it. They grew much darker over the years. I'll probably send them to auction with the rest of my set of matte proofs.

Thanks all for confirming my thoughts. I'll just save the conservation fees and let someone else deal with it. 

[GoldFinger1969]

On 1/6/2024 at 3:41 PM, ldhair said:

I have owned them for about 30 something years. I'm still at FUN and can't get to my records but I don't have that much in them. I didn't see the print when it went to PCI. It started to show over the years. The spots on the 1914 were very minor when I bought it. They grew much darker over the years. I'll probably send them to auction with the rest of my set of matte proofs.

Thanks all for confirming my thoughts. I'll just save the conservation fees and let someone else deal with it. 

It's frustrating to see coins change.  Had my first one change on me.....a PL Morgan....like creeping black fungus around the edge on both the obverse and reverse.

120 years and nothing...including probably 15-20 or more in a holder......and THEN it changes.  WTF....

Edited January 7 by GoldFinger1969

[Just Bob]

Unlike most other collectors, that fingerprint on the 1911 does not bother me. The little round spot in front of Lincoln's upper lip does cause some concern, though. Still, I intend to keep an eye on it when it comes up for auction.