Stars vs Plus Poll; opinions needed

[#]

I'm sure this has been discussed before but I couldn't find it. There is a coin coming up for auction that I've wanted for some time; the problem is there are two of them. Coin #1 is a Proof 67* star; coin #2 is the same year, denomination but Proof 67+ plus. So far the bids are the same. I've heard buy the coin not the slab often and that eye appeal is everything aka buy what you like. But value wise, money being equal which one would you or should I buy? Both are NGC & CAC certified. Thanks in advance for your opinions and I'm going to attempt to set up a poll for the first time.

 

David

 

 

[brg5658]

I would say the answer is "it depends".

 

The star on proof coins usually means that either one side made cameo/ultra cameo and the other didn't or that both sides are "almost" cameo. The plus on a proof means that it's "almost the next higher grade", but has no bearing on the cameo/ultra cameo status of the coin.

 

If the particular coin is quite scarce in cameo/ultra cameo, then the star may make it more desirable than a plus coin. The plus is of trivial import if there are a sufficiently large number of coins in the next grade up or higher. The plus tends to pull a lot of weight when there are very few coins the full grade above (or none).

 

In the end, you should buy the coin that appeals to you the most (ceteris paribus).

 

-Brandon

 

[lehigh96]

I agree with Brandon. The value can be swayed by how close the star coin is to being a CAMEO, how close the + coin is to a higher grade, and the populations and price differences between the assigned grades and those for a higher grade or CAMEO coin.

 

If I were you, I would buy the coin that fits best in my collection. If your collection focuses on CAMEO contrast and you can't afford a CAMEO for this date/mm in this grade, the star coin would be a very appealing alternative. If your collection is about higher grades, go with the + coin.

 

Paul

[jom]

I think the above two responses are good. I'd only add that you should buy the coin you like the most and "like" include the price paid...regardless of the label. In the long run that is all that will matter.

 

jom

[Walkerfan]

Money and coin quality being equal; I would rather have the plus---it is likely worth a little more in the long term. It also depends on, if you prefer color or not, as STARS usually possess nicer toning.

[brg5658]

Money and coin quality being equal; I would rather have the plus---it is likely worth a little more in the long term. It also depends on, if you prefer color or not, as STARS usually possess nicer toning.

 

Given that they are proofs, the star is likely for "almost-cameo" status, not for color. I can't be sure without seeing the coins, but that's certainly the majority of the star proof coins I have seen.

 

 

[Walkerfan]

Money and coin quality being equal; I would rather have the plus---it is likely worth a little more in the long term. It also depends on, if you prefer color or not, as STARS usually possess nicer toning.

 

Given that they are proofs, the star is likely for "almost-cameo" status, not for color. I can't be sure without seeing the coins, but that's certainly the majority of the star proof coins I have seen.

 

 

Good point---you're probably right. I missed the detail that they're proofs. Although proofs are toned they don't have the dramatic color of MS coins.

[physics-fan3.14]

The star and the plus mean two completely different things, and aren't really comparable. Buy what you like.

[Raisethis2]

 

 

There's a built in premium for either. Depending on the coin the premium can be a few dollars or a lot of dollars. Consult the NGC price guide to better understand what a + and what a * are worth in your particular example.

 

As stated above however, buy what you like first and foremost.

[jpcienkus]

Great advice above. Without seeing the coin, I'd go for the *. Because that means "outstanding eye appeal" and that's what attracts me to the coin. Mechanical grade is important too, don't get me wrong, but I lean toward eye appeal first.

 

Open two tabs open, one with each coin. Click back and forth and focus on the coin only. You might be able to determine which appeals to you more.

 

In my limited experience, I've seen premiums paid for both a + and a *. Buy the coin that you like best regardless of the label.

[coinman1794]

I'm sure this has been discussed before but I couldn't find it. There is a coin coming up for auction that I've wanted for some time; the problem is there are two of them. Coin #1 is a Proof 67* star; coin #2 is the same year, denomination but Proof 67+ plus. So far the bids are the same. I've heard buy the coin not the slab often and that eye appeal is everything aka buy what you like. But value wise, money being equal which one would you or should I buy? Both are NGC & CAC certified. Thanks in advance for your opinions and I'm going to attempt to set up a poll for the first time.

