Pics of my 4 Recent Downgrades From pcgs, and Yes, I can No Longer Post There.

[Prethen]

Could you ever prove to the grading company that they damaged your coin?

[coinman_23885]

It depends upon the nature of the grading. If you cracked a group of four MS66 Kennedy halves out of their holders and they were all returned to you graded MS63, would you say the grading company should be let off the hook, entirely? What if they graded AU58? What if they were newly damaged?

 

The above far fetched examples from above, aside, my point is that cracking coins out of holders shouldn't automatically absolve a grading company of all responsibility.

 

Would you please clarify the last paragraph of your post? What responsibility do you believe that PCGS has in this matter and what recourse or remedy, if any, do you think the OP is entitled to from PCGS? I think I might be reading your comments out of context. If not, I am curious as to how the comments above would relate to a recent thread by the poster you quoted about a 1965 condition rarity coin that was labeled by the grading service as a business strike, and then cracked out/conserved only to be discovered that it was a SMS striking.

[MarkFeld]

It depends upon the nature of the grading. If you cracked a group of four MS66 Kennedy halves out of their holders and they were all returned to you graded MS63, would you say the grading company should be let off the hook, entirely? What if they graded AU58? What if they were newly damaged?

 

The above far fetched examples from above, aside, my point is that cracking coins out of holders shouldn't automatically absolve a grading company of all responsibility.

 

Would you please clarify the last paragraph of your post? What responsibility do you believe that PCGS has in this matter and what recourse or remedy, if any, do you think the OP is entitled to from PCGS? I think I might be reading your comments out of context. If not, I am curious as to how the comments above would relate to a recent thread by the poster you quoted about a 1965 condition rarity coin that was labeled by the grading service as a business strike, and then cracked out/conserved only to be discovered that it was a SMS striking.

 

I was not speaking of a particular grading company or the coins in question - I haven't seen them.

 

My point was, that whatever responsibility a grading company has or should have shouldn't magically vanish, just because coins are cracked out of their holders and submitted fro grading. And, for example, if they damage a coin, it's not the fault of the submitter, merely because he cracked it out of the holder. Likewise, if a coin is badly mis-graded that's not the fault of the seller, either.

[Raisethis2]

Op makes a great point in that third party grading companies don't seem to have in interest in answering to their customers. While I'm not suggesting they should open up a "Complaint Department" it would be novel (and unheard of) that they would want to review their "product" in a case like this.

 

I think the submitter should be able to write a brief description and present photocopies of the original inserts, pictures of the coins (in the case of the scratch) and send the coins back for reconsideration at no charge.

 

Obviously this would not be possible for general grading disputes, cleaned coins and the like but a review in the case of a major dispute such as this, seems the right thing to do.

[physics-fan3.14]

My point was, that whatever responsibility a grading company has or should have shouldn't magically vanish, just because coins are cracked out of their holders and submitted fro grading. And, for example, if they damage a coin, it's not the fault of the submitter, merely because he cracked it out of the holder. Likewise, if a coin is badly mis-graded that's not the fault of the seller, either.

 

I agree with (most of) your points, Mark. However, I have 3 questions/points for you and/or the OP:

 

1.) Can you show us before and after pictures that prove the TPG scratched your coin while it was in their posession? Without proof, I feel you will have a really hard time with this one. I think it is equally likely that you scratched it while in the process of cracking it out, and didn't notice until it was returned to you.

 

2.) A single point difference (in either direction, up or down) is well within the tolerance of the grading scheme. Even the difference between PL and non-PL is pretty subjective, if its a borderline example. In Mark's extreme example of a 66 becoming a 58, you might have far more grounds for complaint, but if the coin was cracked out then you still have no legal footing. Yes, you may be terrible disappointed, but these were the risks you took by cracking them out.

 

3.) Once a coin has been cracked out, the TPG has absolutely no liability for the coin or the grade anymore. It may have been a 66+, but once the coin has been cracked, then you have no recourse for a grading guarantee if it is downgraded to a 65. If you leave it in the holder when you resubmit, if it downgrades then you are entitled to recompense under the grading guarantee. Cracking the coin voids the guarantee. Why then, Mark, would you argue otherwise (just trying to figure out where you're coming from on this one).

