Adams edge lettering

[RGT]

This is not a topic that I ever expected to be writing about, but sometimes you just find yourself in a place that you didn't expect. I don't own a single Adams coin and I don't collect moderns except for picking up a couple of proof set from the mint.

 

This past Monday was the monthly meeting of the local coin club. We have one B&M dealer in town and I rarely get over to his side of town, but since the meeting is in that direction I often stop by before the meeting. This time I was the only one in the shop and he was sorting through some coins that he had just gotten back from NGC. Among those coins were about half a dozen Adams dollars with doubled edge lettering.

 

The first thing he commented on was the increasing inconsistency of NGC grading. He showed me the stack of Adams coins, each and every one graded MS65. These coins had numerous contact marks and I commented that they looked more like MS63 to me (though I have never attempted to grade one before). If I saw similar marks on, say a seated quarter, I would expect a grade more like MS61-MS62. Then he showed me a beautiful Washington quarter with nice surfaces that I would call at least MS65 and maybe MS66 (but again, I know little about grading Washington quarters). This coin was in a new MS64 holder.

 

Then we started talking about the doubled edge lettering itself. (See, I did get around to it.) One of the coins had the second application of lettering applied just slightly off from the first so that it looked similar to a 1955 doubled die Lincoln. Another one was off just enough to center a letter between two other letters making the motto read "IINN GGOODD WWEE TTRRUUSSTT" and the date was 22000077. That almost made me want to buy one.

 

Now for the real interesting part. He pointed out to me that there were two different "dies" used to punch the edge lettering in. One of the dies has letters that go into the edge with a "V" shape where the sides of the letters meet at the bottom. The other die had wider letters that were flat on the bottom, like a flat bottom boat. The wider flat bottom die seemed to have slightly taller letters also. He had one coin that had been edged from both of these dies making it easy to compare the two.

 

He said that he had sent examples off to Ken Potter for review and it should show up in Coin World soon. If you have any of these coins you might want to check them. There is likely no rarity involved, but I did find it interesting.

[cpm9ball]

P or D?

 

Chris

[RGT]

These things have mint marks?

 

Sorry Chris, it never occured to me to even look. If I were to guess, based on where I live (and assuming he got them from rolls, which may be way off base) they would be P.

[cpm9ball]

These things have mint marks?

 

Sorry Chris, it never occured to me to even look. If I were to guess, based on where I live (and assuming he got them from rolls, which may be way off base) they would be P.

 

Correction....................it was probably a PPPPPPPPP

 

Chris

[ibyandsellsmith]

Very cool, Thanks for the info. When I talked to my local Dealer he informed me that he would not own such a coin. Who knows, if the money is right I would bet he'd grab a coin or two.

[bsshog40]

I agree!!! (thumbs u

[just carl]

A buffing wheel would correct that. Sorry, I just don't like those baby dollars.

[Conder101]

I've seen the so called different types of edge dies. The difference can be explained by one edge die being new (chisel point), and the other being worn (letters have broader flat bottoms) I have also seen intermediate states where most of the letters are broad but some letters still showing dulled rounded chisel points.

[BillJones]

A couple of comments.

 

First, it's been my observation that the grading on modern coins at the MS and PR-65 - 66 level is very lose. I've seen MS-65 graded modern coins that obvious marks that would have never made it on a 19th century MS-65 graded coin. Such pieces would have the type of thing where dealers and advanced collectors just shake their collective heads and say, "How did that happen?" But for modern coins it seems to be the norm. If you really want a nice modern coin, you are looking at really high grades, like 67 or better.

 

In the case of Proof coins, I’ve seen some very ugly modern Proof coins in PR-67 holders. It makes you wonder how bad a PR-65 would be. Certainly it would have to be well below the quality of a “classic” Proof coin in PR-65 if the PR-67 is any indicator.

 

Second, I've seen a lot of bulk graded modern coins upon which the grading has looked more like the application of a bell shaped curve and a critical examination of the coins. I remember years ago when the Sackie dollar was introduced a dealer I knew well submitted several hundred business strike coins for grading. The coins in the holders hardly seemed to mate the grades on the slips. There were MS-67 graded coins that hard big marks and spots while MS-64 graded pieces had sins that were far less obvious. This might sound cynical, but I sort of came to the conclusion that everyone concerned (dealer and grader) were more interested in getting the coins IN a holder than assigning an appropriate grade for the coin.