Disturbing Discovery posted by walnutto

[CSJournals-migration]

This one gives other coin dealers a bad rap.

 

Ihave recently discovered a dealer on Ebay that goes by two different names. He use to go by what looked very similar to a name of Gotcha. Most dealers will put forth the effort and send in raw coins for grading then sell them on Ebay. This one does the vulture method and buys up newly graded coins from other dealers on Ebay that no one bids on. Basically taking graded coins away from real collectors. Anyways.... the more recent trend is put on deceptive stickers on the graded coins. Everyone is familar with the CAC sticker that demands a higher price. This dealer puts on a MAC sticker that also includes a Trademark reference. Unsuspecting coin buyers will believe this too demands a higher price. Also, this dealer will add a reference of either DL or DMPL over the top of his MAC sticker even though the coin is clearly not graded with either of those designations! Both these deceptive practices need to stop and protect coin collectors.

Anyone here, that is a member of this society, needs to inform Ebay this dealer needs to stop this deception.

Take a look yourself, it will not take you long to find this dealer on Ebay.

 

See more journals by walnutto

[Tyler N.]

Is this the same dealer who advertises non-FB Mercs as "90FB" and then uses FB in the listing?

[coinman_23885]

The grader at MAC is the ACG guy. Be careful what you say and how you phrase it as he appears to be a litigious parasite (in my opinion) who, on information and belief, sued collectors and dealers critical of him (and rightly critical in my opinion) and his ACG operation. For legal purposes, preface everything as "in my opinion" and avoid strong language while still addressing the pertinent issues. I see nothing wrong with the posts so far, but I am giving a heads up for others as these threads often end up heated.

[Roadglide8-migration]

That's why I buy NGC graded coins. I can, and always use the NGC verification process. It will state whether or not the coin in question is certified, and if so, it will tell you if the coin has a CAP or MAC sticker attached to it.

[Lucky One]

That's why I buy NGC graded coins. I can, and always use the NGC verification process. It will state whether or not the coin in question is certified, and if so, it will tell you if the coin has a CAP or MAC sticker attached to it.

 

good idea, but the best protection is solid knowledge. I admit it takes decades to be proficient at grading and discerning condition of many of the classic series but anyone can pick a series and study it for a year before jumping in with both feet, it just takes self discipline. I buy the coin, couldn't care less what another opinion is if I can see the coin for myself. As for stickers, including CAC, I have had a couple coins in my set with a CAC sticker and we asked why. Have also seen CAC stickers on low grade circ coins with defects so it makes me wonder why the sticker got there in the first place. In any case, I see 3rd party grading and the stickers as professional opinions, but still just opinions. I have resubmitted PCGS coins to NGC and gotten lower and higher grades arbitrarily so it's obvious that even all professionals will disagree. I suggest to everyone who asks me to pick a series, learn it well, and buy what looks nice, no matter it is in a details or straight grade holder. That sticker is just an agreement of an opinion, nothing more. What if you personally disagree?

[Six Mile Rick]

How could someone tell a regular NGC or PCGS modern MS67 high luster coin encapsulated inside a slab is PL or DMPL

(In My Opinion)

This is impossible to do without first removing the coin from the slab. Any measurement of mirror reading would be slab reflected.

I checked the MAC site out this weekend. Just for fun -- My 1959 Lincoln MS67rd NGC was list same as NGC value = $2000. "BUT" if I send it into MAC and get a sticker then the MAC value is $4000. Imagine trying to sell it for that price.

[coinman1794]

That's why I buy NGC graded coins. I can, and always use the NGC verification process. It will state whether or not the coin in question is certified, and if so, it will tell you if the coin has a CAP or MAC sticker attached to it.

 

NGC verification does not show whether a coin is CAC or MAC, as these features are added to the finished slab, without the express knowledge of NGC.

[RWB]

MAC & Cheese? Hmmmm....does not mix with coins.

[Lucky One]

How could someone tell a regular NGC or PCGS modern MS67 high luster coin encapsulated inside a slab is PL or DMPL

(In My Opinion)

This is impossible to do without first removing the coin from the slab. Any measurement of mirror reading would be slab reflected.

I checked the MAC site out this weekend. Just for fun -- My 1959 Lincoln MS67rd NGC was list same as NGC value = $2000. "BUT" if I send it into MAC and get a sticker then the MAC value is $4000. Imagine trying to sell it for that price.

 

Wow, what a joke! And I agree about the mirrors on prooflike and proof coins- it is impossible to determine depth through a slab.

 

Hype is king in this business, always has been, always will be. They do sell hype protectors- they're really old but some people still use them- they're called books. I sure wish all collectors strated out with ha collection of numismatic books before diving in blind and being taken by these deceivers. As I have said before- I have a few CAC stickered coiuns in my set but I didn't pay a premium for the coins- on nthe contrary, they were mistakes and I paid what the coin in the slab was worth, and I always ignore the slab label and any added stickers, relying on my knowledge and eye to determine the coin's true value. Yes, I still make the occasional mistake (why not? the pros do every single day too- it is human to err) for not inspecting the coin more closely, but overall it saves me a lot of money when I decide what is in the holder instead of allowing someone else to think for me.

[Lucky One]

by the way guys and gals- NGC just reported another fake slab recently, and as I have said for years, the slabs themselves are being faked by utilizing the PCGS and NGC look-ups and making exact copies of the slabs they see out there. They have become so good at making dies that all they need is the original rarity- they do a high res scan, send the data to a machine that cuts a nearly perfect die of the original coin with die lines and all, and it is very difficult to compare the two and find discrepancies. Many of us likely have one in our collection and believe it is real because the web sites say they are and there is no way to be sure without a new certification service to certify that the slab isn't fake. What a world we live in. I predicted this in 1986 when they told us it was the final solution. Obviously their crystal ball didn't have the same resolution that mine did...