 

So, in summary, I'm sorry this happened to you, and that really sucks, but you took the risk when you cracked. This time, you got (very) un-lucky

[MarkFeld]

My point was, that whatever responsibility a grading company has or should have shouldn't magically vanish, just because coins are cracked out of their holders and submitted fro grading. And, for example, if they damage a coin, it's not the fault of the submitter, merely because he cracked it out of the holder. Likewise, if a coin is badly mis-graded that's not the fault of the seller, either.

 

I agree with (most of) your points, Mark. However, I have 3 questions/points for you and/or the OP:

 

1.) Can you show us before and after pictures that prove the TPG scratched your coin while it was in their posession? Without proof, I feel you will have a really hard time with this one. I think it is equally likely that you scratched it while in the process of cracking it out, and didn't notice until it was returned to you.

 

2.) A single point difference (in either direction, up or down) is well within the tolerance of the grading scheme. Even the difference between PL and non-PL is pretty subjective, if its a borderline example. In Mark's extreme example of a 66 becoming a 58, you might have far more grounds for complaint, but if the coin was cracked out then you still have no legal footing. Yes, you may be terrible disappointed, but these were the risks you took by cracking them out.

 

3.) Once a coin has been cracked out, the TPG has absolutely no liability for the coin or the grade anymore. It may have been a 66+, but once the coin has been cracked, then you have no recourse for a grading guarantee if it is downgraded to a 65. If you leave it in the holder when you resubmit, if it downgrades then you are entitled to recompense under the grading guarantee. Cracking the coin voids the guarantee. Why then, Mark, would you argue otherwise (just trying to figure out where you're coming from on this one).

 

So, in summary, I'm sorry this happened to you, and that really sucks, but you took the risk when you cracked. This time, you got (very) un-lucky

 

I wasn't opining that a guarantee should still apply in the case of a coin that has been cracked out of its holder. I was addressing one or more other posters who said something to the effect that if someone cracks a coin out of a holder and ends up with bad results, he has only himself to blame.

 

If a grading company damages a coin - and I'm not saying that was done to the OP's coin - there is someone other than the submitter to blame. And if a grading company under-grades coins outside of a reasonable tolerance level - I'm not saying that was done to the OP's coins - , there is someone other than the submitter to blame for the bad results. That was my point.

[physics-fan3.14]

I think I understand you Mark, and I think we agree within acceptable tolerance levels

[Afterword]

Op makes a great point in that third party grading companies don't seem to have in interest in answering to their customers. While I'm not suggesting they should open up a "Complaint Department" it would be novel (and unheard of) that they would want to review their "product" in a case like this.

 

I think the submitter should be able to write a brief description and present photocopies of the original inserts, pictures of the coins (in the case of the scratch) and send the coins back for reconsideration at no charge.

 

Obviously this would not be possible for general grading disputes, cleaned coins and the like but a review in the case of a major dispute such as this, seems the right thing to do.

 

 

 

Did he contact PCGS regarding this matter?

 

I would think that the amount of false and unfounded claims they would receive would render the option of a complaint venue untenable.

[dragon]

<<< 3.) Once a coin has been cracked out, the TPG has absolutely no liability for the coin or the grade anymore. It may have been a 66+, but once the coin has been cracked, then you have no recourse for a grading guarantee if it is downgraded to a 65. >>>

 

 

 

I am putting my faith into my legal counsel, the BBB, the FTC consumer division, and my credit card issuer for the charges. Time will tell what happens.

[AHFreak]

What I cant understand OP, is that if you have been playing this game for as long as you say you have, outside of the "newly scratched", why does this have to be such a big deal??? You have played the game before... obviously many times on the same coins we are talking about because you say you had it in this holder, that holder, with a plus, with a star, without, etc..... what exactly were you hoping for and when would you have stopped "resubmitting" the coins? I mean, if you really cracked out a "star plus" or "plus star" or whatever you say it was.... then Im surprised you are making such a humungous deal about getting some grades that you disagree with. you know its possible.. you still have the exact same coin, and if you think it should grade x, then send it back and hope for x this time...

