1990 Lincoln no S Proof Penny? 0

[Fireman99]

Came across a few really sharp 1990 pennies with the no mint mark while coin hunting through a collection that has been sitting for the last 12 years. Can anyone give me a little insight on what I'm looking at here? One is an error coin. Any value here? 

[Conder101]

Neither of these are proof coins so they are not the rare No S proof cents.  The first one is showing a heavy "ridge ring" from 8:00 to 11:00 on the obverse and to a lesser extent on the rev thru AMERICA.  It also has a linear plating bubble at the final A , and split plate doubling at E CE.

The second shows faint linear plating bubbles thru Lincolns head  and possibly some die deterioration doubling below E CE.

There is no premium value associated with these.

Edited October 1, 2019 by Conder101

[VKurtB]

Why oh why do people not learn what a proof coin is, and what they actually look like, before making these posts? Sheesh!

[Fireman99]

I'm sure there was once a time many years ago that you were a newbie to the coin hunting/collecting world. I'm quite confident that you didn't have it all down to a science right from the get go. I appreciate real people like Conder101, the gentleman who responded to my post before you. He kindly took the time to respond to my post in a helpful manner, giving me some insight on what I was looking at with these pennies. I have since realized what a proof looks like. If you don't have anything constructive to say then I recommend you just not comment. 

[VKurtB]

On 9/30/2019 at 11:18 AM, Fireman99 said:

I'm sure there was once a time many years ago that you were a newbie to the coin hunting/collecting world. I'm quite confident that you didn't have it all down to a science right from the get go. I appreciate real people like Conder101, the gentleman who responded to my post before you. He kindly took the time to respond to my post in a helpful manner, giving me some insight on what I was looking at with these pennies. I have since realized what a proof looks like. If you don't have anything constructive to say then I recommend you just not comment. 

My VERY FIRST coins (a 5-way tie) WERE a proof set, 1963. I was 8 then. I'm now 64 and I STILL have never bought coin rolls to look through them. It's just not the way this works, for my generation. Seriously, umm, Fireman, this is not some treasure exploration here, and it's not the Powerball Lottery either.

 

The problem we have here, dearest newbies, is NOT that you don't have the answers; it's that you don't have the right QUESTIONS, and I don't know what to do about that, and frankly, it's not my problem. If somewhere your eyes have come across a coin-related YouTube video, we first have to "deprogram" you, because your numismatic brain has been fried.

Edited October 1, 2019 by VKurtB

[Gypsy_doodles]

So I stumbled upon this page, read the comments and oh my lort!!! I just had to make an account just to say how much of an snotty a** @VkurtB is being towards you @fireman99! I’m sorry VKurt5 that we Are all not a 1000 year old coin master from middle earth like yourself.......do us all a favor, take your a** back to middle earth with ya boy Gollum and show some damn respect for someone who is learning and asking for help! 

Edited December 29, 2019 by Gypsy_doodles

[Rummy13]

On 9/30/2019 at 10:36 AM, VKurtB said:

Why oh why do people not learn what a proof coin is, and what they actually look like, before making these posts? Sheesh!

I consider a new coin collector, although I helped my dad with them back in the 60s.  A lot of new people ask thing that you think they should know, thought that is what a newbie forum would be about. I am real sorry @VKurtB that we don't have the knowledge of coins that you do and try to get answers here. Thanks to people like @Greenstang, @JKK, @Revenant, and @Just Bob, we are learning. You don't have to say anything that make us look dumb. that only hurts the whole coin collecting experience. I'm Glad you have your knowledge because your people skills leave a lot to be desired.

[Revenant]

On 9/30/2019 at 2:39 PM, VKurtB said:

The problem we have here, dearest newbies, is NOT that you don't have the answers; it's that you don't have the right QUESTIONS, and I don't know what to do about that, and frankly, it's not my problem. If somewhere your eyes have come across a coin-related YouTube video, we first have to "deprogram" you, because your numismatic brain has been fried.

"If you can't say something nice..."

Honestly, kurt, we all get frustrated sometimes in dealing with the same types of questions, but being nasty doesn't help. There are times when you seem to almost rejoice in it. If you start feeling the need to bite someone's head off, maybe take that as a sign to avoid the newbie forum that week?

