Heritage Buyer Premium going up to 17.5%

[AnkurJ]

I'm sure that consignors won't be happy about this.

[comicdonna]

19.5% for comics. It's been that way as long as I have been purchasing from them. It was just a matter of time for an increase in coin purchases.

[MarkFeld]

I am somewhat perplexed by bidders who say that they won't bid any longer, rather than simply lower their hammer bids to account for the increased fee.

[mintcollector]

I am somewhat perplexed by bidders who say that they won't bid any longer, rather than simply lower their hammer bids to account for the increased fee.

 

Agreed. One of the most respected auction houses in my area charges a 20% buyer's premium. I still buy, I just take that into account when bidding. I would imagine so do the bidders I go up against as well.

 

Kind Regards,

 

'mint'

[comicdonna]

I always thought that was a given. Figure your maximum bid with the BP added in.

[messydesk]

Bids adjusted accordingly. They even make it easy by telling you what the price is with buyer's premium when you are looking at the lots online. I'd be miffed as a consignor, unless the extra 2.5% buyer fee were accompanied by a like reduction in the seller fee.

[coinsbygary]

This will have a negative impact on the consignors because bidders like me always take the buyers fee into account when I place a bid. Since my bid less buyers premium is less, it means that while Heritage collects more, the consignors get less.

 

I know they're the new kid on the block, but Great Collections has a 10% buyers fee and a 5% sellers fee for all final hammers under $1000. For final hammers over $1000 the seller pays no fee except for listing fees. I just sent 10 coins over to Great Collections for consignment, I'll report about how that goes when they sell and compare it to my E-Bay sales which drives me nuts with fees from both E-Bay and PayPal.

Gary

[EXOJUNKIE]

This will have a negative impact on the consignors because bidders like me always take the buyers fee into account when I place a bid. Since my bid less buyers premium is less, it means that while Heritage collects more, the consignors get less.

 

I know they're the new kid on the block, but Great Collections has a 10% buyers fee and a 5% sellers fee for all final hammers under $1000. For final hammers over $1000 the seller pays no fee except for listing fees. I just sent 10 coins over to Great Collections for consignment, I'll report about how that goes when they sell and compare it to my E-Bay sales which drives me nuts with fees from both E-Bay and PayPal.

Gary

 

I just bought my first coin from Great Collections and IMO got a nice deal. I don't have it in hand yet, but it looked good online.

 

I buy/sell on eBay/HA/S-B as well, but I'm getting sick and tired of rising fees. Raising buyers fees just sticks it to everyone EXCEPT the auction house. Let's face it--no one likes to feel like they're getting the shaft. Sure, go ahead and adjust your bids based on the increase if that makes you feel better, but I'll bet you're going to lose more coins because most people aren't as disciplined as you and in their mind will only see the bid price, not the "juice," which is exactly what HA/S-B is counting on.

 

S-B, and now HA, are putting the double whammy on both the consignor and the buyer. Unfortunately, when there are only the two of them--a duopoly basically owning this major market--they can easily conspire to raise their fees. They are flirting with a violation of antitrust law as far as I'm concerned.

 

I'm considering starting my own website to wean myself off of their selling services. I hope others will do the same.

 

I'm stepping down from the soapbox now.

[comicdonna]

I am guessing Heritage did a lot of research of prices realized in other auction houses, and felt there was room for the added premium. Time will tell.

[AnkurJ]

I wouldnt be surprised if they started giving a piece of the buyers fee to the consignors as an incentive to sell with them. What is their current sellers fee?

[Hard Times]

I am somewhat perplexed by bidders who say that they won't bid any longer, rather than simply lower their hammer bids to account for the increased fee.

 

But the bidding increments won't change, so it will be difficult to reduce your bid. For example, say you want to bid $1000 with at 15% BP. The lower bid increment for example is $950. If you want to bid $975 instead to go over $950 to lower your hammer bid down 2.5%, it does not meet a higher hammer bid in most of the online systems with set bid increments that would require the next $50 bid increment to go over and be accepted. So instead you still have to have a hammer bid $1000 to go over $950 and so you still will be paying the higher BP because you are forced to put in the same bid value and cannot put in a lower hammer bid.

[MarkFeld]

I am somewhat perplexed by bidders who say that they won't bid any longer, rather than simply lower their hammer bids to account for the increased fee.

 

But the bidding increments won't change, so it will be difficult to reduce your bid. For example, say you want to bid $1000 with at 15% BP. The lower bid increment for example is $950. If you want to bid $975 instead to go over $950 to lower your hammer bid down 2.5%, it does not meet a higher hammer bid in most of the online systems with set bid increments that would require the next $50 bid increment to go over and be accepted. So instead you still have to have a hammer bid $1000 to go over $950 and so you still will be paying the higher BP because you are forced to put in the same bid value and cannot put in a lower hammer bid.

