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Sure hope we don't see many more of these

Started by prudden,

40 posts in this topic

prudden

prudden

Posted
Posted

Oh.Great. Doctored Morgans in the new "Genuine" PCGS slab.Here's the first of these I've seen,so far. I think I know where it came from.There's a seller on Ebay that has been selling hundreds of these ugly things raw for at least a couple years..

74550.jpg.8f4c200c3cbb223848979d1fc3575340.jpg

74551.jpg.66f489a4a19acf1677f91b054a222aef.jpg

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Conder101

Conder101

Posted
Posted
That seems like a bit of money just to have a common at'd morgan to have authenticated

Ah, but now that it is in a PCGS slab (even a Genuine slab) it will probably bring a whole lot more on eBay because a lot of newbies won't be able to put two and two together and who will assume that it is PCGS "approved" and they will bid it up to silly money.

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bsshog40

bsshog40

Posted
Posted
That seems like a bit of money just to have a common at'd morgan to have authenticated

Ah, but now that it is in a PCGS slab (even a Genuine slab) it will probably bring a whole lot more on eBay because a lot of newbies won't be able to put two and two together and who will assume that it is PCGS "approved" and they will bid it up to silly money.

You're probably right Conder.

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michael

michael

Posted
Posted
That seems like a bit of money just to have a common at'd morgan to have authenticated

Ah, but now that it is in a PCGS slab (even a Genuine slab) it will probably bring a whole lot more on eBay because a lot of newbies won't be able to put two and two together and who will assume that it is PCGS "approved" and they will bid it up to silly money.

 

(thumbs u

 

remember folks it has nothing to do with collecting or integrity

 

its ALL ABOUT THE MONEY

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prudden

prudden

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Here's a link to a "raw" doctored Morgan by I believe is the same doctor. This bugs the hell out of me,but there isn't much anyone can do about it. Can you believe he tries to protect his coin photo with a logo?

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/1884-O-Morgan-Silver-Dollar-Strong-Strike-Toned-MS_W0QQitemZ140302595321QQihZ004QQcategoryZ39465QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

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coinman1794

coinman1794

Posted
Posted

I agree with the sentiments everyone is sharing. Yes, there is potential for this coin to be misleading to the uninformed. I dont think AT coins should be allowed in Genuine holders.

 

Yet, it is because of these arguements that PCGS refused, for nearly 23 years, to holder problem coins in the first place. It was only by popular DEMAND that they finally started doing so this year, and many people on the boards were excited about it. Now, when the first problem coin surfaces in PCGS Genuine, it's a disaster.

 

I think it is a disaster, incidentaly, but I thought I'd point out the inconsistencies I am seeing.

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physics-fan3.14

physics-fan3.14

Posted
Posted

Just to play devil's advocate - I wouldn't necessarily assume intent to deceive just because I see an AT morgan in a Genuine slab. Yes, the guy who AT'd it obviously meant to deceive, but I'm picturing some uninformed person buying it on Ebay, thinking it was amazing, and submitting it to PCGS. He's probably heartbroken to find that his prize possession is an AT'd POS, much the same as Al was heartbroken to find that his prize possession is (possibly) a fake. Don't just assume that the guy who submitted it was out to fleece the unsuspecting masses.

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Schatzy

Schatzy

Posted
Posted

I sure do wish that PCGS wouldn't grade or authenticate AT coins.

I think should put on the holder what is wrong with the coin.

 

Just my 2c

 

I wonder what the folks ATS think about this?

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MAULEMALL

MAULEMALL

Posted
Posted
I sure do wish that PCGS wouldn't grade or authenticate AT coins.

I think should put on the holder what is wrong with the coin.

 

Just my 2c

 

I wonder what the folks ATS think about this?

The herd doesn't think,,, They just move along with the rest.
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YeahToast

YeahToast

Posted
Posted

I have no problem with this getting a GENUINE. It tells me the coin is, in fact, a real Morgan Dollar.

 

As for the AT (Artificially Tarnished) versus NT (Naturally Tarnished) - tarnish is tarnish.

 

:devil:~caveat emptor!

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MAULEMALL

MAULEMALL

Posted
Posted
I wish they wouldn't grade them simply for the fact that they get full points in our registry for a POS
I believe that In my time here there have been numorous examples of damaged coins being given grades and added to the registry...

 

 

Will I search out examples,,, No. Others here who have in the past posted about it will surely chime in.

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MAULEMALL

MAULEMALL

Posted
Posted
I sure do wish that PCGS wouldn't grade or authenticate AT coins.

