Opinions on sending this proof trade dollar to NCS

[stev32k]

This TD is in a PCGS PR64 holder, but the toning, or streaks, or haze, or whatever is distracting to me. It has a fairly brilliant blue tone that is mostly covered by the brownish looking streaks on both sides. It's not a dull coin the surfaces are mirror like, but they don't show up in the photographs. I can't detect any hairlines or hits, but there does appear to be a carbon spot on each side.

 

Anyone have an opinion on whether or not it would be worthwhile sending this off to NCS in an attempt to get rid of the streaks and improve the overall appearance? I would hate to have it come back PR63 or worse, but I wouldn't complain if it upgraded.

 

[MunkyMan95]

Wo knows? There could be DEEP fields under that film. NCS could likely remove it, and I could see it upgrading.

[jgrinz]

Whats the hazy splotch at the foot on the reverse ??

[stev32k]

Whats the hazy splotch at the foot on the reverse ??

 

That's a rub on the slab. There is also a scratch on the slab reverse that starts just about the top center and extends about half way down.

[gmarguli]

Personally, I think the coin looks awful as is. I'd dip that coin ASAP.

 

NCS may be able to remove the carbon spots and very likely could remove the haze. The coin looks cameo - possibly heavy cameo - under the haze. It's worth a shot.

[JamminJ]

That coin is begging for a trip to NCS.

[jgrinz]

Personally, I think the coin looks awful as is. I'd dip that coin ASAP.

 

NCS may be able to remove the carbon spots and very likely could remove the haze. The coin looks cameo - possibly heavy cameo - under the haze. It's worth a shot.

 

Yeah I think its a REAL

serious candidate for a Ship to NCS and then over to NGC

 

DO it and Keep us informed ..

[Wihlborg]

That looks like there could be a VERY nice coin under all that….err, whatever it is. If it were mine, that puppy would be on the way to NCS as fast as I could get it packed and to the post office.

 

Good luck with it.

 

John

[JamminJ]

Where are all the "I like original coins" people on this thread?

[zrlevin]

I like original coins.

 

I'm in favor of dipping this one though, just be careful. I wouldn't be surprised if there were hairlines under there.

[jgrinz]

I am more concerned about some of the spotting doing possible damage to the coins surface ... hence my suggestion

[dooly]

NCS > NGC NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!

[realone]

How about this, I will buy the coin to stop it from being messed with, please PM me if this is of interest to you, I love the originality and can live with all the flaws mentioned. You should see my skin damage fromm the CA sun under extreme magnification.

[MAULEMALL]

The coin looks cameo - possibly heavy cameo - under the haze. It's worth a shot.

 

NCS and I agree with Greg ,It looks to have some serious Cameo Contrast..

[PerryHall]

I like it the way it is now. You may regret removing the toning if it's hiding a zillion hairlines which is a real possibility. Do ya feel lucky?

[stev32k]

How about this, I will buy the coin to stop it from being messed with, please PM me if this is of interest to you, I love the originality and can live with all the flaws mentioned. You should see my skin damage fromm the CA sun under extreme magnification.

 

I really like original un-messed coins also. However, the toning on this one is very distracting to me. The brown streaks almost look like cigarette or cigar smoke stains. It also looks like the surface had some kind of light oil applied before the staining took place. The swirls and holes look like what you see it you spray a piece of metal with oil then dip it in water. The oil protects some parts, but not all and you end up with the same kind of pattern.

 

What is under the toning is also a concern to me. I've seen toning hide some really bad hairlines and scratches.

[jgrinz]

How about this, I will buy the coin to stop it from being messed with, please PM me if this is of interest to you, I love the originality and can live with all the flaws mentioned. You should see my skin damage fromm the CA sun under extreme magnification.

 

I really like original un-messed coins also. However, the toning on this one is very distracting to me. The brown streaks almost look like cigarette or cigar smoke stains. It also looks like the surface had some kind of light oil applied before the staining took place. The swirls and holes look like what you see it you spray a piece of metal with oil then dip it in water. The oil protects some parts, but not all and you end up with the same kind of pattern.

 

What is under the toning is also a concern to me. I've seen toning hide some really bad hairlines and scratches.

 

Sell it and buy a PRETTIER example ?? You had one offer already

[stev32k]

I don't think I'll sell this one. I haven't made up my mind about NCS yet, but even if I don't send it off I think I'll hang onto it. It's a nice coin - I just think it could be better - maybe?

[MikeInFL]

Why not sell this coin and find one that appeals to you more rather than roll the dice at NCS?

[stev32k]

Why not sell this coin and find one that appeals to you more rather than roll the dice at NCS?

 

I guess the answer to that is I am not willing to pay the price for a proof TD that appeals to me more. The price difference between a 64 and 65 is more than double and I just don't like a 65 twice as much as a 64.

 

On the other hand I think this one has about a 50:50 shot of being either a 64 or 65 cameo . If not a cameo then maybe a 65. The downside is the possibility of hidden hairlines or damage from the spots - and a PR62 or body bag. Guess I have to decide just how much of a risk taker I really am.

