GBrad

Ok..... put this one to rest.....  I went ahead and used my Listerine cleaning technique (and NO, I would never clean a truly valuable coin with anything at all!!!) and can now see that there is definitely PMD that somehow pushed the 1 out of place in the date on this cent. There’s no way at all I could have seen this “hit” before I took off the grime. My apologies to all. Sincerely. 

15 minutes ago, bsshog40 said:

Well I could be wrong, but it looks like someone was playing with some casting. I'm thinking it's not real. Or it's just too damaged to guess. 

Hello bsshog and thank you for your comment. I don’t believe at all that this is not a real cent. I know it is very dirty but it weighs in correctly and has all the authentic markings of a Lincoln. As dirty as it is I am tempted to try to clean it up so we can see more details (no haters please and comments regarding if, how, or if I should clean it would be greatly appreciated 😁). 
The 1 is completely out of sorts and I’m just not sure how this would occur. 
It is unfortunate that this cent is in poor condition and I wish it was in better shape. 

Came across this one today. This is a bronze as it came in at 3.12 grams. Obviously it has a lot of environmental issues but the date on this cent does not look to me to have anything remotely close to resembling PMD (meaning the date only regarding no PMD as I know there is a lot of PMD on the rest of this cent). Not quite sure how this would have occurred by the “bending” of the 1 in the date. Thank you for any comments. 

On 10/10/2020 at 10:23 PM, Just Bob said:

Is there any damage or marking on the rim 180 degrees opposite this bent spot?

Hi Bob. I replied to your question on Saturday but for some reason it did not go through..... my WiFi service at home is down and our cell service is horrible.... maybe that was the problem. 
There is a small indent on the opposite side of the edge of the coin but it does not have any “reeding” look to it. Under high magnification it does appear to have some very small striations though. Maybe PMD... not sure. It is also not exactly 180 degrees. I can take a pic of it if you’d like. Thanks. 

On 10/8/2020 at 4:32 PM, Coinbuf said:

Looks like PMD from contact with a gear or something along that line.

Hello Coinbuf. Thank you for your comment. The bent rim was suspect to me from the beginning but the good lines on it kind of threw me off. Chalk this one up to PMD. Thanks!

On 10/8/2020 at 3:35 PM, Greenstang said:

I'm going to go with your first thought Greg and say it is damage from a hit. You can see from your side shots (excellent pictures by the way) where the rim has been raised from the metal being pushed in. This would not happen during the striking of the coin.

Thank you Greenstang for your post and for your picture compliment. I only use my iPhone and a 10x loupe to take my pics. It has proven pretty effective and sometimes results in good pics. 
I was leaning towards PMD but thought I’d post it just in case. I had my suspicions that the bent rim would not be a result of the minting process but the “reeds” just caught my attention. Thank you!

Found this today. I know it’s probably trivial but just looking for some feedback on what may have caused this for my future knowledge. I did look up other examples of this “possible” Mint damage, even read an NGC board post, but it seems this usually happens on severely off center strikes and then the “reeded” edge, which seems to show on the entire edge, is caused by the wrapping machine due to the coin being a bit larger in diameter than a normal Cent. Not sure...
At first I thought this coin took a PMD hit due to the slightly flattened edge on the obverse. Upon further inspection, I saw that it appears to have a small reeded spot as you can see in the pics. Thank you for your input. 
-Greg

19 minutes ago, ronnie stein said:

I agree with Coinbuf, an oddity to hang on to, and labeled explaining exactly. Just curious Greg, was that mint mouthwash with or without fluoride? I'd have cleaned him up and made him smell good as well. Nice find.

2 hours ago, Coinbuf said:

Interesting coin and discussion, I do not have an further info that what Greenstang was able to find.  It seems to be an oddity and debunked variety, Might be worth putting into a 2X2 and holding on to in case this gets revisited and changed in the future. 

Good suggestion Coinbuf. Who knows, maybe this oddity will resurface in the near future. Hopefully sooner than later. I will continue to research this Cent to see if there’s anything else I can come up with. If so, I will gladly post it. To date, this is the best oddity of a Lincoln I believe I have found and obviously I want to pursue it to its fullest extent. Thanks!

Mr. Ronnie..... what can I say......😂. Definitely fluoride....as breath that old can be somewhat offense and the teeth... well... that’s a different story.....  hahaha. Thanks for both of you guys posting. Definitely will hang onto this Linc. Take care. 
-Greg 
 

3 hours ago, Greenstang said:

After stating it is an 005 and seeing that it is on a 1989 Lincoln, I have been doing a little research to prove myself wrong.