 

Again, I speak outside of the newly scratched coin...

 

 

Also, I have read a little about people who have or are going up against PCGS... seems they have fairly substantial budget set aside for lawyers.... So I think it would be appropriate to tell you..... "GOOD LUCK". you would be better off resubmitting this coin (these coins) and hoping for whatever grade you desired than flushing your money down the toilet and calling it legal fees..

 

JUST MY OPINION... sounds absolutely crazy to me that someone who knows this game, and then "chooses" to play it would take it to the lengths you are talking about because they came back lower than what you think they should.... If you have played the game since it started you should know better than to think that taking legal action is going to be a good idea somehow some way... How many time have you cracked out these 4 coins, and what were you honestly expecting? When were you going to be satisfied with the label and stop cracking?

[bochiman]

<<< 3.) Once a coin has been cracked out, the TPG has absolutely no liability for the coin or the grade anymore. It may have been a 66+, but once the coin has been cracked, then you have no recourse for a grading guarantee if it is downgraded to a 65. >>>

 

 

 

I am putting my faith into my legal counsel, the BBB, the FTC consumer division, and my credit card issuer for the charges. Time will tell what happens.

 

Well, it WILL be interesting. I am pretty sure you won't be able to say much while things are proceeding, but I do hope you will come back full circle with whatever the results of your actions are.

[coinman_23885]

<<< 3.) Once a coin has been cracked out, the TPG has absolutely no liability for the coin or the grade anymore. It may have been a 66+, but once the coin has been cracked, then you have no recourse for a grading guarantee if it is downgraded to a 65. >>>

 

 

 

I am putting my faith into my legal counsel, the BBB, the FTC consumer division, and my credit card issuer for the charges. Time will tell what happens.

 

Legally, I don't think you are entitled to anything and PCGS is free to tell you to go away. I also think you are wasting more money by hiring a lawyer that I don't foresee as being able to do much for you above and beyond what you could do on your own. You paid for an opinion and you received it. Realistically, PCGS owes you nothing. From a practical standpoint, however, sometimes companies do give in when someone has shown the propensity to be a thorn in their side. I don't necessarily agree with the "shake down" approach, but it will be interesting to see what happens...

[AHFreak]

<<< 3.) Once a coin has been cracked out, the TPG has absolutely no liability for the coin or the grade anymore. It may have been a 66+, but once the coin has been cracked, then you have no recourse for a grading guarantee if it is downgraded to a 65. >>>

 

 

 

I am putting my faith into my legal counsel, the BBB, the FTC consumer division, and my credit card issuer for the charges. Time will tell what happens.

 

Legally, I don't think you are entitled to anything and PCGS is free to tell you to go away. I also think you are wasting more money by hiring a lawyer that I don't foresee as being able to do much for you above and beyond what you could do on your own. You paid for an opinion and you received it. Realistically, PCGS owes you nothing. From a practical standpoint, however, sometimes companies do give in when someone has shown the propensity to be a thorn in their side. I don't necessarily agree with the "shake down" approach, but it will be interesting to see what happens...

 

 

You have heard about companies giving in, but have you ever heard of this company giving in??? I am young in this biz, but from what I have heard, I would be waayyyy surprised if they have ever given in to anything or anyone... at all.

[Houston Investor]

I feel for the OP. I do admire him for posting that over there but feared what would happen.

 

I was considering getting a PCGS submission membership and now have put it on hold. I had dropped them years ago after an experience using Teletrade raw coin service - two batches of cracked out ANACS / ICG coins - one to PCGS, one to NGC. I have done well on some crackouts and not so hot on others. Its a risk I took responsibility for so I have no beef with any particular TPG and my preference for one over another reflects my own opinion (as to their accuracy, fairness, any perceived bias, or consistency) or business decision (it could be something as minor as tier or reholder cost). Cracking coins is sort of like upping ones bet to an all in in poker or calling a high bet.

 

I submit to NGC and have a lot of respect for them as a grading company. I see PMG as the leading currency submission service and believe NGC has made great progress in World Coin and Currency areas, especially pusblishing valuations.