Get coal in the ole stocking this year?

[Alex in PA.]

"If you can't say some thing nice"............

Words to live by folks. 

[Tridmn]

In his defense; no the rudeness shouldn't be there. However, he is knowledgeable, just needs to put a different "spin" on his words. He and I havent seen eye to eye on so things, but his knowledge is helpful when he is able to say it the right way

[VKurtB]

NO, seriously, I just fundamentally disagree! I have ZERO obligation to play "nice, nice" and worry about "spin" for people who won't first do the absolute tiniest bit of legwork and study before believing that an ordinary 1990 circulation cent is some incredible error or variety. Those kinds of pieces are the province of the "crème de la crème" collectors to worry about - and CERTAINLY not me.

 

If you don't even know what a proof coin looks like, you don't belong on ANY KIND of online coin forum, newbie or not. To me, a newbie is someone who knows enough to get in trouble and needs help, but not here. Nooooo, here newbie means you just saw a YouTube video designed to scam you and you got half an idea.

[Crawtomatic]

4 hours ago, VKurtB said:

If you don't even know what a proof coin looks like, you don't belong on ANY KIND of online coin forum, newbie or not. To me, a newbie is someone who knows enough to get in trouble and needs help, but not here. Nooooo, here newbie means you just saw a YouTube video designed to scam you and you got half an idea.

A lot of people watch YouTube personalities.  Children & young adults especially.  The next step would be to search out more factual information.  A broad internet search will turn up results from multiple numismatic forums as well as articles.  We all have learning preferences and while I generally prefer to read in depth another may choose to ask specific questions and get group tutorage.  An online forum is the perfect setting for group tutorage as long as the delivery is appropriate.

[Gypsy_doodles]

@VKurtB the fact that you waste your day commenting and replying to comments on this ridiculous forum is absolutely pathetic I made this account solely on the premise of disturbing your life and I can sleep soundly knowing that it has affected you so harshly I hope some day you find something worth waking up every morning for get out of your chair walk outside and find a life

[VKurtB]

18 hours ago, CRAWTOMATIC said:

A lot of people watch YouTube personalities.  Children & young adults especially.  The next step would be to search out more factual information.  A broad internet search will turn up results from multiple numismatic forums as well as articles.  We all have learning preferences and while I generally prefer to read in depth another may choose to ask specific questions and get group tutorage.  An online forum is the perfect setting for group tutorage as long as the delivery is appropriate.

What you say here @CRAWTOMATIC is indisputable - a lot of people DO INDEED watch YouTube personalities. That's the basic problem with this hobby - they should NOT! There is almost nothing worth knowing that anyone can get from a coin-related YouTube video. There simply is no quality material out there on this subject. Pretty much all that's out there is pretty ridiculous clickbait material.

[Just Bob]

18 hours ago, Gypsy_doodles said:

@VKurtB the fact that you waste your day commenting and replying to comments on this ridiculous forum ...

What is it about this forum that would lead you to label it "ridiculous?"

Edited December 31, 2019 by Just Bob
Typos

[VKurtB]

11 minutes ago, Just Bob said:

What is it about this forum that would lead you to label it "ridiculous?"

@Just Bob, I know you didn't direct that question to me, but rather to @Gypsy-doodles, but I can think of a few reasons to label this forum as ridiculous. For starters, the very concept wherein complete utter rank beginners just come on and fire random questions "scattershot". Is that the way learning works these days? Really? Granted, I haven't seen a classroom in action since the mid-1980's, but jeepers creepers, the last time I did, there was something called "required readings" that preceded any discussion. If someone wants to tell me that's all in the past and "they" don't do learning that way any more, it'll explain a whole lot of what I'm observing in the world today.

 

I realize I'm not the "average bear", but I can go to a 5-day coin show, and do so regularly, and never sit down at a dealer table. Instead, I'm going from one job task (I am an ANA National Volunteer) to a lot viewing room, to a committee meeting, to a talk  given by an expert, to a photography event, yada yada. It's about learning BEFORE collecting and collecting awhile BEFORE submitting coins to NGC. Then again, the very next "coin roll hunt" I do will be my very first one ever.