 

That sounds like a very good reason to enter your bids early, on-line. That way, in most cases, you won't have to contend with the minimum bidding increment. But don't tell anyone.

[FishyOne]

I wouldnt be surprised if they started giving a piece of the buyers fee to the consignors as an incentive to sell with them. What is their current sellers fee?

 

Currently 10%. Now that drops for larger consignments, negotiations, friends, relatives, etc.

 

Getting 72.5% of the hammer price? Not for me.

[MarkFeld]

I wouldnt be surprised if they started giving a piece of the buyers fee to the consignors as an incentive to sell with them. What is their current sellers fee?

 

Currently 10%. Now that drops for larger consignments, negotiations, friends, relatives, etc.

 

Getting 72.5% of the hammer price? Not for me.

 

The worst case scenario for a consignor would be to get 90% of hammer, not 72.5%. And most consignors do better than that - some of them, much better.

[comicdonna]

I wouldnt be surprised if they started giving a piece of the buyers fee to the consignors as an incentive to sell with them. What is their current sellers fee?

 

Currently 10%. Now that drops for larger consignments, negotiations, friends, relatives, etc.

 

Getting 72.5% of the hammer price? Not for me.

 

The worst case scenario for a consignor would be to get 90% of hammer, not 72.5%. And most consignors do better than that - some of them, much better.

If a coin sold for $1000, The sellers premium would be $100. The buyers premium would be $175. The seller would end up with $900 Heritage would make $275

 

The actual final hammer with BP is $1175 With Heritage getting $275, the consignor is getting less than 90%

[Hard Times]

I am somewhat perplexed by bidders who say that they won't bid any longer, rather than simply lower their hammer bids to account for the increased fee.

 

But the bidding increments won't change, so it will be difficult to reduce your bid. For example, say you want to bid $1000 with at 15% BP. The lower bid increment for example is $950. If you want to bid $975 instead to go over $950 to lower your hammer bid down 2.5%, it does not meet a higher hammer bid in most of the online systems with set bid increments that would require the next $50 bid increment to go over and be accepted. So instead you still have to have a hammer bid $1000 to go over $950 and so you still will be paying the higher BP because you are forced to put in the same bid value and cannot put in a lower hammer bid.

 

That sounds like a very good reason to enter your bids early, on-line. That way, in most cases, you won't have to contend with the minimum bidding increment. But don't tell anyone.

 

Yep, but alas I am a late bidder.................

[jom]

Exactly what ARE the costs to these companies that require such high fees? Those HUGE catalogs most don't want? Keeping up their slow website? Photography (which is poor IMO)?

 

It's true that as a buyer you only need to adjust bid so not bidding is a bit over the top. However, the way things are going there won't be any decent coins IN the auction to begin with if these fees keep increasing.

 

There has to be some point in which the fees are just too much for the market to bear.

 

jom

[e1cnr]

they need to make it easier for bidders to be able to figure in their head

 

if they can't go 10%, then they should use 20%, or 25%, or 50% or 100%

 

then calculations could be so much easier in your head

[FishyOne]

I wouldnt be surprised if they started giving a piece of the buyers fee to the consignors as an incentive to sell with them. What is their current sellers fee?

 

Currently 10%. Now that drops for larger consignments, negotiations, friends, relatives, etc.

 

Getting 72.5% of the hammer price? Not for me.

 

The worst case scenario for a consignor would be to get 90% of hammer, not 72.5%. And most consignors do better than that - some of them, much better.

 

My mistake. Yes, 72.5% of the selling price, not the hammer price.

 

Of course, the buyer pays Heritage shipping & handling on top of the buyer's premium. The consigner pays to ship the coins to Heritage. The consigner could easily end up with less than 70% of what the buyer pays Heritage.

 

It's tough on the consigner unless they're a big player and, apparently, that's really who Heritage wants to work with anyway.

[comicdonna]

they need to make it easier for bidders to be able to figure in their head

 

if they can't go 10%, then they should use 20%, or 25%, or 50% or 100%

 

then calculations could be so much easier in your head

When you bid online, it tells you how much the next bid is both before and after BP.

[BAJJERFAN]

I am somewhat perplexed by bidders who say that they won't bid any longer, rather than simply lower their hammer bids to account for the increased fee.

 

It is an easier thing to say than it is to do effectively. You likely won't win many coins you want with that approach.

[AnkurJ]

They gave me 110% on a coin once that turned out to be a problem coin. Was in a small ANACS holder. I've never been happier to lose $400.

[MarkFeld]

I wouldnt be surprised if they started giving a piece of the buyers fee to the consignors as an incentive to sell with them. What is their current sellers fee?

