Cracking out coins

[newprepper]

Just wondering,...............you guys all look for the best slabbed coin you can find...................then I read at least 2 posts recently where you say you are going to crack it out and put it in yout album?!?! Are you joking or can you explain it to me please. Doesn't that go against the whole purpose of buying slabbed?

[jerseycat10]

Some collectors don't believe in entombing their coins.

 

They would rather enjoy their coins in the flesh.

 

It is not advisable for beginning collectors to crack out collectable coins.

[PennyGuy]

There are two general schools of thought........

One, if an owner of a slabbed coin would prefer to have that coin in an album they will crack the coin out....

Two, If an owner of a slabbed coin would prefer to have that coin in the slab, they won't crack it out.

 

I have done both.

[Coindude]

James isn't a slab fan and prefers his coins in their natural raw state, and in albums.

 

That's just the way he rolls!

[newprepper]

So if you upgrade later, what are your options?

[Walkerfan]

So if you upgrade later, what are your options?

 

You're screwed---you will not get back what you have into it,MOST ESPECIALLY, f it is a BIG TICKET item. I would NEVER crack out a coin worth more than 50 bucks.

[James_OldeTowne]

James isn't a slab fan and prefers his coins in their natural raw state, and in albums.

 

That's just the way he rolls!

In my core collection, I have approximately 250 certified coins that will not be cracked out. But probably 80% of my collection by volume is in UNcertified coins, many of which were cracked out of slabs.

 

Tomorrow, I am going to crack out a 1936 proof quarter in PF-65, and a 1937 proof Walker in PF-67. The coins will be going straight into my album.

 

I will NEVER upgrade these coins. Therefore, I do not care at all whether or not they would ever get back into any slab at any grade. The coins will have a permanent place of honor in my album set. Oh, and they cost me well over $2000 total.

 

So if you upgrade later, what are your options?

You're screwed---you will not get back what you have into it,MOST ESPECIALLY, f it is a BIG TICKET item. I would NEVER crack out a coin worth more than 50 bucks.

I have cracked out a $10,000 +++ coin and never looked back. It's my coin, and I don't care about what a grading company thinks of it, because all that matters to me is how much I enjoy owning it.

 

Incidentally, one can do quite well cracking out "big ticket items" IF one knows what he is doing .

 

(But it's good advice to newbies NOT to crack stuff out.)

[mkman123]

James, care to post pics of your coins?

[bochiman]

More power to those who do crack them out.

Their choice.

 

More power to those that DON'T crack them out.

Their choice as well.

 

I have only cracked a couple of coins out for albums, and less than a few dozen cracked in total (for resubmitting over the years).

 

The only think I wish would be that, for the major grading services (PCGS/NGC), these would somehow be removed from the census (I know they can/will be if tags are sent in, but I also know most don't do it....myself included because I am lazy...of course, the ones I have from the top 2 that I cracked out are very few...though I do have some NGC tags from PCGS crossovers).

[newprepper]

James, I hope the people you will leave those particular coins to, will understand how important to you they were, and just aren't hunks of metal, nothing make me sadder than seeing stuff like that sold by family just wanting a quick buck, I see it all the time on ebay looking at military awards, the one that comes to mind I see alot of is Combat Infantry Badges that were owned by fathers uncles and grandfathers, the prople just sell them. How I wish I could have gotten my Uncles CIB from Korea that he was awarded to wear on my uniform. He also got a Silver Star and Purple Heart at the same time. I got mine in IRAQ. Thanks for explaining it to me.

[mtnstyne]

Understand as well not all slabs are created equal. NGC and PCGS slabs are considered the top tier because they come with certain guarantees by the companies, hence they have to have higher standards to reduce their risk.

 

Other slabs like ANACS and ICG are not considered top tier and while provide protection and a grade opinion, I would take it with a grain of salt and make your own assessment.

 

I have cracked out coins for my type album from all the above mentioned companies, but they were all low end (under $150) coins that I want to enjoy. I prefer to be able to touch and feel a coin and share it with my kids. These coins also carry virtually no premium being slabbed or raw, the kind of coins that most people would recommend not submitting in the first place.

 

That being said, I have some coins that I bought to enjoy, but are also investment quality. Those I will never crack out.

 

My family knows that there are some that have intrinsic value and some that are merely sentimental value.

 

In the end it is your decision on what to do with your coins.

