1884S Morgan Dollar

[darrincraig1984]

Another one I am thinking of buying

 

 

[e1cnr]

big multiples of difference in value between XF45 and MS62

 

hard to tell with those pics how much luster and whether obverse is cleaned

 

I would avoid unless I could see raw and was good at grading Morgans and picking up problems - as most sellers know values as well and would get it into a slab if it was AU55 or higher without problems.

[nk1nk]

I have bought from this seller before and both times the coin was cleaned, I would pass!

 

Nick

[darrincraig1984]

I have only bought one from him, an 1878 8TF prooflike it is a super nice coin. He is asking AU55 money for it and I was thinking it may be MS60 or so. I might take a chance on it and ask for a refund if it has been cleaned.

[MarkFeld]

I have only bought one from him, an 1878 8TF prooflike it is a super nice coin. He is asking AU55 money for it and I was thinking it may be MS60 or so. I might take a chance on it and ask for a refund if it has been cleaned.

 

The coin does not look uncirculated to me.

[Chris1976]

My advice to you is that you should avoid buying coins off the internet until you know what you are looking at. I don't mean for that to be rude, but I feel it would be sound advice for you. Visit local shops where you can hold the coin in your had and look at it in person. Dealers on Ebay and the like are always saying "guaranted genuine" and trying to sell for top retail prices (most of the time) for a coin that is worth much less than they are selling it for. Or they will do the opposite and claim it is genuine with a price that is less than half of what it would sell for problem free in a top tier graded slab (PCGS, NGC, some ANACS), then once you receive the coin and try to submit it to one of the top grading companies you find out that it has been harshly cleaned, fake, etc and worth much less than you paid for the coin. There are not many sellers on ebay that are going to allow you to pay for a coin, send it off to a grading company (sometimes can take over a month before you get it back) and then agree to a refund. If you think that kind of thing will happen often, you are sadly mistaken and will have a very sour outlook on the coin collecting hobby.

[jgrinz]

I have only bought one from him, an 1878 8TF prooflike it is a super nice coin. He is asking AU55 money for it and I was thinking it may be MS60 or so. I might take a chance on it and ask for a refund if it has been cleaned.

 

The coin does not look uncirculated to me.

 

Close but I do not think so either ... 55 looks good to me

[KeeNoooo]

It seems as though you make your purchases spontaneously. I had to learn the hard way, not to do that.....just a thought for you

[BillJones]

The coin looks to be slightly circulated with a less than professional "restoration" job thrown in. The 1884-S dollar is famous for "almost there" coins that fall short of the coveted Mint State grade. I would pass on this coin. There is nothing special about it.

[Kamillion]

dont buy it

[James_OldeTowne]

There would be two issues here for me. First, it looks like a dipped or cleaned AU. Second, 1884-S is by far one of the most overrated coins in AU. For some reason, they are available in an endless supply in that grade range. I'd rather see you buy a certified AU-58, or AU-55 at the very very very minimum, rather than a risky raw example. It's a coin with way too much downside to bother with a raw example at this level, unless you are quite confident in your grading skills.

 

One thing's for sure, I wouldn't even consider AU money sight-unseen based on an image like that.

[BillJones]

The trouble is, James, most collectors want to put a nice AU 1884-S dollar in their sets because the decent Mint State examples are darned expensive. If I were a Morgan dollar collector, which I am not, that's what I would do.

[Walkerfan]

The surfaces look TERRIBLE (hazy and dull), although the strike and wear is consistent with a very HIGH AU coin. I would pass.......not worth the money or the RISK.

 

Wouldn't we all love to add a brilliant MS coin to our collections. These present AU types of coins are INDEED plentiful.

[Jack Robinson]

I seem to be a little behind on commenting on this original question. Though I don't have much more to say.

 

I have learned to take advice and free mentorship from those who have come before me. I take that rule seriously.

 

I agree with every one of the posted comments.

 

The bottom line is, however, is what do you want to do. You are new in this adventure, as I am, so do you accept the advise and learn by your own mistakes.

 

Your images, in my humble opinion, appear to be circulated, nonlustered and as most of the comments suggest, cleaned.

 

I purchase non certified Morgans. I feel that I have done pretty good or, been pretty lucky in my purchases. That being said, I have not submitted these raw coins to NGC. I just like holding the 104 +/- year old Morgan that is not in a sterile plastic holder.

