I had to have it 1 1

[J P M]

I have been working on my westward journey nickels set. I have quite a a few MS 66 coins but for some reason the 2004 P Handshake has been a hard coin to get in my price range. I don't know why this coin always bids out way over price. Sometimes $20 to $100 over the High retail price. This is not a rare coin at 361,440,000  What is it with this being one of those coins that people just bid out on. So that's My rant for the day...... Anyway I found this very nice MS66 from a Dealer on eBay and I must say it is a good looking coin and I did not have to play the crazy bid war to get it   

Edited October 28, 2023 by J P M

[Mike Meenderink]

Very nice coin. This series is one of those that IMO will be under collected in high mint state. Some also see this series as a possible future gain coin since most of the 361 plus million are in and have been in heavy circulation. Who knows in 25 years this coin may be rare in MS 66 and higher. I have some of these Westward Nickels raw that are pretty nice since I pulled them from rolls in the early 2000s.

Edited October 27, 2023 by Mike Meenderink

[EagleRJO]

On 10/27/2023 at 3:02 PM, J P M said:

What is it with this being one of those coins that people just bid out on

I am still running into that on quite a few coins still on my list, like people continue to have pandemic slush funds to burn.

[Lem E]

I don’t think the Philly coins came out of the grading room very well and then people are probably looking for the DDO as well. The Denver coins are easier to find in higher grades. I still don’t have a P Handshake example yet. 

[J P M]

On 10/27/2023 at 5:57 PM, Lem E said:

I don’t think the Philly coins came out of the grading room very well and then people are probably looking for the DDO as well. The Denver coins are easier to find in higher grades. I still don’t have a P Handshake example yet. 

Yes, I find some coins are just a mystery why they bid the way they do. I just don't get it. 67 and 68s are out there but do not show up very often

[Henri Charriere]

....just hadda havit.  Now, where have I heard that before?  Back in 2019.  I was sitting up in bed, minding my own business, recovering from surgery, when I inadvertently happened to glance down and see a 1904 Venezuelan 20 Bolivar coin and, after giving it the once over, thought, not just "I have to get it" but "It's mine!" IT'S MINE!!!  I beat out 30-plus bidders, now get this, for a coin I never knew existed, did not need -- and ultimately did not particularly want. I felt sorry for all the other bidders who had no inkling after nearly a week, they were all destined to be losers. [I sold it and actually got more for it than I paid.]

As Archie would say to Edith, J.P.... you done good J.P, you done good!

 

[Lem E]

On 10/27/2023 at 7:52 PM, J P M said:

Yes, I find some coins are just a mystery why they bid the way they do. I just don't get it. 67 and 68s are out there but do not show up very often

Not as abundant as one would think. 
 

2004 P Handshake pops NGC

MS-66 / 184 

MS-66 PL / 16

MS-67 / 51

MS-67 PL / 11

MS-68 / 0

MS-68 PL / 1

[Halbrook Family]

Would this be the same nickel? I mean if you pulled it from a uncirculated set and all? I like collecting nickels. My Dansco book only goes to 2000 though. 

[powermad5000]

I am wondering if in part this goes back to an earlier discussion started by @Lem E about the striking quality between P and D, also evidenced in my post about the Vegas cash machine nickel. Maybe @J P M it is not a question of raw mintage number but of it just being harder to find higher quality P strikes and then also combining this with some of the current unexplained "overbidding" which is still going on for over two to three years now. I was doing some looking at different coin types for sale the other day and noticed that some certain types seem to be going for over price guide figures (was looking out of curiosity at the Lincoln cent 4 cent series and noted that Professional Life seemed to be going at reasonable prices, but Presidency was running high). All I can guess is certain types combined with mintmark are harder to find in good grades (seems P is the more difficult to find).

[J P M]

On 10/28/2023 at 10:11 AM, edhalbrook said:

Would this be the same nickel? I mean if you pulled it from a uncirculated set and all? I like collecting nickels. My Dansco book only goes to 2000 though. 

