blackfoxDJ Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 (edited) Just got this one, and those holes looks off. It's a fake or real? 24mm x 1.2mm x 3.3g If real, any idea of how much it's worth? Thanks Edited September 5, 2020 by blackfoxDJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKurtB Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 Bubbles are usually a sign of a cast coin, which usually means a counterfeit. The problem here is that the original real ones were also cast, not struck. So we have to look elsewhere. That's all I got. This is not one of my areas. blackfoxDJ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmarguli Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 Looking at the mushiness of the details, I would lean toward fake. The unusual pitting and holes only pushes me more in this direction. If real, the coin is super common. This variety is listed as H-21.85 and Hartill lists it as R-15 (R-16 being the most common) and a value of $2 for a "top quality specimen". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWB Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 Tourist fodder. This is sold in bins in areas frequented by tour companies and their buses of wide-eyed Europeans looking for a public restroom not equipped with squat toilets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKurtB Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 42 minutes ago, RWB said: wide-eyed Europeans You are ON FIRE today! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henri Charriere Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 8 hours ago, VKurtB said: You are ON FIRE today! Jarringly, out of character and not helpful. Anyone mind if I cross-examine the witness, blackfoxDJ? Sir, can you tell us generally where (area) or from whom you acquired this coin (flea market dealer, friend) and why, i.e., the representations that were made to induce you to buy it at the price asked? This is not to be rude or overly inquisitive or unjustifiably suspicious but rather to provide the casual observer with the indications needed to form an opinion. For example, if you bought or otherwise obtained the coin from a fly-by-night, here today, gone tomorrow party at what seems to be an inflated price that has as much meaning as purchasing it from an authorized dealer at a competitive price. It narrows down the possibilities enabling the viewer to arrive at a valid conclusion. If someone well-versed in such mintage issues is unfamiliar or unavailable, another may be able to point you in the right direction for further edification. I too have a massive bronze I obtained years ago that I know nothing about beyond the fact it was acquired from an older dealer in an open-air flea market the likes of which no longer exist in New York City. I hope to post it soon to hopefully gain a better understanding, if that's possible, of exactly what it is I have. I am sorry I am unable to help you but it is entirely possible someone else might. I wish you Good Luck in solving your mystery! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackfoxDJ Posted September 5, 2020 Author Share Posted September 5, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, Quintus Arrius said: Jarringly, out of character and not helpful. Anyone mind if I cross-examine the witness, blackfoxDJ? Sir, can you tell us generally where (area) or from whom you acquired this coin (flea market dealer, friend) and why, i.e., the representations that were made to induce you to buy it at the price asked? This is not to be rude or overly inquisitive or unjustifiably suspicious but rather to provide the casual observer with the indications needed to form an opinion. For example, if you bought or otherwise obtained the coin from a fly-by-night, here today, gone tomorrow party at what seems to be an inflated price that has as much meaning as purchasing it from an authorized dealer at a competitive price. It narrows down the possibilities enabling the viewer to arrive at a valid conclusion. If someone well-versed in such mintage issues is unfamiliar or unavailable, another may be able to point you in the right direction for further edification. I too have a massive bronze I obtained years ago that I know nothing about beyond the fact it was acquired from an older dealer in an open-air flea market the likes of which no longer exist in New York City. I hope to post it soon to hopefully gain a better understanding, if that's possible, of exactly what it is I have. I am sorry I am unable to help you but it is entirely possible someone else might. I wish you Good Luck in solving your mystery! Hi. Not a problem, I understand perfectly. I'm in Brazil and bought it at a online auction from a Brazilian dealer, for about US$6.00. Why? I don't have coins from that period from China and was cheap. (Relative to prices here in Brazil) As far as I know the coin was part of a collection that he bought for sell. Julio Edited September 5, 2020 by blackfoxDJ New. Thoughts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henri Charriere Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 If there is anyone on the Forum who can help answer this gentleman's questions, or offer further helpful advice or suggestions, please do so. blackfoxDJ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackfoxDJ Posted September 5, 2020 Author Share Posted September 5, 2020 Hi, updated the coin sizes/weight on main post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James_OldeTowne Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 Even though I've seen many of these, they are certainly not my specialty area (as if I would even have one....). However, it look suspicious to me and I would not pay $6 for it. It's a much better risk for something like 25-cents. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henri Charriere Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, James_OldeTowne said: Even though I've seen many of these, they are certainly not my specialty area (as if I would even have one....). However, it look suspicious to me and I would not pay $6 for it. It's a much better risk for something like 25-cents. Sorry. In all fairness, one would have to consider the rate of exchange on the date purchased, the circumstances and the country, irrespective of supply and demand. Ordinary things we take for granted are notoriously more expensive elsewhere. blackfoxDJ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackfoxDJ Posted September 8, 2020 Author Share Posted September 8, 2020 24 minutes ago, Quintus Arrius said: In all fairness, one would have to consider the rate of exchange on the date purchased, the circumstances and the country, irrespective of supply and demand. Ordinary things we take for granted are notoriously more expensive elsewhere. Indeed. Here in Brazil the math goes like this for any imported good. (coin price +shipping & handle )*1.6 1.6 = 60% import taxes. then convert to BRL (+- * 5 given today exchange rate) So for example, if a coin costs US$1.00 in US and S&H US$5.00 we have US$6.00 for the coin, with customs taxes that goes up to US$9.6, and then we calculate the price in BRL. So a coins that costs US$ 1.00 in US can easily cost 10 times more here, if it doesn't disappear in the post office... Welcome to third world country... VKurtB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James_OldeTowne Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 I wonder if it might make more sense (and of course, if the opportunity arises) to purchase these in larger volume? Sorry to hear that those evil "customs" things drive up prices so much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmarguli Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 19 minutes ago, James_OldeTowne said: I wonder if it might make more sense (and of course, if the opportunity arises) to purchase these in larger volume? While becoming rarer, every now and again I see offered large quantities of Cash coins. It is not unusual to find an offering of several hundred thousand and I've heard of offerings in the millions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VKurtB Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 6 minutes ago, gmarguli said: While becoming rarer, every now and again I see offered large quantities of Cash coins. It is not unusual to find an offering of several hundred thousand and I've heard of offerings in the millions. One of my favorite things my son said when we were looking at these coins is, "Aren't they ALL cash?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackfoxDJ Posted September 8, 2020 Author Share Posted September 8, 2020 30 minutes ago, James_OldeTowne said: I wonder if it might make more sense (and of course, if the opportunity arises) to purchase these in larger volume? Sorry to hear that those evil "customs" things drive up prices so much! that's what we usually do, even here inside Brazil, to "reduce" shipping costs. that coin came with another 5 modern ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
