• When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.

Sandon

Member: Seasoned Veteran
  • Posts

    3,672
  • Joined

  • Days Won

    139

Everything posted by Sandon

  1. The problem is that purchasers could try to pass them off as genuine coins or people who receive them as gifts or by inheritance could believe them to be genuine coins. We frequently see people post them here asking what they are worth. Not only are they not marked "COPY" in compliance with the Hobby Protection Act, those that are imitations of legal tender U.S. coins would presumably be in violation of U.S. counterfeiting laws even if they were so marked.
  2. 1935 Walking Liberty half dollar, NGC graded MS 64: Photos courtesy of Stacks Bowers Galleries
  3. I don't know what your coin looks like, but most of the shipwreck certified coins I have seen have rough or "porous" surfaces and an unnatural whiteness from the "conservation" process used to remove surface adhesions and grime. (If you can't photograph the coin but can give us the serial number on the NGC holder, we should be able to see the NGC photos on NGC certificate verification.) I happen to own an unimpaired 1853 Arrows & Rays half dollar graded XF 45 (just short of AU) by PCGS, which cost me a few years ago around one third of what you paid for this shipwreck artifact. This is what they look like with original surfaces:
  4. Please post better photos (cropped and upright), especially of the obverse. The area beneath the date appears to have been scraped with a tool, and it is unclear whether the coin actually has a "D" mint mark. Additionally, please note that the Coin Marketplace forum is for posting offers to buy or sell coins, not for questions about them. This topic should have been posted in the "Newbie Coin Collecting Questions" forum.
  5. I don't know what you mean by "no date", as this Lincoln cent is obviously and normally dated 1983. What are you talking about? I can see no signs of doubling, die doubling or otherwise, from your photos. It clearly isn't the doubled die reverse listed and depicted in the Redbook. The coin was struck from a misaligned obverse die, resulting in the right side of the rim appearing to be wider than usual and the left side nearly missing. Misaligned die strikes are common and regarded by knowledgeable collectors as examples of poor quality control rather than as mint errors. They are generally worth little or no premium. The weak letters on the reverse are indicative of a weak strike, which is very common on Lincoln cents with the Memorial reverse, particularly from this era. Such weak strikes make a coin less rather than more desirable to collectors. In short, this appears to be a lightly circulated genuine 1983 Lincoln cent worth only its face value of one cent to anyone with the requisite knowledge to collect coins.
  6. I largely agree with what @powermad5000 wrote. This 1817 Matron Head large cent might grade as high as Very Fine in terms of details but was pitted and corroded and was then improperly and harshly "cleaned", likely with metal polish. It appears to be an example of the N-13 die variety, a common (R1) variety and certainly not worth the cost of third-party grading. It is still an interesting conversation piece to show non-collectors who don't know that U.S. cents were once the size of a half dollar or have never seen a coin that is so old. I hope that the raffle was for a good cause.
  7. Your full obverse photo proves that your coin is not an 1888/7. The obverse die that struck your coin had the "1" in the date positioned very close to the tip of the bust and higher than the other numerals. The date on the 1888/7 has the "1" farther from the bust and more even with the other numerals, as shown in the VarietyPlus photo of the full date, shown below. Dates were punched separately into dies for U.S. coins until about 1908, making the date position a useful tool for attributing some varieties. Although I'm sorry to disappoint you, hopefully you have learned something from this exercise.
  8. Please post clear, cropped photos of the entire obverse and reverse of this coin. This is our practice on this forum and may be of importance in this case, as NGC VarietyPlus states that "[m]any examples . . . have a small rim break over letter E of UNITED." Based upon the photos that you have posted, I think that it is quite unlikely that this coin would be attributed as an example of the rare 1888/7 FS-101 die variety. The lump at the lower left of the second "8" is next to an indentation that appears to be a nick. The lump is likely displaced metal from the hit that caused the nick rather than the remnant of the bottom of a "7". I see no indication of the remnant of the upper left tip of a "7" at the upper left of the 8, which is also a required diagnostic of this variety. VarietyPlus states that "[t]he underlying 7 is shallow, and this variety will not be attributed unless it is clearly visible, regardless of any other diagnostic features." Compare the VarietyPlus photo below and see the additional photos and commentary for this variety at Indian Cents (1859-1909) | VarietyPlus® | NGC (ngccoin.com).