That would be a mint set. I do not pull sets apart for books or folders I only pick roll hunted coins for that. For my collections of graded coins I buy coins other people paid to have graded it's cheaper that way. 

[dprince1138]

I have noticed buyers on ebay looking to fill collections with high unc ratings and high luster, including paying premium prices.

 

[J P M]

On 10/28/2023 at 12:04 PM, powermad5000 said:

I am wondering if in part this goes back to an earlier discussion started by @Lem E about the striking quality between P and D, also evidenced in my post about the Vegas cash machine nickel. Maybe @J P M it is not a question of raw mintage number but of it just being harder to find higher quality P strikes and then also combining this with some of the current unexplained "overbidding" which is still going on for over two to three years now. I was doing some looking at different coin types for sale the other day and noticed that some certain types seem to be going for over price guide figures (was looking out of curiosity at the Lincoln cent 4 cent series and noted that Professional Life seemed to be going at reasonable prices, but Presidency was running high). All I can guess is certain types combined with mintmark are harder to find in good grades (seems P is the more difficult to find).

I have always found Denver coins to be a better strike and almost proof like many times. Even though the Denver dies for years were made at Philly they were better looking ? I think it is as Lem said Not as many of these coins are graded high and also people are looking for the DD ones. Many times it is the Denver coin that is the hard to find coin . Supply and demand is what it is and some is and some ain't.   

[Halbrook Family]

On 10/28/2023 at 4:17 PM, J P M said:

That would be a mint set. I do not pull sets apart for books or folders I only pick roll hunted coins for that. For my collections of graded coins I buy coins other people paid to have graded it's cheaper that way. 

But technically it's the same coin right? Not sure if this is a dumb question but is the coin from a uncirculated set the same as a uncirculated roll coin? I have been putting together a BU nickel set. To get the whole set you would have to split up a set or two. Off the top of my head the 2017 enhanced nickel only came in the set. .  

[J P M]

On 11/3/2023 at 12:04 PM, edhalbrook said:

But technically it's the same coin right? Not sure if this is a dumb question but is the coin from a uncirculated set the same as a uncirculated roll coin? I have been putting together a BU nickel set. To get the whole set you would have to split up a set or two. Off the top of my head the 2017 enhanced nickel only came in the set. .  

I would say you are good to go with taking coins from mint sets. Many people do just that to make up coin folders. Uncirculated coin rolls may only be labeled that way unless they are directly from the Mint. Bank rolls are not necessarily uncirculated although you may find some acceptable coins that way . 

[Sandon]

On 11/3/2023 at 12:04 PM, edhalbrook said:

is the coin from a uncirculated set the same as a uncirculated roll coin?

 Yes, coins in uncirculated coin a.k.a. mint sets are generally the same issues as the coins issued for circulation, with the exception of coins issued in 2005-2010 uncirculated sets, which were made with what the mint called a "satin finish" that is somewhat duller in appearance than the coins issued for circulation.

[Lem E]

On 11/3/2023 at 11:17 AM, Sandon said:

 Yes, coins in uncirculated coin a.k.a. mint sets are generally the same issues as the coins issued for circulation, with the exception of coins issued in 2005-2010 uncirculated sets, which were made with what the mint called a "satin finish" that is somewhat duller in appearance than the coins issued for circulation.

This is pulled directly from the mint website from the 2020 mint set page. I don’t see this on any of the mint set pages for other years.

United States Mint uncirculated coins are struck on special presses using greater force than circulating coins, producing a sharp, intricately detailed image. 
 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwikv7HVrqiCAxVfjYkEHSmCCsEQFnoECBMQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fcatalog.usmint.gov%2Funcirculated-coin-set-2020-20RJ.html&usg=AOvVaw1Uszgxs427OEy1akcarO_v&opi=89978449
 

 

Edited November 3, 2023 by Lem E

[J P M]

On 11/3/2023 at 1:36 PM, Lem E said:

This is pulled directly from the mint website from the 2020 mint set page. I don’t see this on any other of the mint set pages for other years.

