Heritage Auctions drive me crazy ...

[BillJones]

Almost every time I bid on something, it gets bid up to a record price.

 

It is not the finest known by a long shot, has no CAC sticker and is not rated as rare. In fact it's one notch down from a "common date."

 

Yet when I bid it, it goes crazy.

 

I feel like I ought to hire myself out to people who consign coins. When I bid, the record high bidder is there to follow me.

 

Does anyone else think the system works like this for them?

[physics-fan3.14]

Well you see, Bill, everyone knows what fine taste you have in coins.

 

When they see you bid on it, they know that it is really high quality.

 

So they bid on it too.

[BillJones]

Yea, but the bidding is supposed be anonymous.

[physics-fan3.14]

Yea, but the bidding is supposed be anonymous.

 

The spies are watching very closely in the lot viewing room.

[numisport]

I need help too. I've never bid in a Heritage auction but of the coins I track to the end, many are marked "make an offer to owner". Does that mean that the coins that I like are in many cases won by people who buy just to turn them for a profit ? Wait am I that naive ?

[coinman_23885]

I haven't purchased a coin from Heritage in over a year. Most of the time I bid what I think is moon money (or track the lot to come back to do so later), the piece sells for much more. It isn't just you. In fairness, the stuff I have been interested in as of late is not easy to find. I wish my coins would sell like that.

[BillJones]

I wish my coins would sell like that.

 

So do I.

[MJ]

I bid on a Bronze Libertas in PCGS 63 in the recent SB auction. They have been going for around 20k. I expected it would take 25k to get this coin. I was wrong. I had the president of SB submit my phone bids for me as I anticipated the bidding to get tricky. I stopped at 31k. More then 64's go for. There are just over 100 pieces extant. I ended up the unbidder. It didn't help that the other Bronze Libertas NGC 62 was obviously tooled and not described as such (straight graded 62). So all the action as on the piece I was after.

 

So yes, I feel the pain.

 

mark

 

[BillJones]

I need help too. I've never bid in a Heritage auction but of the coins I track to the end, many are marked "make an offer to owner". Does that mean that the coins that I like are in many cases won by people who buy just to turn them for a profit ? Wait am I that naive ?

 

I found for a while that every coin I bought ended up with that sign on it.

 

I had one coin that I marked "make an offer to the owner" which generated "an offer I couldn't refuse." The coin was original, but it had a few mint caused issues. I explained this to Heritage, and supplied my pictures that showed the issues. I presume that Heritage passed that on to the person who made the offer. They still bought the piece at the strong money so my conscience was clear.

 

Then I had another coin that I really didn't want to sell. I kept getting offers that were not that attractive, although I would have made a small profit. Finally I turned off the sign because I getting tired of the messages.

 

I should probably turn it on again although I'm not thinking of selling my whole collection at this time.

 

[BillJones]

It's not looking good ...

 

The auctioneer just sold one at price that "made his face fall off." Mine fell off too. After I picked it up off the floor I realized that the coin I'm bidding upon with realize a new all time high for the issue in that grade given the way this auction is going.

 

There must be something in the water in California ...

[RWB]

Was it damaged by rolling around on the floor before you picked it up.... ?

 

Had that happen to me with one of Kam Awash's half dimes.

[jom]

Was it damaged by rolling around on the floor before you picked it up.... ?

 

It might have been....however, based on recent evidence from a forum thread the coin could actually grade higher.

 

jom

[Hard Times]

Bill I am not surprised if you are bidding on a piece from the Ohio Valley Collection. I bid aggressively on two gold pieces from that collection and was blown out of the water. Many of the pieces are in old holders and undergraded 1 to 3 grades. Since only about 1% of the coins listed for that collection are CAC, and those on more recent holders, these have clearly not been to CAC and the quality is obvious. The person who put this collection together had a very good eye....

 

Best, HT

[MJ]

Bill I am not surprised if you are bidding on a piece from the Twelve Oaks Collection. I bid aggressively on two gold pieces from that collection and was blown out of the water. Many of the pieces are in old holders and undergraded 1 to 3 grades. Since only about 1% of the coins listed for that collection are CAC, and those on more recent holders, these have clearly not been to CAC and the quality is obvious. The person who put this collection together had a very good eye....

 

Best, HT

 

Dealers and crackout guys were drooling over these coins. I was in Long Beach yesterday

 

mark

[tommy44]

Bill,

 

You're not the only one that feels that way. I was watching a half-dozen $5 Libs from home yesterday and all six sold for what I thought were over the top. I've only been successful buying two coins in a Heritage sale for my set in the last two years at a price I was willing to pay.

 

Tom

[physics-fan3.14]

I haven't purchased a coin from Heritage in over a year. Most of the time I bid what I think is moon money (or track the lot to come back to do so later), the piece sells for much more. It isn't just you. In fairness, the stuff I have been interested in as of late is not easy to find. I wish my coins would sell like that.

 

Same here. I bid $800 for a coin that normally sells for $40, but it had a PL.... it hammered for $3300....

[MJ]

Was it damaged by rolling around on the floor before you picked it up.... ?

 

Had that happen to me with one of Kam Awash's half dimes.

 

I hate when that happens........

 

 

mark

[Nutmeg Coin]

I haven't done business with them in many years, and got a lame response from them when a certified coin I had reported to them as stolen was not flagged. It makes me wonder if they flag any reported coins.

[leeg]

I've found that at least half of my wins were at my max bid.