[MAULEMALL]

Why not sell this coin and find one that appeals to you more rather than roll the dice at NCS?

 

I guess the answer to that is I am not willing to pay the price for a proof TD that appeals to me more. The price difference between a 64 and 65 is more than double and I just don't like a 65 twice as much as a 64.

 

On the other hand I think this one has about a 50:50 shot of being either a 64 or 65 cameo . If not a cameo then maybe a 65. The downside is the possibility of hidden hairlines or damage from the spots - and a PR62 or body bag. Guess I have to decide just how much of a risk taker I really am.

NCS will not do any work on the coin unless they are sure that it will not lower the grade.

I believe that is their Guaranty...Check the website or give them a call..

[michael]

ncs no longer guarantees the grade if they decide to conserve your coin

 

and it is impossible for ncs to be totally sure of what will happen with their conservation if this is what they decide to do........................

 

this coin if consurved by NCS in my opinion will look worse and look like like a processed piece of aluminum foil.... and more than likely be a lower grade than proof 64 possibly bodybag depending on what is under the toning

 

and even if the coin winds up in a proof 64 holder it will look much worse

 

i would rather send this coin back to pcgs for grade guarantee and then after their result if you get the coin back sell it and buy a much better trade dollar already in a pcgs/ngc holder with no problems

 

an ugly coin with dip residue and slowly corroding in on itself in the current holder

[physics-fan3.14]

It's not often that I say this, but I am going to disagree with michael on this one. I think under that coin there is a strong potential for a very nice deep cameo. Send it to NCS, and I don't think you will be dissapointed.

[toyonakataro]

Won't carbon sptots stand out if you dip that coin and remove the toning around those spots?

[TomB]

The image of this coin actually makes it attractive to me, though I believe I am in the extreme minority in this case. As for a trip to NCS, this is not a piece that I would take a chance with in terms of work. The cameo looks fairly good and the toning looks fairly funky, but you may have no idea what lies beneath that layer of oxidation. If the coin is hairlined, especially in the obverse field in front of Ms Liberty where the toning has a wispy character to it, then those hairlines will stand out like a beacon. The coin may upgrade to PF64CAM, but I don't think it would be better. In my opinion only, I would strongly urge you to keep the coin as is or sell it. If it is dipped white, or off-white, then it will be identical to the hundreds of other dipped white Trade dollars out there that can be found at most larger shows.

[CarlWohlforth]

Why the question?

 

If you loved the coin as is you would not ask the question. You say you will keep it if you send it to NCS or not. If that is so then don't send it. You can always send it later.

 

If you want to sell it you already have a potential buyer. So no need to send it to NCS.

 

Will NCS get the carbon spots off? I doubt it. Will the carbon spots stand out more? I guess so. Will the coin look dipped? I guess so. If dipped will the coin upgrade? I'm not sure, but if NCS thinks it will make the coin look worse they will not do the work. Will the coin grade UCAM? I don't think so, I think it would cam.

 

What would I do? I would find out if realone would get me out of a coin I no longer like...

[Elcontador]

I don't like the idea of dipping unless you are getting something off the surface of a coin which has accumulated, like a sulfide compound. This way, the dipping gets rid of what it ON the coin, rather than eroding its SURFACES.

 

I doubt dipping a coin because of its toning will help; I think you'd wind up with a dipped and stripped coin, like so many of the PF TDs that I always see offered in the bourse. Also, when I have seen carbon removed, I've seen whitish stains, which imo, look worse (than the carbon).

 

Might add that TDs are often hairlined, especially the PFs. The fact that yours is not may be because the toning conceals it. Personally, I'd either keep the coin or sell it to someone who appreciates it as is.

[supertooth]

I'll stand with the minority on this one. As it is now, this TD is one of a kind. It has some 'character' IMHO. There is not another one in existance that looks exactly like it. If NCS treats the coin, it will then become like many others. It has a fairly good chance of looking a lot worse than it does now---as others have hinted.

 

Sell it to someone who will appreciate it for what it is----in its present condition. You can then hunt for the one that you really wanted to buy in the first place. Don't try to 'make' this coin into what you want. You will more than likely regret your efforts----and loose money to boot. Bob [supertooth]

[Bruceswar]

I vote for do not dip it. Leave it as it is and enjoy it!

[stev32k]

I'm leaning strongly towards sending it in - the streaks do not look like natural toning to me. The more I look at it the more convinced I become that the brown whatever on the surface is from hydrocarbon vapors. I've seen this on mirrors in older houses. Fumes from cooking, spray cans, and cigarette smoke will coat most everything including coins.

 

I recognize there is a risk of uncovering surface damage that would downgrade the coin, but I think the chances of that are slim. If it were hairlined I believe you could see some signs even though the toning. I have another 1882 proof TD that is toned and hairlined and I don't have any problem seeing the hairlines. This one is in a PCGS PR62 holder. It has fairly heavy toning, but the lines are clearly visible.