Edited December 31, 2019 by VKurtB

[JKK]

Kurt, instead of ridiculing newbies who don't choose to learn by the Kurt-Approved Methods, why don't you author a WYNTK post entitled "What you need to know about how to learn about coins"? At the outset, you can list a full CV: all your credentials, volunteering credits, any big-nose collectors and dealers who know you by sight and treat you like best pal, important coins you have owned/seen/graded, and all the other reasons people should still their keyboard fingers and read very carefully any guidance you might offer--especially about what you insist the hobby should be, so that they can work toward conformity with your ideals. Make sure they know exactly what they may collect, and what they must not, lest they face disdain and even ridicule.

After all, you are a very important collector. Maybe if people knew that going in, they wouldn't have the temerity to call you out on your delivery. They would understand that the great ones are exempt from basic expectations of courtesy.

You could light a candle rather than curse the darkness. And that way, we won't be treated to a repetition of all your credentials (about which many might not much care) every time someone takes exception to your pedagogic style. You could just include a link and let them educate themselves. Type once, teach many!

[Rummy13]

9 minutes ago, JKK said:

Kurt, instead of ridiculing newbies who don't choose to learn by the Kurt-Approved Methods, why don't you author a WYNTK post entitled "What you need to know about how to learn about coins"? At the outset, you can list a full CV: all your credentials, volunteering credits, any big-nose collectors and dealers who know you by sight and treat you like best pal, important coins you have owned/seen/graded, and all the other reasons people should still their keyboard fingers and read very carefully any guidance you might offer--especially about what you insist the hobby should be, so that they can work toward conformity with your ideals. Make sure they know exactly what they may collect, and what they must not, lest they face disdain and even ridicule.

After all, you are a very important collector. Maybe if people knew that going in, they wouldn't have the temerity to call you out on your delivery. They would understand that the great ones are exempt from basic expectations of courtesy.

You could light a candle rather than curse the darkness. And that way, we won't be treated to a repetition of all your credentials (about which many might not much care) every time someone takes exception to your pedagogic style. You could just include a link and let them educate themselves. Type once, teach many!

I knew I should of listed the "Kurt=Approved Methods" or his school on my End of the year thoughts thread. LOL

[VKurtB]

@JKK, the problem is far too many "newbies" (And I'll stipulate that has a wide array of definitions and mine is probably assuming more knowledge than most.) have not exhibited ANY desire to learn ANYTHING other than "What is this different cent I found CRH-ing worth?" I'm sorry, I have invested decades of study, reading, attending events, buying books, some obscenely expensive limited issue books. My coin LIBRARY weighs well over a ton, before we even start weighing coins, which is about two tons more or less.

I'm seeing a desire for "quick and dirty" information "so I can send in my coins for grading". Cart before the horse, man, cart before the horse. This is a field of STUDY, not some get rich quick scheme, but YouTube sells it as EXACTLY that. YouTube literally bastardizes one of the great hobbies of all time and renders it "profane".  [look up the dictionary definition]

Am I *spooned* off about it? You're flipping right I am!!!

[JKK]

Then be *spooned* off. I wouldn't dream of trying to talk you out of it. *Spooned* off is a feeling, and if it's your feeling, it's valid to you. Just be prepared for the world to tell you to get over your feelings, because you know how that can happen.

People's coin interests begin in many different ways. Many people don't have tons of money to spend on Real Collectible Rarities. The best they can do is to hunt through coin rolls and junk bins. Maybe that's fun for them. Maybe they do it in hopes of learning on cheap coins so that when they can afford nicer and rarer ones, they will have a body of understanding. We don't know their overall motives or circumstances. Some of us decline to care what those are. Caring can get one feeling *spooned* off.

Before declaring interest in a coin, most people won't consult you or I to see if their interest has begun with a valid coin. That's fair, though, because neither you nor I are required by law to respond to them. If I determine, in my sole judgment, that a poster is being pushy or stupid or selfish or otherwise irritating, I don't answer their questions. I say nothing to them. They have a problem; I don't have a problem. They need to own their own problem.