I think should put on the holder what is wrong with the coin.

 

Just my 2c

 

I wonder what the folks ATS think about this?

Maybe you should post a link ATS.
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Schatzy

Schatzy

Posted
Posted
I sure do wish that PCGS wouldn't grade or authenticate AT coins.

I think should put on the holder what is wrong with the coin.

 

Just my 2c

 

I wonder what the folks ATS think about this?

Maybe you should post a link ATS.

 

I never posted over there and don't plan to start!!

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MAULEMALL

MAULEMALL

Posted
Posted
I sure do wish that PCGS wouldn't grade or authenticate AT coins.

I think should put on the holder what is wrong with the coin.

 

Just my 2c

 

I wonder what the folks ATS think about this?

Maybe you should post a link ATS.

 

I never posted over there and don't plan to start!!

I was booted and won't get a shill... :popcorn:
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Revenant

Revenant

Posted
Posted
I wish they wouldn't grade them simply for the fact that they get full points in our registry for a POS

 

RareSov, you're making a mountain out of a mole-hill. I think NGC verifies all the PCGS coins that are added to the registry. That's why they show up as "Pending" when you add them (of course, if you've never added one, you wouldn't necessarily know). You get an email a couple of business days later saying that it has been ok'ed. You also have to specify a grade when you try to add it. There is no "no grade" option and the PCGS Genuine has no grade. If you found a way around that, I think NGC would subsequently reject the coin. All in all, I think it's very unlikely that PCGS Genuine will get into the NGC registry unless NGC changes their minds and allows NCS into competitive sets.

 

Just my 2 cents.

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ant

ant

Posted
Posted
I have no problem with this getting a GENUINE. It tells me the coin is, in fact, a real Morgan Dollar.

 

As for the AT (Artificially Tarnished) versus NT (Naturally Tarnished) - tarnish is tarnish.

 

:devil:~caveat emptor!

 

(thumbs u

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BillJones

BillJones

Posted
Posted

This could be the beginning of a scam with PCGS “Genuine” holders. Here you have a coin in a PCGS holder with what many newbies and some not so newbies thinking that this is a “beautiful” toned coin. The holder does not even say “artificial” or questionable toning” on it! If this experiment works on eBay and other outlets, watch for more slabs like this in the future.

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BillJones

BillJones

Posted
Posted
That seems like a bit of money just to have a common at'd morgan to have authenticated.

 

Yea, but a common date like this can sell for $300 to $500 when it's toned like this. Never underestimate the amount that a toning lemming will pay for coins with color.

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WinstonWare

WinstonWare

Posted
Posted
This could be the beginning of a scam with PCGS “Genuine” holders. Here you have a coin in a PCGS holder with what many newbies and some not so newbies thinking that this is a “beautiful” toned coin. The holder does not even say “artificial” or questionable toning” on it! If this experiment works on eBay and other outlets, watch for more slabs like this in the future.

 

Yeah I agree. They should do something like the old pci red label holders IMHO. I also think their hurting their PCGS brand name. I would have done something like what NGC did with NCS...

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Schatzy

Schatzy

Posted
Posted

I just found this out!!

 

 

The 91 in the ID number indicated " questionable color ". I don't think PCGS states in its FAQ that this means it IS AT, just that it is questionable, so they decline to grade the coin.

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Jakeblue

Jakeblue

Posted
Posted

Pretty good points are being made. But, the real issue is a known seller fraudulently representing by not FULLY disclosing relevent facts about the coin.

 

Has anyone tried to email him for ask him if a coin he is selling is artificially or naturally toned? I would study his answer carefully. If you purchase the coin, and it comes back from NGC or PCGS as not slabbable, then do the "chargeback" with paypal. The coin would qualify as "significantly not as described". Then, report the seller to ebay.

 

If a trail of documented misrepresented auctions occurs, they will boot him. It is also felony to commit mail fraud and very may well rise to that level with every single coin he or anyone else commits when using the US Mail. He is not very smart IF that is what is occuring.

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Jakeblue

Jakeblue

Posted
Posted

A direct answer to a direct question. Such as, "How did the coin get it's color?" or "Did you tone or color the coin by any means?" Sure it is genuine, but the seller should not be afraid to answer a direct question.

 

If he does not answer the question or will only answer a part of the question, ebay should still be alerted to that fact. By not properly responding, only assures that the seller is hiding "something" that he does not wish to reveal.

 

Well, I will try it and see what happens.

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