 

David

 

 

I'm forced to vote C because * and + mean two completely different things at NGC, and are not comparable, especially on a Proof. The Star can be awarded to a low-end 67 with a Cameo obverse or with a whisp of rainbow color. The 67+ is a borderline 68. Too little info provided to make a real judgement.

[$ilverHawk]

The star and the plus mean two completely different things, and aren't really comparable. Buy what you like.

 

Agree, brushing aside the TPG "blessings" you are much better off having a coin that you like as a collector. Star, plus whatever.

 

After all, collectors are the final arbiters of the value of a coin.

 

Carl

[FishyOne]

Based on what I've seen, the Star * usually beats the Plus +.

[wheat'swheats]

This is a star CAC coin

[brg5658]

This is a star CAC coin

 

wheat, that's a fantastic coin...

 

...but...

 

I think many of you are missing the fact that the OPs coin is a star PROOF coin...which is not the same as a star circulation strike. The designation means different things for proofs!!!

[wheat'swheats]

You are correct that the initial discussion was a proof but this does show what the star designates as far as eye appeal

[Coindude]

Wheat, even though those are nice pictures, it would be nice to see some great pictures of that great coin!!

[wheat'swheats]

If I was a great photographer that could happen but considering that I am a lousy photographer and these photos were taken by a friend........ well you get the picture. Thanks Sam

[johnny9434]

This is a star CAC coin

that sure is a wonderful looking coin.

[#]

Thank you to all! I'm not a photographer and not a coin investor. I have always just collected things I like regardless of slab or grade. I guess I knew the right answer but this is my first proof and high end; the proof is part of the E.P. Newman collection and I going to overpay for it just to own apiece of numistis history. Again, I know this is not the appropriate reason to purchase a coin but since I'll never sell it, it doesn't really how much it cost. My son will eventually just sell it for video games and beer.

 

Your opinions brought up several things to consider.

Thanks again,

David

[coinman_23885]

I would say the answer is "it depends".

 

The star on proof coins usually means that either one side made cameo/ultra cameo and the other didn't or that both sides are "almost" cameo. The plus on a proof means that it's "almost the next higher grade", but has no bearing on the cameo/ultra cameo status of the coin.

 

 

Or it could be applied to a superbly toned proof. This is especially true given that a good number of the Newman proofs are toners. Generally, I have seen the designation applied fairly often to both - far too often to assume without seeing pictures.

 

In any event, I agree with your conclusion that it depends. Grade wise, the difference between a 67 and 67+ is relatively small. Go with the most eye appealing specimen and don't get caught up on TPG labels. If there isn't a major difference in eye appeal or overall quality, go with the plus assuming the cost is constant or very close.

[brg5658]

I would say the answer is "it depends".

 

The star on proof coins usually means that either one side made cameo/ultra cameo and the other didn't or that both sides are "almost" cameo. The plus on a proof means that it's "almost the next higher grade", but has no bearing on the cameo/ultra cameo status of the coin.

 

 

Or it could be applied to a superbly toned proof. This is especially true given that a good number of the Newman proofs are toners. Generally, I have seen the designation applied fairly often to both - far too often to assume without seeing pictures.

 

Now that you know the OP is referring to a Newman piece, it could very well be for toning. But, when he first posted no such information was given. I still stand by my assertion that for starred proof coins, the great majority are for "almost cameo" status -- not for color.

[Houston Investor]

I really don't play the star or sticker game. I buy the coin based on what I can sell it for. I know how to look at coins so my opinion of a coin is based on my assessment of it, not necessarily a star or sticker. If I can't buy the coin at a price that allows me to a chance to immediately move it for a little more, then I simply am not a buyer.

 

 

[Walkerfan]

I really don't play the star or sticker game. I buy the coin based on what I can sell it for. I know how to look at coins so my opinion of a coin is based on my assessment of it, not necessarily a star or sticker. If I can't buy the coin at a price that allows me to a chance to immediately move it for a little more, then I simply am not a buyer.

 

 

Well said. Even though I am more of a collector than a flipper----I agree with your concept.