I choose not to own their problem. I spend less time *spooned* off and more time diverting my efforts to people who do not annoy me. And my life is better for it.

[VKurtB]

One of the oddest things I've observed is CRH'ers who are disappointed when they get solid BU rolls at a bank. That's my nirvana! I know people (show going types) snap up solid BU rolls at a premium. Heck, if I had a place to bank where they get new coins a lot, I'm not sure even I could resist hunting for W quarters. But no, we get people whipping out a USB scope looking for minutiae on Zincolns. Sad, really.

On one hand, I wish more Internet denizens would find a way to get to a nicer coin show (small ones can still be nice), but on the other hand, I'm afraid they wouldn't understand what hobby they're looking at. And by the way, it works the other way too. The grand high muckeddy-mucks at the ANA pay lip service to getting more Internet-involved, but they wouldn't know how to react to this forum either. Two ships passing in the night, neither speaking the other's language.

Edited December 31, 2019 by VKurtB

[Marquez-Collector]

I am trying to keep my mouth shut all this time. 

While I respect @VKurtB Coin knowledge, I can do without his condescending ways. For a generation that has taught us to respec, it disappoints me to see such a lack of reciprocal affection towards current and all generations. 

I apologise if this offends anyone. (also apologize if my apology offends anyone). *See what I did there?*

On 9/30/2019 at 12:39 PM, VKurtB said:

it's that you don't have the right QUESTIONS

To quote a current book I am reading. "You Only Get Answers To the Questions You Ask" - John C. Maxwell.

Honestly, how do we expect for newbies to learn if they don't ask? they may not like the answers but they are seeking knowledge. Furthermore, Since they are new, they are not aware of the format they need to ask. I was new once, well, still am but I have learned to ask better quality questions that kind of align to what Yall' seeking.(I think and I hope if not please let me know) . 

Good day! 

Edited December 31, 2019 by Dukemnm

[VKurtB]

Well, what I can tell you is no one ever taught me to be anything other than "right". That was supreme. Tact was a non-factor. Sugarcoating even less. Both of my parents, both of Germanic stock AND upbringing (German spoken as the primary language in both their childhood homes) valued correctness, and scholarship over ALL else. Almost an "Achtung!" style of childrearing. It has followed me all my life. Quality is everything. Being correct (not in the political type) is all I value or ever have. No one ever hugged anyone in the house I grew up in. But if you failed, you WERE to be derided.

It's a personal style that at 64 is too late to try to reform. I do have a riotous sense of humor, but even it has a "bite" to it.

Edited December 31, 2019 by VKurtB

[Marquez-Collector]

2 hours ago, VKurtB said:

One of the oddest things I've observed is CRH'ers who are disappointed when they get solid BU rolls at a bank. That's my nirvana!

I get those all the time and set some aside, untouched, and unload the rest on Ebay. If you are willing to pay premium for them I am willing to ship   . However,I do not sit there and hunt for W quarters. I wait for them in my change. like most of my collector coins. I do it for the history. not to seek perfect, because if every coin out there is perfect, none are perfect. My kids go nuts when they get change with their purchase.they look for that special looking coin, The lucky coin as they call it. and save it in their album. Just last week, my son found a 1903 indian head which I think is at least a AU 50. (will post pics when I get a chance), he was thrilled about it.  that is what floats my boat, an opportunity to teach them about history.   

Edited December 31, 2019 by Dukemnm

[VKurtB]

3 minutes ago, Dukemnm said:

I get those all the time and set some aside, untouched, and unload the rest on Ebay. If you are willing to pay premium for them I am willing to ship   . However,I do not sit there and hunt for W quarters. I wait for them in my change. like most of my collector coins. I do it for the history. not to seek perfect, because if every coin out there is perfect, none are perfect. My kids go nuts when they get change with their purchase.they look for that special looking coin, The lucky coin as they call it. and save it in their album. Just last week, my son found a 1903 indian head which I think is at least a AU 50. (will post pics when I get a chance), he was thrilled about it.  that is what float my boat, an opportunity to teach the, about history.   