 

The grading game is a personal decision and mine is not for debate.

[CaptHenway]

A hypothetical question:

 

If a coin is sent in five times and gets an MS-65 each time, and then is sent in a sixth time and gets an MS-66, and then is sent in a seventh time and gets an MS-65, has it been downgraded?

[MarkVIIIMarc]

This is all very interesting. I remember baseball cards getting graded. Funny thing is if they came back a higher grade then the service that previously graded them would be viewed as having made the mistake.

 

Perhaps grading services should kick out a description amd a "64-66" type grade based ojnwhat three of their graders saw. When scouting +, ++, or A, B, C, or a 1 to 5 or 1 to 10 scale really does. There is just soo exact something can be.

[O mint bug]

I hate to hear about this type of loss. Frankly I think PCGS is tightening up their grading standards to be the "Holder of Choice ". I think it is a marketing campaign and is somewhat effective. PCGS is a publicly traded company and is not covering their dividend with cash flow from operations. There is enough cash on hand to pay it for a while. Thereafter they will have to cut the dividend, which is the kiss of death for their stock price and their CEO. If they cannot become the " elite " TPG then it will be trouble in a couple of years. I was a banker for over 30 years and unless this changed I would not loan them a dime CAC or otherwise.

[coinman_23885]

I hate to hear about this type of loss. Frankly I think PCGS is tightening up their grading standards to be the "Holder of Choice ". I think it is a marketing campaign and is somewhat effective.

 

This makes no sense. This would actually be counterproductive to PCGS's sole goal of making money. If you have two respected services, would you send to the company that would grade it most generously when the spread between grades is large or the one that is going to be stingier and potentially cost you hundreds or thousands of dollars?

[Conder101]

Realistically, PCGS owes you nothing.

Unless he can PROVE that the scratched coin was damaged while it was in PCGS's hands and that seems to me to pretty difficult. Would seem to me you would need pictures of it in the original slab with no scratch, pictures of it raw ready for submitting with no scratch, Tru-Vue images of the coin in PCGS's hands with the new number and no scratch, and images in the new slab with the scratch. And in every case there needs to be clear enough evidence on the coin (identical marks etc) to prove that it is the same coin in all of the images.

 

Anything less leaves it open to question exactly when the scratch occurred. And for a coin in as high a grade as this one apparently was finding identical marks to prove the coin is the same in all the images could be difficult as well. (If there are distinctive toning patterns on the coin that could help.)

[MJ]

Realistically, PCGS owes you nothing.

Unless he can PROVE that the scratched coin was damaged while it was in PCGS's hands and that seems to me to pretty difficult. Would seem to me you would need pictures of it in the original slab with no scratch, pictures of it raw ready for submitting with no scratch, Tru-Vue images of the coin in PCGS's hands with the new number and no scratch, and images in the new slab with the scratch. And in every case there needs to be clear enough evidence on the coin (identical marks etc) to prove that it is the same coin in all of the images.

 

Anything less leaves it open to question exactly when the scratch occurred. And for a coin in as high a grade as this one apparently was finding identical marks to prove the coin is the same in all the images could be difficult as well. (If there are distinctive toning patterns on the coin that could help.)

 

He Better Call Saul

 

Mark

[telephoto1-migration]

<<< 3.) Once a coin has been cracked out, the TPG has absolutely no liability for the coin or the grade anymore. It may have been a 66+, but once the coin has been cracked, then you have no recourse for a grading guarantee if it is downgraded to a 65. >>>

 

 

 

I am putting my faith into my legal counsel, the BBB, the FTC consumer division, and my credit card issuer for the charges. Time will tell what happens.

 

I don't post here often but came over here because I perused the PCGS thread and wanted to see the images of the coins in question. Based on what I see, OP should have left well enough alone because although the coins are very nice, the original grades were pretty much end of the road IMO, at least as far as I can tell from the images provided.

 

But- regardless of my opinion, first and foremost OP's cardinal mistake was breaking them out of the holders rather than simply sending them in for reconsideration. That way at most he'd have been out some reconsideration/grading fees, the grades would have either stayed the same or gone up and none of this silly drama would have been necessary.