 

Atlas, the final option is up to you. I wish you well in your life adventure.

 

One small suggestion; school yourself on the coin that you plan on purchasing. And, if possible, wait 24 hours before you commit to the purchase. A sort of cooling down time and aq time to reflect on the information that you had just learned.

 

Sorry for the long essay. I wish only to suggest some options for you before you make your final move.

 

Best wishes,

 

Jack

 

 

 

 

[Raisethis2]

I have 1 hard and fast rule. The E-Bay seller must offer returns or I'll pass 100% of the time. Every other coin I buy is in person. That said, I've had very good luck buying coins from horrible pictures because that's just not some peoples strong suit. When I do buy I'm looking for wear. This coin is certainly an AU 55 to 58. If the money is right I buy but it's going back if it's been dipped with no statement that's the case.

[Raybo55]

Surfaces look "dead" IMHO.

[darrincraig1984]

See and I was thinking AU58 mostly because of the lack of luster but the wear looks good. The other coin I purchased from this seller was much better in person than in the pictures, I am hoping this one would be the same.

[coinman_23885]

See and I was thinking AU58 mostly because of the lack of luster but the wear looks good. The other coin I purchased from this seller was much better in person than in the pictures, I am hoping this one would be the same.

 

An AU58 should have most of the original mint luster intact, but may have some minor disturbances. A significant loss of original mint luster will mean a lower AU grade or even possibly an EF grade. The coin looks AU or so to me, but I wouldn't risk that the photographs aren't hiding problems that will result in the coin being placed in a details (or genuine) holder. I agree that the coin has been dipped and possibly cleaned.

 

I understand the temptation to buy raw coins at deep discounts; however, I can almost guarantee that you will lose significantly on your investment. There are several ways to manipulate photographs to make the coins appear much better than the true grade, and there are also ways to manipulate the coins themselves so that novices cannot tell the difference. It is not uncommon for sellers to use solutions to artificially brighten a coin to make someone think that it is a mint state piece, and some sellers have even used cyanide powders which can reduce the appearance of rub and make a circulated coin look uncirculated (do not try this as the chemicals are harmful to your health). Unless you absolutely know what to look for, your chances of succeeding or 'scoring big" are infinitesimally small. The odds are clearly stacked against you. Stick with certified coins (from reputable third party grading services) until you can learn the differences yourself.

[MarkFeld]

See and I was thinking AU58 mostly because of the lack of luster but the wear looks good. The other coin I purchased from this seller was much better in person than in the pictures, I am hoping this one would be the same.

 

An AU58 should have most of the original mint luster intact, but may have some minor disturbances. A significant loss of original mint luster will mean a lower AU grade or even possibly an EF grade. The coin looks AU or so to me, but I wouldn't risk that the photographs aren't hiding problems that will result in the coin being placed in a details (or genuine) holder. I agree that the coin has been dipped and possibly cleaned.

 

I understand the temptation to buy raw coins at deep discounts; however, I can almost guarantee that you will lose significantly on your investment. There are several ways to manipulate photographs to make the coins appear much better than the true grade, and there are also ways to manipulate the coins themselves so that novices cannot tell the difference. It is not uncommon for sellers to use solutions to artificially brighten a coin to make someone think that it is a mint state piece, and some sellers have even used cyanide powders which can reduce the appearance of rub and make a circulated coin look uncirculated (do not try this as the chemicals are harmful to your health). Unless you absolutely know what to look for, your chances of succeeding or 'scoring big" are infinitesimally small. The odds are clearly stacked against you. Stick with certified coins (from reputable third party grading services) until you can learn the differences yourself.

 

Yes, images can be are are manipulated in many instances. But even skilled photographers with the best of intentions sometimes have a difficult time portraying coins with great accuracy.

 

What concerns me more than that, however, is that the the original poster wrote "...and I was thinking it may be MS60 or so". The fact that he thought that, tells me that he has a lot to learn about grading. And that unless he wants to lose money quickly, at the very least, he should not be buying uncertified coins of significant value.

 

[nk1nk]

Mark is right. If your set on buying raw coins, stick to common dates and your education will cost you much less.

 

Nick

[Coincrazed74]

The coin's surfaces just look unusual. I don't like it. It looks dipped or altered......

[jgrinz]

The coin's surfaces just look unusual. I don't like it. It looks dipped or altered......

 

I think it is cleaned - looks to be real ( I do not think the "S" to be added )