  9. This 1840 Liberty Seated dollar appears to be genuine and to have about Very Fine details but would likely come back "details" graded due to several significant reverse scrapes. I can't be sure from the photos that it wouldn't be considered to have been "cleaned" as well. It's questionable whether it would be worthy of third-party grading, but if you decide to do so you shouldn't submit it yourself unless you have several other coins to submit at the "Standard" ($40) tier. NGC charges a $10 processing fee per order regardless of size and a $28 return shipping fee for up to ten coins, so submitting this as a single coin order would cost you $78 plus your expense to ship it to NGC. If you don't have anything else to submit, you should consider submitting it through an NGC authorized dealer who might be able to submit it less expensively. The main reason to submit it would be to authenticate it rather than grade it.
  10. 1853 Arrows & Rays half dollar, PCGS graded XF 45:
  11. The NGC webpage to which I provided a link in your post on the NGC Registry forum provides a detailed explanation of the "Shipwreck Effect" grading system that NGC uses to evaluate coins recovered from shipwrecks that exhibit damage from exposure to seawater, shifting sands, and/or other environmental elements. Here it is again: Shipwreck Coin Effect Designation Guide | NGC (ngccoin.com). As stated on that page, a shipwreck coin designated "A" is defined as "a coin exhibiting minimal surface disturbance from saltwater exposure and exhibiting superior eye appeal for a shipwreck artifact." The "AU" means that the coin has the details of an About Uncirculated coin. If your coin had been submitted to NGC without being provenanced to a known shipwreck, it would have been graded "AU details" and given a qualifier such as "Environmental Damage" or "Corrosion". Such pieces are regarded by collectors as "problem coins" and trade at a discount to the prices indicated in price guides for unimpaired pieces in the same adjectival grades. An unimpaired 1853 Arrows & Rays Liberty Seated half dollar lists $635 (retail) in AU 50 grade in the NGC Price Guide. The amount of discount to this price that a specific buyer would be willing to pay varies with the severity of the impairment and the preferences of that buyer. Discounts of 30-50% are not unusual for even moderately impaired coins. A coin provenanced to a well-known shipwreck such as the S.S. Republic may command a premium in the marketplace from collectors of shipwreck artifacts, many of whom know little or nothing about coins. These impaired silver coins have been hyped by mass marketers who sold them for substantially more than the coins would have been worth without the shipwreck provenance. I do not know whether they would realize such prices in the aftermarket. To my knowledge, there are no price guides specifically for impaired coins salvaged from shipwrecks, whether encapsulated by NGC under its "Shipwreck Effect" designations or otherwise. You may find records of specific sales in the archives of major numismatic auction houses such as (in alphabetical order) Goldberg (goldbergcoins.com), Great Collections (greatcollections.com), Heritage (ha.com), and Stacks Bowers (stacksbowers.com). It might be helpful if you could post clear, cropped photos of each side of your coin.