 

Second mistake... thinking that a TPG has any responsibility for something after it has been removed from their holder. You can threaten litigation all you want but in the end all you'll have is less money to show for it. A TPG has no control over what happens to something removed from their sealed holder, period. That would be like me selling you a wrapped loaf of bread and then calling me responsible for it being stale after you opened it. If I had to take an educated guess, I'm thinking the "mark" was either already there or happened when OP broke it out of the holder.

 

Finally-As to a chargeback, all that the TPG has to prove is that they rendered the services paid for, which were to grade the coins in question... and they did precisely that...so they'll win there also.

 

[AHFreak]

I hate to hear about this type of loss. Frankly I think PCGS is tightening up their grading standards to be the "Holder of Choice ". I think it is a marketing campaign and is somewhat effective.

 

This makes no sense. This would actually be counterproductive to PCGS's sole goal of making money. If you have two respected services, would you send to the company that would grade it most generously when the spread between grades is large or the one that is going to be stingier and potentially cost you hundreds or thousands of dollars?

 

Not that it matters but I agree with coinman here... That would cause more loss and less profit long term than just about anything else I can imagine them doing.

 

Plus, there are other ways for a company like PCGS (one that is public meaning driven and controlled by a board of executives who's sole purpose and intent is to maximize profits...) FOR INSTANCE, HAS ANYONE ELSE NOTICED THE OBSURD NUMBER OF MODERN COINS PCGS IS GIVING PR70DCAM, AND MS70'S ETC AS OF LATE??? OH, AND IF ANYONE HAS NOTICED THE RAPIDLY RISING NUMBER OF 70'S AND 70DCAM'S THAT THEY ARE "ASSIGNING" DO YOU ALSO HAVE ANY IDEA ABOUT HOW MUCH THEY CHARGE A DEALER WHEN THEY ASSIGN A MODERN PROOF COIN A PR70DCAM? OR A MODERN CIRC. STRIKE A MS70??? WHAT WOULD GUESS? WOULD YOU GUESS THEY ARE CHARGING 2X'S THE COST OF NORMAL GRADING? HOW ABOUT 5X's NORMAL COST? 10X's? NOPE..... HOW ABOUT $500 DOLLARS FOR A GRADE OF PR70DCAM!!! IN OTHER WORDS, WHY WOULD A COMPANY LIKE PCGS DO WHAT IS SUGGESTED ABOVE TO INCREASE PROFITS, WHEN THEY CAN JUST SELL 70's FOR $500 BUCKS PER INSTEAD??? (UNLESS U HAVE THE KEY DATE SILVER EAGLE PROOF, 95-W I BELIEVE? YEAH, ONE OF THOSE IN 70DCAM IS GOING TO COST YA $5000.00) THIS IS WHY I WORK WITH NGC;)

[originalisbest]

<<< 3.) Once a coin has been cracked out, the TPG has absolutely no liability for the coin or the grade anymore. It may have been a 66+, but once the coin has been cracked, then you have no recourse for a grading guarantee if it is downgraded to a 65. >>>

 

 

 

I am putting my faith into my legal counsel, the BBB, the FTC consumer division, and my credit card issuer for the charges. Time will tell what happens.

 

I don't post here often but came over here because I perused the PCGS thread and wanted to see the images of the coins in question. Based on what I see, OP should have left well enough alone because although the coins are very nice, the original grades were pretty much end of the road IMO, at least as far as I can tell from the images provided.

 

But- regardless of my opinion, first and foremost OP's cardinal mistake was breaking them out of the holders rather than simply sending them in for reconsideration. That way at most he'd have been out some reconsideration/grading fees, the grades would have either stayed the same or gone up and none of this silly drama would have been necessary.

 

Second mistake... thinking that a TPG has any responsibility for something after it has been removed from their holder. You can threaten litigation all you want but in the end all you'll have is less money to show for it. A TPG has no control over what happens to something removed from their sealed holder, period. That would be like me selling you a wrapped loaf of bread and then calling me responsible for it being stale after you opened it. If I had to take an educated guess, I'm thinking the "mark" was either already there or happened when OP broke it out of the holder.