From what I can understand, about 10 years or so ago it was thought that this was a variety (005 on 1989 cent) and it may have even been on Variety Vista. After much discussion, Dr. James Wiles, a Coneca attributor claimed that this was caused by die abrasion that caused the 006 to look like an 005 and it is no longer listed.. If you were to send it in for attribution, it will just come back as being caused by die abrasion.

I picked this info up from reading bits and pieces of other discussions about this so it is not something new but has been hashed about for quit a while.

Hoping that someone else can add something to this posting as I had never heard of this before and am interested in what other members take on this is..

Hi Greenstang and thank you for your extra research into my coin, much appreciated. I too have since found some of the info you are relating to, maybe even the same information. I completely understand die abrasion and polished dies and this process can no doubt cause a host of frustrating issues.  But, from my knowledge regarding die abrasion and polished dies, there should be at least some type of visible evidence:  lines, striations, grooves, etc.... (whatever you would like to term them) showing where the die was abraded or polished.
I myself have been fooled by over polished and deteriorated dies in the past, namely the Jefferson I posted not too long ago. I accepted the fact and moved on. 
However, and by no means would I ever dispute world renowned experts, I simply cannot see any evidence of die abrasion on this Lincoln especially in the area of the designer’s initials. The fields on this coin are very good for its age, very little PMD if any, and the devices are still very robust, especially the bottom of the reverse. 
The top of the reverse does show some signs of possible DD and/or polishing but the FG area is still very questionable and is original in my opinion. 
As zoomed in as the pic is that I posted, showing the perfect outlines of the FG, the location of the letters and their size and orientation, and then the added fact that under this type of high magnification there is not ANY minuet visible or discernible extended leg on the G, or even a remote resemblance of an 006 serif on the G.........  Well..... it just makes makes me wonder.......

I will add that you, and so many other informative members on this forum, have really helped me out. I sincerely appreciate your replies Greenstang! I too wouldn’t mind if another member or members... would comment on this topic. I may be way off base here with my “newbie” mind (man I hate that label.... lol) but I just can’t see how die abrasion would cause this on this particular coin. AND.... WITH ALL DUE RESPECT (as I know this is an open forum worldwide) I would never dispute Dr. Wiles professional expertise regarding his opinion on variety coins. Enough said......  Thank you again!

-Greg
 

Hi to all once again. I have been researching this coin and the extremely remote chance of this thing actually being a variety. I came across a website that spoke about some other determining factors (somewhat confusing to me to be honest) associated with verifying if this coin is in fact an 89 with a reverse of an 88. Unfortunately, that thread ended without showing a decision as to its validity. Would anyone on the forum like to expand on some other key elements that I should look for to determine if this is legitimate? Or would it just be best to send it in for attribution and if so, who would you recommend? Thank you. 
-Greg

5 minutes ago, Modwriter said:

Do NOT ever clean your coins.

I know and totally agree....... that’s why I told everyone else not to do it......😁. But.... there are some occasions when you have a green crusted Lincoln that you have no idea what lies behind the crud. That’s the ONLY time I will attempt to remove the grime on a coin!!!  And ONLY on a Lincoln to see what lies beneath. 

2 hours ago, Coinbuf said:

I cannot see any evidence of the G having taken a hit in this photo.  At this close I would expect to see metal "piled up" somewhere after being moved from the hit and I'm not seeing that.

Not sure on the missing metal at the tip of the G as you stated, very good observation might I add. Maybe a partially filled die on that portion??
You may be able to see in this pic where the top of the G would have extended. 
I unfortunately had no choice but to clean this coin (I know this is NOT an acceptable practice!!) in order to get a better recognition/view of the details of this Lincoln. 

Not to get off the subject here but......  I think I stated earlier in one of my previous posts that I use green Listerine “cool mint” mouth wash with an extremely soft towel to take away the crud and green corrosion from my Lincoln Cents. It has worked extremely well for me and so far I have seen that it causes no damage to the luster or the coin itself. Just FYI for those Lincoln collectors that just can’t see through the grimy green crud that plagues so many coppers as well as zincs....,

BUT PLEASE..... DO NOT TAKE MY CLEANING ADVICE, especially for newcomers, as coin cleaning is not recommended!!!!!  By all means, if you would like, try it out on a less than spectacular coin (bad choice of words because all U.S. coins are spectacular!) and make your own determination. I take no responsibility for any damage to your coins from my above stated comments ....... just saying.....