  12. Welcome to the NGC chat board. As this forum is for questions regarding the NGC Registry, you should have posted this question under the "Newbie Coin Collecting Questions" forum or the "U.S., World, and Ancient Coins" forum, preferably with a clear photo of the item in question. I assume that you are referring to an environmentally damaged coin from a shipwreck that NGC has encapsulated with the designation "Shipwreck Effect". For NGC's explanation, see the following NGC website page: Shipwreck Coin Effect Designation Guide | NGC (ngccoin.com)
  13. @hrodrigues--Welcome to the NGC chat board. You should post your questions as new topics, not on someone else's old topic. The flips should be 2.5 inch, not 2 inch as some have shown here. Grading services found that they can damage coins removing them from tighter 2-inch flips. The thin plastic film on cardboard 2x2s can tear and cause the coin to fall out in transit, and even if tape is used to seal the holder, the coin could fall out while the tape is being removed. (Tape removal may also be inconvenient for grading service personnel. I strongly recommend that grading service submission instructions be followed to the letter, as if you don't and your coins or damaged, the grading service may deny your claim because you didn't follow their instructions. In addition to the sites referred to here, you might try amosadvantage.com (Coin World affiliate) and whitman.com, which also offer coin supplies.
  14. Photos .deleted. @Idhair--as the rules were stated on page 1 and we're now on page 313, you may wish to periodically repeat them.
  15. I attended a family gathering in the spring of 1971, where an aunt's father gave each of the children, including me, one of the new Eisenhower dollars. I may have already had a few wheat cents taken from change, but this 1971 Eisenhower dollar is the coin that started my collection. I still have it. Here it is.
  16. @Henri Charriere--"Good to Very Good details" is my grade, not PCGS's, for the 1794 Head of '93 cent. I'm one of those fanatics who actually learned how to grade coins himself. Obviously, the impairments substantially reduce its value from this grade level if unimpaired. I'm a bit more conservative than the Stacks Bowers cataloguer, who referred to it as "VG Details" after noting that it had "[r]ough and porous deep red-brown surfaces with a deep old pit near the back of the Liberty cap."
  17. If you are serious about this--or even just making a decent living as a professional numismatist--your best bet would probably be to seek employment with a major or at least established numismatic dealership or auction house, where you can learn both about coins and the business of buying and selling them. Have you researched what Lincoln cents with this relatively minor degree of rotation sell for in the numismatic marketplace, or for that matter examples with 90 degree right angle or 180 degree "medal turn" rotations? It is my impression that few collectors are interested in or willing to pay much for any coins with rotated dies. They are usually "cherrypicked" at regular prices, with the seller being aware of the rotation, and collected only as novelties. I doubt that you could have sold this coin for a price sufficient to recover your grading, attribution and related fees and shipping costs, even if NGC had attributed the rotation. As I and others have frequently explained on this forum, it is extremely rare for anyone to find significant mint errors, die varieties or other valuable coins in circulation or in rolls or accumulations of common coins. You would likely have a better chance of making "7 figures" playing the lotteries!
  18. I recently had three of my four Liberty head double eagles, one of each type, graded by NGC for inclusion in my type registry sets. I purchased these coins between 1987 and 1995 for mid-three figure prices, as this was before the price of gold made these relatively common coins too expensive to collect. Type One--1863-S, NGC graded AU 53. Bowers & Merena had graded it XF 45 in 1995: Type 2--1876, NGC graded AU 58 despite extensive bagmarks: Type 3--1899, NGC graded AU 55, with cleaner surfaces than the preceding two coins: Note the design differences among the three types that I discussed in my January 24th post on this topic. My only other Liberty head double eagle is an 1897-S that would likely grade higher than the 1899 but is in a lucite framed gold type set that I don't want to break up.
  19. Here's a much nicer early large cent, a 1795 S-77 PCGS graded XF 45 despite some light surface damage. The weakness in some of the reverse letters is typical of this die variety. Photos courtesy of Stacks Bowers Galleries.
  20. 1794 "Head of 93" large cent, in PCGS "Genuine" holder (ungraded). Good to Very Good details with rough surfaces and heavy pitting, but the date and lettering are legible, and it is definitely the "Head of 1793". This is probably the ugliest coin in my collection, but it is a scarce subtype. It was catalogued as an S-18b when I purchased it in 2012, but I don't know how they determined the "b", as you can't really see the edge in the older style PCGS holder. Photos courtesy of Stacks Bowers Galleries.