[PerryHall]

I prefer my coins to be slabbed. Some coins "will never be sold" but realistically I may have to sell them some day to cover some unanticipated financial emergency or my collecting interests may change. Slabbed coins usually bring more in the marketplace for obvious reasons---the authenticity and grade guarantees. Also, slabs affords a high degree of physical protection to coins.

[BillJones]

I too prefer my coin to be slabbed. It prevents damage and makes them much easier to sell at the best price if that is what I want to do. In the old days I put my best coins in custom made Capital Plastic holders. Aside from the fact that I could remove the coins from those holders when I wanted to do do it, that's not much different from having them in a slab.

 

I've been through with albums for sets of coins from years. Aside from the fact that they are too big to put in bank safe deposit boxes, the slides can do more than their share of damge. I do use Eagle brand holders and albums for my tokens and medalets. The system is very flexible in a individual coins can be taken out of albums and put in the bank vault as needed.

[Hard Times]

I agree with Bill, there is also the issue of collector responsibility towards rare coins that are slabable in NGC and PCGS graded holders - once they are cracked out, even a nice AU50 bust half for example, they are going to be exposed to environmental degradation that will not occur if slabbed. Hence, you risk having the coin degrade over time to a lesser preserved state and you don't leave the coin in the same state to enjoy for future generations. There are of course products out there to preserve as best possible both raw and slabbed coins, for example Intercept Shield products, but there is no way possible that keeping coins raw over the long term, especially silver and copper, is as good for preservation as being in a slab. Each time you put yours hand on it, acids and fluids on your skin that are imparted to the coins surfaces no matter how careful you are, each time you bring it out of its holder, you expose it to gases and water vapor in the air. These all have effects of degradation to coins over the long term.

 

So this is an issue for anyone that is considering keeping raw quality rare coins - are you concerned about what you leave for the future generations?

 

It is very remarkable that we have so many nice examples of 100 year and older coins to enjoy, but slabs will help those coins be preserved for more centuries and IMHO is something to consider when building a collection.

 

Best, HT

[newprepper]

Thanks all, pretty good discussion with a variety of opinions, as it should be I suppose. People have a variety of reasons for collecting, all valid. Thanks again for your input

[leeg]

Cracked this out for a 7070 Album back in the day:

 

 

Spent some time conserving it then sent it to Mike Printz to image for me when he was at Larry Whitlow:

 

 

 

 

[newprepper]

any regrets?

[Houston Investor]

I don't usually crack out slabbed coins unless there is a problem (coin going bad in holder, needs conserving) or crossover ICG to NGC for example. It costs money to slab coins once you add grading fees, shipping, and insurance. I recently have run up $67 slabbing a $450 world coin which belongs to a friend.

 

I do not crack slabbed coins to put in album as this is not my acquisition / collecting goal. There are collectors who do this especially with problem, details slabs along with dealers who have a lot of this material to serve this market. I am not a buyer of problem / details coins but know of one individual who looks for bargains in this area for his customers. The problem / details slabs at his table make quite a display.

[AnkurJ]

Ive cracked out dozens for albums.....which a few years later sent in to get slabbed again and even got a few upgrades!

[Nutmeg Coin]

I would only crack out to get a better grade, never to "liberate" the entombed coins. Pliers work for me.

 

At the ANA a dealer showed me a high end gold coin that he had cracked out to try for the higher grade, it had a CAC sticker. It is not an upgrade, most of the upgrades have already been made; what is left are often downgrades. So I would say that is the risk with a crack out. The grading service was generous with the non-details grade and you crack it, you will likely have a details grade coin!

[James_OldeTowne]

If someone is really, really worried and fretting over "grade", then of course, it pretty much never makes sense to crack a coin out of a slab (except to upgrade).

 

However, personally, I do not care one bit about a "grade". I collect COINS and that is all.

 

If a coin would look perfect in my album, I absolutely do not care what it "grades" since that is completely irrelevant. It gets cracked out and put in the album. Why would it matter to me what someone else thinks of the coins that I want to own forever?? I do not impose my grading standards on other people and hope for the same courtesy.

 

The highest graded coin I've ever cracked out was a PCGS PF-69 Ike that cost me $300 (it would cost a lot more now). I've cracked out dozens of coins in the MS-67 range as well for my Washington quarter and other sets. I just simply do not care at all about what the coin "graded" once it is in my album. It's there to stay, and all that matters to me is that I like how it looks with the other coins in the album.