Thank you Coinbuf for your comment and observation, very much appreciated.  
-Greg

Now that three of my favorite professionals have commented...  (and there are many more of you guys and gals that I truly appreciate for all of your help!!!) here is my dilemma....... I found these FG designer’s initials on the reverse of a 1989 Lincoln Cent, not a 1988. This was as close up of a pic that I could take. I ordered a new scope yesterday just for this cent (which I took the original pic with)  and will no doubt use it in the future. I am perplexed at how these initials got onto the reverse of a 1989. Please now see the photos of the entire coin. If I am missing something here by ALL means please let me know. I am very familiar with the 88 with a reverse of the 89 FG but after researching this oddity I have come up with noting except “it does not exist.....”.
By no means am I trying to create “something that does not exist” but this one really caught my attention. As always, thank you all for your input.  
-Greg

Going to just post this one pic for now. I’d like to see opinions as to whether this looks to be an 005 or 006. I’m sure some of the pros on this forum already know my reason for just supplying this one photo for the time being. I think it looks an awful lot like a 005........  please look closely as you can maybe see where the top of the G looks to be smashed from maybe some PMD thus not allowing a “straight” line to be drawn from the leg and upwards. I don’t see any resemblance of a defined lower extended leg on the G nor any serif. It’s a long shot but who knows.....  Thanks. 

15 minutes ago, Coinbuf said:

Copper has some interesting color reactions to many common household cleaners, including dish soap and laundry detergent, much of the color change depends on what is on the surface of the coin.

Thank you Coinbuf for that comment. I have never really seen a Lincoln exhibit this much of a “rainbow” effect of colors. But, after the previous replies, and some more research on my part, I am I am understanding more so how this can occur. Thanks!

1 hour ago, DWLange said:

It may have gone through the washing machine. I've seen similar results when I forgot to empty my pockets.

Thanks DWLange. Didn’t think about that. 👍

3 hours ago, Greenstang said:

I'm sure the coin looks better in person as toning is hard to photograph. I know when I have tried, they turn out more black that toned. Toning and the different colours of toning are  caused by whatever environmental conditions they were exposed too. Some exposures can create rainbow colours while others can make the coin look dirty.

You’re right about hard to photograph the toning. It is very colorful and the areas that look black or dirty are more of a blue tint.  Just a neat colored coin no doubt and worth.....well.... 1 cent....  Thanks Greenstang. 

I’ve looked at a lot of Lincoln’s over the years but this one is by far the most colorful I’ve ever seen. I have seen toning on numerous coins but this one really stood out. It just came out of a bank roll I got today. The pics don’t do it justice. The blue toning on this cent does not show up in the photos as good as looking at it in person. I don’t think this is a “washed” coin being that it is a 2006D and not a proof. Just curious how this happens. Thanks. 

Thank you guys for your replies. I had just never seen anything quite like this before with so much deformity on the majority of the coin. Better luck next time.........

I know this is not a “gem” of a coin as this thing has seen more than it’s fair share of denim pant pockets but I thought I may have come across something unique......  I’ve just never seen any coin with oddities on the obverse and reverse such as this. 

1 minute ago, Just Bob said:

This looks like an extreme case of die erosion, with what may be some strike doubling thrown in for good measure.

DANG!!!!  Thank you for responding. As you know I am a Lincoln searcher Bob. I came across this Jefferson today in a few bank rolls of nickels I had. The entire coin shows weird stuff but I saw what I believed to be doubling on the date and especially on the LLO of Monticello..... particularly the O.  

Can an informative expert on Jefferson’s please respond to this post....,,, I’m not begging but (ok... yes...I’m begging.. lol) because I am completely confused at what this coin is exhibiting other than a tremendous amount of doubling and who knows what else...... Thanks!

Hello all and hello kingsley, welcome to the forum. I would like to add something to this thread. I am an avid Lincoln collector and have been for years but really just got into serious collecting and examining coins late last year. There is a lot of great and excellent advice from the professionals on this forum. I have really gotten to know my coins from the overwhelming help from the pros here, thank you all!! 

With that said, I really started trying to learn the grading process of the coins I have found. I have used numerous website pictures and other grading services on the web to compare my finds with AU and MS grades posted online. Even though I have been an interested collector for awhile, I FINALLY attended my first coin and expo show this past weekend and man was it an eye opener!!!!!  Wow!!

What I truly believed to be an MS 66 or possibly a 67 coin I had found.... I quickly realized it was maybe an AU 59 or MS 60 at best!!! Huge learning curve to say the least.   There is nothing better than holding a CERTIFIED slabbed coin by either NGC or PCGS and truly seeing what a high graded coin looks like!! I was truly blown away and have an entirely new perspective and respect for what high grade coins actually look like with “coin in hand” as opposed to looking at pictures on the internet. 
 

By all means I would purchase the literature previously mentioned in this thread. But, in order to get a true visual perspective of what Mint State Graded Coins look like, I would strongly suggest you attend a reputable coin show on your area. Hope this helps. 

A few more pics