 

Finally-As to a chargeback, all that the TPG has to prove is that they rendered the services paid for, which were to grade the coins in question... and they did precisely that...so they'll win there also.

 

Yeah, pretty much this says it all.

[dragon]

Well there's a few things I've learned after posting my recent experiences with a grading service:

 

 

1) No matter what the circumstances, the grading service is correct and you are incorrect.

 

2) No matter what grades you feel your coins are (were) or could be, you obviously made a mistake, don't know what you're looking at, and the grading service was correct.

 

3) If a coin was damaged while in the care of a grading service, they didn't do it and couldn't possibly have done it, therefore you must have done it or are imagining things.

 

4) Cracking a coin out of a holder regardless of reason is insanity and you deserve what happens from that point forward. The grading services don't make mistakes and it's always your fault no matter what. All accountability rests with you and you are wrong.

 

5) At least some collectors can in fact make exact grade determinations based on a low resolution cell phone pic posted online, and determine that you were wrong and the grading service is and always will be correct.

 

At least now I understand the ground rules and can handle myself accordingly :-)

[jpcienkus]

Well there's a few things I've learned after posting my recent experiences with a grading service:

 

 

1) No matter what the circumstances, the grading service is correct and you are incorrect.

 

2) No matter what grades you feel your coins are (were) or could be, you obviously made a mistake, don't know what you're looking at, and the grading service was correct.

 

3) If a coin was damaged while in the care of a grading service, they didn't do it and couldn't possibly have done it, therefore you must have done it or are imagining things.

 

4) Cracking a coin out of a holder regardless of reason is insanity and you deserve what happens from that point forward. The grading services don't make mistakes and it's always your fault no matter what. All accountability rests with you and you are wrong.

 

5) At least some collectors can in fact make exact grade determinations based on a low resolution cell phone pic posted online, and determine that you were wrong and the grading service is and always will be correct.

 

At least now I understand the ground rules and can handle myself accordingly :-)

 

I think a few posters in the thread were saying that, but not all.

[AHFreak]

Well there's a few things I've learned after posting my recent experiences with a grading service:

 

 

1) No matter what the circumstances, the grading service is correct and you are incorrect.

 

2) No matter what grades you feel your coins are (were) or could be, you obviously made a mistake, don't know what you're looking at, and the grading service was correct.

 

3) If a coin was damaged while in the care of a grading service, they didn't do it and couldn't possibly have done it, therefore you must have done it or are imagining things.

 

4) Cracking a coin out of a holder regardless of reason is insanity and you deserve what happens from that point forward. The grading services don't make mistakes and it's always your fault no matter what. All accountability rests with you and you are wrong.

 

5) At least some collectors can in fact make exact grade determinations based on a low resolution cell phone pic posted online, and determine that you were wrong and the grading service is and always will be correct.

 

At least now I understand the ground rules and can handle myself accordingly :-)

 

 

Sounds like you are just in a "poor me" place man.... I have replied multiple times in this thread, and I haven't written or suggested any of what you are wanting to convince yourself of...

 

Regardless of all that, I was being serious about the questions I asked in one of the replies: How many times have you cracked and sent these coins for grading? What were you hoping to get put on the labels where you would have stopped and thought, ok, good enough? Sounds like you were resubmitting over and over again to play the odds and attempt to get these coins into a holder that puts said coin in the bottom end of quality for said grade.. Why were you doing that? and also, Why are you crying about a scenario that if you really have the experience you say you have, you know is very very possible???