[TomB]

The vast majority of my collection consists of coins in slabs and the vast majority of my inventory consists of coins in slabs. However, some coins have relatively little downside in cracking out of their slabs.

 

About ten years ago I was putting together a complete set of Barber half dollars in VF. At that time there were relatively few Barber half dollars in slabs, which was fine with me since my set was raw and was stored in two Library of Coins albums. A few of the coins were found in holders and I carcked those out to put the coins in the albums. Even though the coins were approximately $500 each, it was still not that risky to do since circulated Barber half dollars are pretty easy to grade. In general, I do not advise newer collectors to crack coins out of their holders.

[Nutmeg Coin]

One of my first real experiences with raw coins was with "Numisgroup"; a company that ran ads for "loss leader" certified coins on page 2 of the Wall Street Journal (urinal?). I was later contacted by them about a fresh collection from a Florida estate, raw gold coins especially the hard to grade incuse $5 Indian coins, that a "former" grader from NGC or PCGS (or both) had graded himself as mid-grade MS. Of course it all proved a sham, and since the coins were not properly certified the raw coins cost the customers who kept them big bucks. In my case, a quick phone call with Scott Travers saved by bacon, and I scotched the deal, losing nothing. Plus the "Numisgroup" operation went down and the top people there went to jail. A quick search on the net will prove this.

 

If we are talking about under $150 coins, raw may be no problem. A big gold guy who tries to buy gold coins at the NY area shows and flea markets told me the other day that he cracks all the gold coins out of their holders that this system of certified coins is based on the greater fool theory. I strongly disagree. The market for certifieds is supported at reasonable levels if you do your research.

[Walkerfan]

Incidentally, I use the album or 2 x2 'flip test' as my sort of acid test. If a coin is in a slab, I try to imagine it RAW in a dealers inventory or in a 2 X 2. If I think that the coin would STILL look good raw or in a flip---then I 'like' the coin. If it would NOT, then I wouldn't buy it----Period. End of story.

 

I have seen a few coins (unfortunately owned a couple) like that, too, that were worth MANY THOUSANDS----even TENS of thousands. I will either not buy or quickly get rid of a coin like that.

 

Try it---it works and don't be 'taken in' by the plastic. It is certainly NOT the be all end all. That's for sure.

[James_OldeTowne]

Incidentally, I use the album or 2 x2 'flip test' as my sort of acid test. If a coin is in a slab, I try to imagine it RAW in a dealers inventory or in a 2 X 2. If I think that the coin would STILL look good raw or in a flip---then I 'like' the coin. If it would NOT, then I wouldn't buy it----Period. End of story.

In my opinion, this is superb strategy, and is exactly what I do as well.

[Walkerfan]

Incidentally, I use the album or 2 x2 'flip test' as my sort of acid test. If a coin is in a slab, I try to imagine it RAW in a dealers inventory or in a 2 X 2. If I think that the coin would STILL look good raw or in a flip---then I 'like' the coin. If it would NOT, then I wouldn't buy it----Period. End of story.

In my opinion, this is superb strategy, and is exactly what I do as well.

 

That's awesome, James :thumbsup: It works well.

[Nutmeg Coin]

Isn't it possible if you crack out a high end coin like an MS/PR70 coin, the little bit of friction by putting the coin in the plastic flip or album could cause a downgrade?

[James_OldeTowne]

Isn't it possible if you crack out a high end coin like an MS/PR70 coin, the little bit of friction by putting the coin in the plastic flip or album could cause a downgrade?

It sure is.

 

Do I care? No, not if I just want the coin and don't care about the grade.

 

Of course, I doubt that I'd ever buy a "70" coin, much less crack one out, because I'm not too keen on paying an exorbitant premium for a grade that doesn't actually exist anyway.

[Kurtdog]

I don't know what you boys have against slabs. I put BBQ sauce on mine, they're really good!

[mtnstyne]

Isn't it possible if you crack out a high end coin like an MS/PR70 coin, the little bit of friction by putting the coin in the plastic flip or album could cause a downgrade?

 

You won't find many investment quality coins graded MS/PR70...mostly the recent mass produced for collector stuff that is shipped to the TPG's by the truck load to be sold to unsuspecting QVC shoppers at 1 a.m.

 

Most on here would say a raw ASE and an MS70 ASE are worth the same.