 

 

[BillJones]

Bill I am not surprised if you are bidding on a piece from the Twelve Oaks Collection. I bid aggressively on two gold pieces from that collection and was blown out of the water. Many of the pieces are in old holders and undergraded 1 to 3 grades. Since only about 1% of the coins listed for that collection are CAC, and those on more recent holders, these have clearly not been to CAC and the quality is obvious. The person who put this collection together had a very good eye....

 

Best, HT

 

I won the piece the piece at record price for the grade, but going by the pictures, there is no way that it will go from AU-58 to some MS grade unless it gets there via grade-flation. The main things it had going for it were an absence of marks and original surfaces.

 

I'm not going to say what it is because it's not in my hands yet. I've learned that things don't always turn out the way you thought they might even after the auction has closed. My issues were NOT with Heritage in that regard however.

 

I also won a wore-out British coin that goes in my "one from each king set." I got it for $50 less than my max, which was a hefty bid for what it is.

 

[RWB]

There are many correctly graded AU58 coins that are much nicer than any UNC piece until they reach the alleged MS65 label. Bill might have made a very astute purchase.

[Hard Times]

Bill I am not surprised if you are bidding on a piece from the Ohio Valley Collection. I bid aggressively on two gold pieces from that collection and was blown out of the water. Many of the pieces are in old holders and undergraded 1 to 3 grades. Since only about 1% of the coins listed for that collection are CAC, and those on more recent holders, these have clearly not been to CAC and the quality is obvious. The person who put this collection together had a very good eye....

 

Best, HT

 

I won the piece the piece at record price for the grade, but going by the pictures, there is no way that it will go from AU-58 to some MS grade unless it gets there via grade-flation. The main things it had going for it were an absence of marks and original surfaces.

 

I'm not going to say what it is because it's not in my hands yet. I've learned that things don't always turn out the way you thought they might even after the auction has closed. My issues were NOT with Heritage in that regard however.

 

I also won a wore-out British coin that goes in my "one from each king set." I got it for $50 less than my max, which was a hefty bid for what it is.

 

Hi Bill,

I think it is a positive outcome when original, minimally marked,solid for the grade examples go for record or near record prices. Yes we would rather not pay if we don't have to, but it means the the market for good coins is strong. For every minimum human assisted gold coin I lot view, I will see 100s that are just no good because of too much alteration. So when the good coins come on the market, since they are in low supply, they are going to go for alot. Again I will refer to the Ohio Valley Collection as an example, at least for the gold, such a collection with such originality and quality is not commonly on the block these days.

 

Best, HT

[coinman1794]

I need help too. I've never bid in a Heritage auction but of the coins I track to the end, many are marked "make an offer to owner". Does that mean that the coins that I like are in many cases won by people who buy just to turn them for a profit ? Wait am I that naive ?

 

Heritage offers their members a choice whether or not to accept offers on coins they've won. Unless you turn the feature off in your account, "make an offer to owner" is automatically shown on auction results pages.

[#]

I've been waiting, watching and when my holy grail coin came up from The Ohio Valley Collection; I called in every favor I had or thought I had. The gold coin only comes to auction 2-3 times a year and in high grade, six figures. The two I had a choice of were a VF 25 & VF 35. I previewed both at Heritage in Dallas with Mark Feld. He had ask several others their pick. It was unanimous, the VF 25. Just had tons more eye appeal than the VF 35 which looked cleaned. On topic, I can't remember the last large Heritage auction I haven't bought a coin and yes paid more than I wished. The one I bought this week went for 30% more than its estimate and 15% more than I'd hoped. Everyone I know, led by my wife said buy the GD coin cause I'm sick of hearing about it. I have such nice family and friends.

Even though the higher grade coin went for one bid less than my low grade I AM THRILLED.

David

[coinsbygary]

Just shows that coins with good eye appeal command a premium!

[BillJones]

I just received the coin. It is an 1835 half eagle in a PCGS AU-58 Green Label Holder. The coin is what I would call an AU-58+, but grades said that the "+" was not valid in those days. Today it's equal to what gets into an MS-61 holder.

 

It's still not Mint State, but it is very attractive. Still it did cost me MS-60 money.

 

 

 

[SkyMan]

Pretty coin that you picked up!

 

I feel your pain. I'm putting together an 1858 business strike set, which has 29 different Type/MM coins in the set, sixteen of which are gold coins. Of the sixteen gold coins, I'll never own two of them, as they are too rare/expensive (I'm saving my big bucks for space memorabilia). Anyhow, there were nine of the sixteen gold Type/MM coins up for auction, of which I bid on five of them. Two of them, C mint $2.50 and $5.00, the first in XF45 and the second in AU50, I got BLOWN out of the water, even though my bid was several grading increments higher in value. I finally did win an XF45/CAC $20 P mint Double Eagle, but paid close to AU55 money for it.

 

FWIW, one of the two gold coins from the 1858 set that I'll never own, came up for auction. It was an 1858-O $20 in XF45 with a PCGS price guide of $10,000. It went for ~ $24,700.

[RWB]

Nice coin. (Not what I would call an AU, however. Too much rub and field disturbance....) But, coins like this are not uncommonly found in "MS61 or MS62" holders.

[PocketArt]

That's a beautiful coin Bill, I have one of those 1835's but mines in F-VF condition. Nice pickup!

 

 

[physics-fan3.14]

Nice coin. (Not what I would call an AU, however. Too much rub and field disturbance....) But, coins like this are not uncommonly found in "MS61 or MS62" holders.

 

If you wouldn't call that an AU, what on earth would you call it? I know you grade "old school," but this gorgeous coin is the quintessence of a high-AU.