 

 

For the record, I personally have no problems believing 100% that the grading company, or someone at it, put the scratch on your coin..... those graders are just human like anyone else, and they drop stuff, fumble stuff, spit while they talk sometimes, drop a crumb sometimes etc... just like the rest of the humans in the world. I have had much more inconceivable than a scratch happen to a coin I submitted for grading.. so I do believe you about the scratch, furthermore it doesn't even surprise me. its bound to happen at some point if you are resubmitting coins over and over again;)

[bsshog40]

I don't feel that the tpg's are above anyone else here. How many times has anyone here dealt with poor customer service with ph companies, cable companies, or any other large company? Sometimes you get a very nice professional person and then you get the one that doesn't seem to care about you or the company they work for. A TPG is not exempt from having an employee come in with a bad attitude and the only thing they can take it out on is their product/customers coins. Pee off a customer and most likely they won't do business again which loses business for the company. The main objective as far as they are concerned. I'm not saying this is what happened, but why is it always blamed on the customer out to get something for nothing? I wouldn't think that someone with integrity would come in and complain about poor results with a crackout game. It's really a shame that we could never find out what they would have graded if sent in slabbed. Do you think that PCGS would have downgraded them then? Do you have that much reliability in them that they cannot make a mistake?

[michael]

pcgs does NOT grade coins never did

 

they price them..........................................

 

 

 

 

 

people send in coins for pricing most all already know the grades and if you are so hung up on grades them leave them raw as YOU ARE REALLY SMART and already know the grades

 

if you still don't understand please re read the above

 

 

 

you want to play the game? you want your coins priced? and you voluntarily pay for and ask for a subjective valuation pricing opinion on an ever changing floating scale from pcgs where the line is highly subjective ever changing and you catch them on the wrong day..............................

 

 

 

as the mad one MADMARTY has said many moons ago on the pcgs boards

if the slab doesn't fit, resubmit

 

well my friend

as today more than ever or really much the same as before it is a contrived highly subjective floating pricing market when it comes to pcgs pricing coins

 

again you don't like the game fine don't blame pcgs only the game

 

 

 

 

 

[GBurger717-migration]

Well there's a few things I've learned after posting my recent experiences with a grading service:

 

 

1) No matter what the circumstances, the grading service is correct and you are incorrect.

 

2) No matter what grades you feel your coins are (were) or could be, you obviously made a mistake, don't know what you're looking at, and the grading service was correct.

 

3) If a coin was damaged while in the care of a grading service, they didn't do it and couldn't possibly have done it, therefore you must have done it or are imagining things.

 

4) Cracking a coin out of a holder regardless of reason is insanity and you deserve what happens from that point forward. The grading services don't make mistakes and it's always your fault no matter what. All accountability rests with you and you are wrong.

 

5) At least some collectors can in fact make exact grade determinations based on a low resolution cell phone pic posted online, and determine that you were wrong and the grading

service is and always will be correct.

 

 

At least now I understand the ground rules and can handle myself accordingly :-)

 

Post of the year!

[telephoto1-migration]

Well there's a few things I've learned after posting my recent experiences with a grading service:

 

 

1) No matter what the circumstances, the grading service is correct and you are incorrect.

 

2) No matter what grades you feel your coins are (were) or could be, you obviously made a mistake, don't know what you're looking at, and the grading service was correct.

 

3) If a coin was damaged while in the care of a grading service, they didn't do it and couldn't possibly have done it, therefore you must have done it or are imagining things.

 

4) Cracking a coin out of a holder regardless of reason is insanity and you deserve what happens from that point forward. The grading services don't make mistakes and it's always your fault no matter what. All accountability rests with you and you are wrong.

 

5) At least some collectors can in fact make exact grade determinations based on a low resolution cell phone pic posted online, and determine that you were wrong and the grading service is and always will be correct.

 

At least now I understand the ground rules and can handle myself accordingly :-)

 

Translation:

 

a) My opinion of the grade is always correct so unless everything I submit upgrades, it has to be the fault of the TPG.

 

b) I didn't see a scratch or mark on a piece when I submitted it, so since my eyesight is as infallible as my grading prowess, it MUST be the TPG's fault.

 

c) I refuse to acknowledge the possibility that I could have made a mistake; it has to be a TPG conspiracy to keep my perfect coins from getting their due.

 

d) Anyone who doesn't agree 100% with everything I said is obviously just a TPG fanboy.

 

e) Rather than doing something as simple as resubmitting to either prove or disprove my contentions, I'm going to instead create threads looking for sympathy and threaten legal action, because that's more productive-and I'll insult TPGs in a passive aggressive post, on a site paid for by a TPG. That'll show 'em.