United States Mint uncirculated coins are struck on special presses using greater force than circulating coins, producing a sharp, intricately detailed image. 
 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwikv7HVrqiCAxVfjYkEHSmCCsEQFnoECBMQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fcatalog.usmint.gov%2Funcirculated-coin-set-2020-20RJ.html&usg=AOvVaw1Uszgxs427OEy1akcarO_v&opi=89978449
 

 

Wow the older mint sets were coins they found on the bottom of the bin . LoL  just a joke .. But all my old mint set coins are not very nice.

[Halbrook Family]

On 11/3/2023 at 9:15 AM, J P M said:

I would say you are good to go with taking coins from mint sets. Many people do just that to make up coin folders. Uncirculated coin rolls may only be labeled that way unless they are directly from the Mint. Bank rolls are not necessarily uncirculated although you may find some acceptable coins that way . 

So true uncirculated roll coins would be the same coin in the whole roll to be truly uncirculated. That would mainly be the way to know they came from mint? I just got back from the bank. A different bank then usual. I don't personally have a bank account. I got a credit union which is too far away. I usually get coin rolls from a local check cashing place and they don't charge me for rolls. Got some silver half dollars there when I got $150 in halves. I picked up right now $10 in nickels and $100 in halves. 

JPM what do you look for when going through nickels? On the 1977 one the d is always a blob. I think someone mentioned it in another post about a 1976 coin. You guys showed me a great page on penny variations but is there one for halves? 

[Lem E]

On 11/3/2023 at 12:43 PM, J P M said:

Wow the older mint sets were coins they found on the bottom of the bin . LoL  just a joke .. But all my old mint set coins are not very nice.

I’m not sure when this started. Probably more modern sets.

[EagleRJO]

On 11/3/2023 at 1:36 PM, Lem E said:

This is pulled directly from the mint website from the 2020 mint set page. I don’t see this on any of the mint set pages for other years.

United States Mint uncirculated coins are struck on special presses using greater force than circulating coins, producing a sharp, intricately detailed image.

Aren't the "uncirculated" mint sets what people normally refer to as "burnished".  Perhaps that's why there is a difference in the description from the typical proof mint sets.

[Sandon]

On 11/3/2023 at 3:41 PM, EagleRJO said:

Aren't the "uncirculated" mint sets what people normally refer to as "burnished"?

   To my knowledge, the only coins referred to as "burnished" uncirculated are the uncirculated Silver Eagles (ASEs) with "W" mintmarks that the mint has sold directly to collectors since 2006. I've never seen much difference between their surfaces and those of the bullion issue ASEs without mintmarks that are sold in bulk through distributors.

On 11/3/2023 at 1:36 PM, Lem E said:

This is pulled directly from the mint website from the 2020 mint set page. I don’t see this on any of the mint set pages for other years.

United States Mint uncirculated coins are struck on special presses using greater force than circulating coins, producing a sharp, intricately detailed image. 

   I've never heard of "mint set" coins other than the 2005-10 "satin finish" pieces being struck or handled differently than coins issued for circulation. Those made in recent years usually appear to have been struck from newer dies, but similar looking pieces can be found in uncirculated rolls. The "mint set" coins aren't always fully struck and are often bagmarked or otherwise imperfect.  Neither the "Redbook" nor other coin guides nor grading services make any distinction between uncirculated coins taken from mint rolls or bags and those removed from "mint sets".

On 11/3/2023 at 1:48 PM, edhalbrook said:

So true uncirculated roll coins would be the same coin in the whole roll to be truly uncirculated.

  Not necessarily. An uncirculated coin is simply one that has no observable wear. A coin can go through several transactions before it will acquire observable "rub" or wear and could be wrapped in a mixed roll including circulated coins of various dates before acquiring such wear. Obviously, however, a coin that comes from a mint bag or rolls packaged directly from such bags would almost always achieve an uncirculated grade.