  21. This is the remedy stated for the NGC Guarantee. See NGC Guarantee | Coin Certification Guarantee | NGC (ngccoin.com): An owner of an NGC-certified Coin (“Owner”) who believes the Coin is overgraded or not genuine shall submit it for evaluation under NGC’s free “Appearance Review” service. It is not necessary to be an NGC member to submit a Coin for Appearance Review. To submit a Coin for Appearance Review, Owner shall furnish Guarantor with all supporting documents, including receipts, that Owner’s claim relies on. If Guarantor determines, in its sole reasonable opinion, that Owner is entitled to a remedy under this Guarantee, Guarantor will offer a remedy as set forth below. Guarantor is committed in all cases to proposing a fair and reasonable remedy. If Owner does not accept such remedy, the Coin will be removed from the NGC holder and returned to Owner along with a payment of the grading fees originally paid to grade the Coin and any reasonable shipping expenses incurred in returning the Coin for correction. In no event will (i) a Coin that has been determined to be not genuine be returned in an NGC holder; (ii) a Coin that has been determined to be overgraded or incorrectly described be returned encapsulated with an incorrect NGC label; or (iii) an “Authentic Hand-Signed” label be returned with an autograph that has been found to be not genuine. Remedies for Coins that are Not Genuine or are Overgraded. If Guarantor determines, in its sole reasonable opinion, that (a) the Coin (other than an NGC Ancients-graded Coin) is not genuine or (b) that the correct grade for the Coin is lower than the one originally assigned, Guarantor will offer one of the three remedies described below. The choice of remedy will be made by Guarantor in its sole discretion, and the remedies are subject to the further limitations set forth below. Current Fair Market Value is determined solely by Guarantor as described in each of the listed remedies and the “Fair Market Value” paragraph that follows. 1. Guarantor shall (a) return the Coin to Owner encapsulated with a label indicating the newly established correct (lower) grade and (b) pay to Owner the difference between the current Fair Market Value of an accurately graded Coin at the original incorrect (higher) grade and the current Fair Market Value of the Coin at the newly established correct (lower) grade. 2. Alternatively, Guarantor may purchase the Coin from Owner. Guarantor will pay the lesser of (i) the Declared Value of the Coin as stated by Owner on the submission form for Appearance Review; (ii) the Fair Market Value of an accurately graded, genuine Coin at the original incorrect grade; or (iii) the amount actually paid for the Coin by Owner in an actual arm's length transaction, plus any postage, shipping or other incidental expenses incurred by Owner in submitting the Coin for Appearance Review service. If Owner was also the original submitter of the Coin for certification, then the compensation, if any, will not exceed the Declared Value of the Coin either when originally submitted for certification or when submitted for Appearance Review. 3. Alternatively, Guarantor may retain the not genuine or overgraded Coin and provide to Owner in its place an equivalent Coin that is genuine and has the same grade as originally assigned to the Coin. It would not be worth pursuing this remedy in this case. Your 2009 Silver Eagle was arguably (not objectively) overgraded at MS 69 but clearly grades a bare minimum of MS 67 ("only a few imperfections") and in my opinion would be solid at MS 68 as having "miniscule imperfections". (The only defect I can see on your photos is the mark on Liberty's hip. I see no scratch or other defect at the other area you circled at the bottom of Liberty's skirt.) A 2009 Silver Eagle lists $38.50 in MS 67, $42 in MS 68, and $50 in MS 69 on the NGC Price Guide. It lists $35.50 even in MS 60. Assuming that NGC agreed with you "in its sole reasonable opinion", you would receive compensation with a net value of no more than $50 under whichever of the three listed remedies NGC were to choose. It just isn't worth spending one's time over an arguable difference in no more than $15 in retail market value. I recommend that if you don't like the coin you sell it, allowing the buyer to inspect the coin to his or her satisfaction and deciding whether or not to pay your asking price. If you bought the coin some years ago, you won't lose much and may even make a small profit.