 

Currently 10%. Now that drops for larger consignments, negotiations, friends, relatives, etc.

 

Getting 72.5% of the hammer price? Not for me.

 

The worst case scenario for a consignor would be to get 90% of hammer, not 72.5%. And most consignors do better than that - some of them, much better.

If a coin sold for $1000, The sellers premium would be $100. The buyers premium would be $175. The seller would end up with $900 Heritage would make $275

 

The actual final hammer with BP is $1175 With Heritage getting $275, the consignor is getting less than 90%

 

In the example you gave above, you validated my statement that the consignor would be getting 90% of hammer (not 72 1/2%, as another poster had written). I didn't say 90% of the total price, but rather, 90% of hammer. And I stand by that.

[$ilverHawk]

Good point. Time will tell. As a buyer, I clearly understand the concept of adjusting the bid to account for the increase in Heritage Auctions charges. But, as a seller, I wonder, in the current market conditions, exactly what convinced Heritage that they could extract an additional 2.5% from the transaction?

 

About 1 year ago I consigned my Morgan Dollar Date set with Heritage and enjoyed positive results. I am now in the process of looking to consign 42 coins of mixed types. I will have to say that from a sellers perspective, the increase by Heritage definitely makes me look to other venues. Great Collections appears to be a very creditable alternative. While the exposure is not as large, the the potential return is better.

 

I believe I just answered my question. Heritage is betting that the larger audience they command will negate the effect of their increased fees. I think Heritage has misjudged current market conditions. As a seller I will definitely look to alternative venues. As a buyer I will continue to include Heritage Auctions as a potential source and adjust my bids accordingly.

 

Carl

[truthteller]

I've been a consignor through Heritage Auctions for 20+ years. I've always negotiated a fair commission rate at a minimum of 100% of hammer. On many occasions, I have received three to four times for what I thought the coin would sell and rarely had to have a buyback. As a consignor, if you pinch the pennies, you will loose the dollars. 17.5% doesn't bother me if I am getting 4-5 times price guide.

 

 

TRUTH

[AnkurJ]

I've been a consignor through Heritage Auctions for 20+ years. I've always negotiated a fair commission rate at a minimum of 100% of hammer. On many occasions, I have received three to four times for what I thought the coin would sell and rarely had to have a buyback. As a consignor, if you pinch the pennies, you will loose the dollars. 17.5% doesn't bother me if I am getting 4-5 times price guide.

 

 

TRUTH

 

I dont think you can always bet on getting 4-5x guide.

 

TRUTH

[123cents]

I am somewhat perplexed by bidders who say that they won't bid any longer, rather than simply lower their hammer bids to account for the increased fee.

 

It is an easier thing to say than it is to do effectively. You likely won't win many coins you want with that approach.

 

I agree. That's the approach I will have to use but I doubt it will work on the nicer coins. We'll see.

[truthteller]

I've been a consignor through Heritage Auctions for 20+ years. I've always negotiated a fair commission rate at a minimum of 100% of hammer. On many occasions, I have received three to four times for what I thought the coin would sell and rarely had to have a buyback. As a consignor, if you pinch the pennies, you will loose the dollars. 17.5% doesn't bother me if I am getting 4-5 times price guide.

 

 

TRUTH

 

I dont think you can always bet on getting 4-5x guide.

 

 

Of course not. That's why smart consignors place coins in Heritage Auctions that will do well with a sophisticated audience, not just "stuff" or lower level collector coins. There are many other venues for under $500 coins.

 

 

TRUTH

[BAJJERFAN]

I wouldnt be surprised if they started giving a piece of the buyers fee to the consignors as an incentive to sell with them. What is their current sellers fee?

 

Currently 10%. Now that drops for larger consignments, negotiations, friends, relatives, etc.

 

Getting 72.5% of the hammer price? Not for me.

 

The worst case scenario for a consignor would be to get 90% of hammer, not 72.5%. And most consignors do better than that - some of them, much better.

 

My mistake. Yes, 72.5% of the selling price, not the hammer price.

 

Of course, the buyer pays Heritage shipping & handling on top of the buyer's premium. The consigner pays to ship the coins to Heritage. The consigner could easily end up with less than 70% of what the buyer pays Heritage.

 

It's tough on the consigner unless they're a big player and, apparently, that's really who Heritage wants to work with anyway.

 

Yep. They should just quit accepting coins worth less than $500 or consign them to some monthly auction with reduced fees.

[Arizonadesertrat]

Bumping up the BP will not likely affect bidding on collector coins that are nice for their grades, with the exception of generic gold and silver in common grades. In these cases, I suspect that we will see fewer of these items being auctioned by Heritage in the future.