The irony is that if one were to want to "GET KINDA RICH QUICK" in modern coins, the best way they could do that is to CRH for W quarters. (Or British Alphabet 10p in the U.K.)

[JKK]

14 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

Well, what I can tell you is no one ever taught me to be anything other than "right". That was supreme. Tact was a non-factor. Sugarcoating even less. Both of my parents, both of Germanic stock AND upbringing (German spoken as the primary language in both their childhood homes) valued correctness, and scholarship over ALL else. Almost an "Achtung!" style of childrearing. It has followed me all my life. Quality is everything. Being correct (not in the political type) is all I value or ever have. No one ever hugged anyone in the house I grew up in. But if you failed, you WERE to be derided.

It's a personal style that at 64 is too late to try to reform. I do have a riotous sense of humor, but even it has a "bite" to it.

That's vunderbar. I respect that you admit that social skills were not a priority in your upbringing. Neither were they in mine, and I'm half German myself. For myself, I'm glad I took time to try and develop some in adulthood, because the world is full of people it profits no one to alienate. I want to make sure that when I alienate someone, they absolutely need, demand, and require to be alienated with a mighty alienating.

And if you think it's too late to reform your personal style, the advantage there is that you are 100% correct. Not objectively, but because you are committed to not reforming it. If I refuse to quit cigars because I'm too old to quit, I'm likewise right.

[Marquez-Collector]

1 hour ago, VKurtB said:

Well, what I can tell you is no one ever taught me to be anything other than "right"

does not mean you are always right. 

as for being blunt, I too am blunt and care less for political correctness. but there is blunt and there is plain disrespectful. you can be both. Hence why I say you are condescending. You are right which makes you think that you can be rude. Just calling it like I see them. 

I do get your humor. makes me chuckle and at times it makes but most of the time you are just grumpy. reminds me of my two neighbors. god res them. Both stubborn, always bickering with each other, and both hilarious when they tell me their stories. I miss them.

 

 

Edited December 31, 2019 by Dukemnm

[VKurtB]

1 minute ago, JKK said:

That's vunderbar. I respect that you admit that social skills were not a priority in your upbringing. Neither were they in mine, and I'm half German myself. For myself, I'm glad I took time to try and develop some in adulthood, because the world is full of people it profits no one to alienate. I want to make sure that when I alienate someone, they absolutely need, demand, and require to be alienated with a mighty alienating.

And if you think it's too late to reform your personal style, the advantage there is that you are 100% correct. Not objectively, but because you are committed to not reforming it. If I refuse to quit cigars because I'm too old to quit, I'm likewise right.

Yes, and my upbringing has collided with a stroke some 10 years ago that made me even less tolerant for things I do not agree with. It's maybe 3/4 upbringing and 1/4 medical, but it sure didn't help. My hemorrhage was "supposed to" kill me, but instead it altered my personality and stoked my own sense of personal defiance, in this case, of the odds of survival. I have received Last Rites ten years ago, and I'm not even Catholic, but the priest gave them because no one knew my religion and "it can't hurt".

[Marquez-Collector]

17 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

to "GET KINDA RICH QUICK" in modern coins, the best way they could do that is to CRH for W quarters.

Not my cup of tea unless it will be worth millions.  for 10K not worth my time. IMO

Warren buffett said - "The stock market is a transfer of money from the impatient to the patient". I believe that to be true in any market. 

 

[VKurtB]

7 minutes ago, Dukemnm said:

Not my cup of tea unless it will be worth millions.  for 10K not worth my time. IMO

Warren buffett said - "The stock market is a transfer of money from the impatient to the patient". I believe that to be true in any market. 

 

I've always been a Buffett fan, and a fellow traveler. And not only were social skills not a priority, our family were "social hermits" for whom social niceties were considered negative. If you think I'm a tough case, you should have met my father. He passed in 2017 at age 95 and I never recall him saying (or doing) anything nice in his entire life. In fact, I was ridiculed as "weak" when I did anything nice for anyone. To him, literally everyone he met was an adversary, myself included.

Edited December 31, 2019 by VKurtB