[J P M]

On 11/3/2023 at 1:48 PM, edhalbrook said:

JPM what do you look for when going through nickels? O

I look for the smallest amount of damage with clean rims. With nickels it is not easy the edge on a new coin can make marks all over right from the mint bin before they are even bagged up.  

[Lem E]

I should have used the term uncirculated set but the way I read that, there is a difference between the coins from the uncirculated set as opposed to the regular circulation pieces.  Is that not how it reads to you guys?

[EagleRJO]

On 11/3/2023 at 4:38 PM, Sandon said:

To my knowledge, the only coins referred to as "burnished" uncirculated are the uncirculated Silver Eagles (ASEs) with "W" mintmarks that the mint has sold directly to collectors since 2006.

Yes, I got the thought from collecting ASE's where "uncirculated" as used by the mint more recently for those coins meant a different "burnished" finish as listed in the Red Book.  Leave it to the mint to then use that term to mean something completely different for anual mint sets.

[I never could figure out why the mint uses the term "uncirculated" for those specially prepared and struck ASE's, and perhaps they should call them "burnished" like the rest of the world.]

Edited November 4, 2023 by EagleRJO

[powermad5000]

On 11/3/2023 at 5:46 PM, Lem E said:

I should have used the term uncirculated set but the way I read that, there is a difference between the coins from the uncirculated set as opposed to the regular circulation pieces.  Is that not how it reads to you guys?

I read it as there was a stronger strike used, but not necessarily handled specially. All I know is I had an 1981 P and 1981 D Mint set for years. Bought them a while after I first started collecting. Fast forward 40 years later after I was submitting to NGC and getting results and had learned what I needed to look for, I gave those two sets another look and the coins in them were very low end MS. Basically all 60 or 61's. Maybe a 62 in there somewhere. I ended up selling both sets on eBay together for about $4 including shipping. They weren't worth my time. Not good coins in the mint sets I had.

[Halbrook Family]

On 11/3/2023 at 10:36 AM, Lem E said:

This is pulled directly from the mint website from the 2020 mint set page. I don’t see this on any of the mint set pages for other years.

United States Mint uncirculated coins are struck on special presses using greater force than circulating coins, producing a sharp, intricately detailed image. 
 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwikv7HVrqiCAxVfjYkEHSmCCsEQFnoECBMQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fcatalog.usmint.gov%2Funcirculated-coin-set-2020-20RJ.html&usg=AOvVaw1Uszgxs427OEy1akcarO_v&opi=89978449
 

 

United States Mint uncirculated coins are struck on special presses using greater force than circulating coins, producing a sharp, intricately detailed image. from website

Does this mean to have a true complete nickel set I also need to get the coin from uncirculated rolls as well? 

[Halbrook Family]

On 11/3/2023 at 3:06 PM, J P M said:

I look for the smallest amount of damage with clean rims. With nickels it is not easy the edge on a new coin can make marks all over right from the mint bin before they are even bagged up.  

I see what you are saying about the rim. Thanks. I'll look at a nickel with a better eye. 

[powermad5000]

Typical nickel issues are deep gouges and/or scrapes across the face on the obverse and in the fields and one or two in the Monticello on the reverse (not always on the steps). Best I have been able to do for any year from change is an MS 66 6FS. The 67 or higher has eluded me in cash register change for decades. And to get 66 you need to have a clean portrait on the obverse most noticeably the forehead, nose and chin, clean fields on both sides, and no deep hits anywhere on the coin. It is not typically easy to find in this condition in either rolls or change and it seems I end up going through thousands each year before I get a good one. 

[Lem E]

On 11/4/2023 at 1:14 PM, edhalbrook said:

United States Mint uncirculated coins are struck on special presses using greater force than circulating coins, producing a sharp, intricately detailed image. from website

Does this mean to have a true complete nickel set I also need to get the coin from uncirculated rolls as well? 

The set is big enough as it is. I think you would have to be pretty hardcore to do that. 

[powermad5000]

I thought you to be pretty hardcore with the nickels @Lem E. I say that in a way as nothing but a high compliment, btw.