  22. Yes, this is an S-292. The easiest diagnostic is that there is a berry between the S and T of STATES. On the S-293 the berry is beneath the upright of the first T of STATES. From what I can see, it should "straight grade" AG 3 or perhaps G 4. I would avoid storing coins of any value in cardboard 2x2 holders even if the staples are crimped or flattened. The thin layer of plastic that covers the coin can easily be torn and the coin exposed to the environment. Even flat staples can scratch or press into the coin through the thin plastic layer. Years ago, I ruined a VF Barber quarter that received an indentation on Liberty's face from the staple on an adjacent holder that held a smaller coin. Hard plastic holders (lucite holders with screws, square snap together holders, or capsules), modern albums in which the coins fit snugly and beneath the top slide to avoid slide marks, and even mylar flips are better choices to store uncertified coins.
  23. It's hard to tell from these photos, but the "tooling" is likely the scrape through Liberty's head, which appears to have been done with a file or other such tool. I also see unusual lumps on Liberty's lap, but these could be displacements resulting from the chop marks on the reverse. The grading services tend to be loose in their descriptions of impairments. The "smoothing" referred to in the NGC "tooling" definition sometimes leads to a grading holder description of "smoothed" or "repaired".
  24. Welcome to the NGC chat board. Please note that the Coin Marketplace forum is for solicitations to sell or buy specific coins. Your inquiry would likely receive better attention if posted on the "Newbie Coin Collecting Questions" forum or the "U.S., World, and Ancient Coins" forum. Additionally, it would be helpful if you could make it clear whether there are any specific types of "shipwreck coins" you are thinking of collecting, such as coins salvaged from seventeenth century Spanish galleons or U.S. coins from mid-nineteenth century wrecks such as the S.S. Central America. It also depends upon your budget. In my own opinion, non-gold coins salvaged from undersea wrecks are generally undesirable and overpriced. They are almost always corroded and/or otherwise damaged from the effects of exposure to seawater, shifting sands, and surrounding decaying substances and sea life. Most would be of little value but for their provenance, which is of little interest to collectors like me, who prefer coins in the best condition they can afford. The prices many of them command are solely due to hype by mass marketers who sell them to people who know little about coins or the low value of equivalent impaired or worn pieces that don't come from shipwrecks. The only ones worthwhile to me would be pieces that are very rare by date and mint or variety and some exceptional pieces such as the dimes from the safe on the S.S. Central America that escaped the ravages of the ocean floor, and I wouldn't pay a premium for their provenance either. If you're still adamant about buying them, buy them from reputable coin dealers in certified holders from reputable grading services such as NGC, PCGS, or ANACS with the provenance (name of the ship) stated on the holder. Beware of fake pieces in fake grading service holders or with fake documentation. Such pieces are now mass produced in Asia. Avoid purchasing from random sellers on sites such as ebay. Gold coins from shallow water shipwrecks tend to have rough, grainy surfaces due to the action of shifting sands and aren't really desirable either. However, many of those from deeper water wrecks or those where the coins remained tightly packed together such as the S.S. Central America, S.S. Brother Jonathan or S.S. Republic are numerically graded in lightly circulated all the way up to gem uncirculated but usually cost thousands to tens of thousands of dollars due to their gold content--a twenty-dollar gold piece presently contains about $1,900 just in gold--and the demand for them from serious collectors, especially in higher grades. To find a likely reputable dealer, check the NGC dealer directory under the "Resources" tab on the NGC home page, www.ngccoin.com ("Locate Dealers") or similar directories of the Professional Numismatists Guild (pngdealers.org) or the American Numismatic Association (money.org). More valuable shipwreck pieces also appear at sales by major numismatic auction houses such as (in alphabetical order) Goldberg (goldbergcoins.com), Great Collections (greatcollections.com), Heritage (ha.com), and Stacks Bowers (stacksbowers.com).
  25. 1942-S wartime Jefferson five cent piece, PCGS graded MS 65: