Mr Braddick,,,This coin is a MONSTER...

[MAULEMALL]

For all those who say that PCGS should take it off the market, Well there is a BUY IT NOW button.

 

If they don't hit it then I guess we can all infer that they continue to believe it is a Natural coin.

I don't think that's a sound inference, for a few reasons.

 

First, they might be aware of the posting about the coin, but not that it's up for sale or, if so, where. We simply don't know how much or how closely they have read about it.

 

Second, even if they do know it's up for sale and think it shouldn't be in their holder, they would likely try to obtain it by means other than "buy it now".

 

Third, there is also the possibility that they really don't have any good idea as to whether or not the coin is natural and choose not to take it off the market. So, the fact that they haven't hit "buy it now" doesn't necessarily tell us anything about what they know or think about the coin.

Well it seems that Mr B ended the first auction and reposted it with a lower BIN

 

Looks like it sold.

I can't see where it sold, only that the "buy it now" had been lowered to $250 and that the item is no longer for sale. There is no indication that the listing was ended with a "buy it now". Hopefully Pat will let us know what happened.

Well If it isn't sold I think I can scrape together $256.00

[Doogy]

the fur is really starting to fly about this coin ATS. One poster said it best when he followed up to a previous post:

 

"<< Wonder how this thread would read if that same coin made into a NGC PF-69* holder? >>

 

Simple.

 

When something like this gets into a PCGS holder, it's a mistake or an accident. When it gets into anyone else's holder, it's proof that they suck."

 

 

I agree with him, there are far too many Kool-Aid drinkers on the PCGS forum that assume PCGS can do no wrong, and every other TPG is a worthless underling.

 

PCGS screwed the pooch slabbing this coin, and has lost some face in the process IMHO.

[Dcoin]

I have a theory.

 

I think Peacock put it up for sale in the hopes of getting PCGS to buy it back at a hefty premium. If for nothing else just to do a little damage control. Once they did not bite at 5,000$, it was lowered.

 

Very shrewd, if this is the case.

[gmarguli]

Things that make you go

 

 

 

 

 

I can see why it didn't stay in the PCI RED holder for very long

 

 

I LOVE this coin. It is clearly 100% NT (see: PCGS slab). If Pat would like to sell it, I'd be a strong buyer for it.

[truthteller]

Things that make you go

 

 

 

 

 

I can see why it didn't stay in the PCI RED holder for very long

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

TRUTH

[TomB]

"Monster" is correct. How one defines monster is another story.

[MikeInFL]

I'm not sure what's worse...

 

Maulemall calling this AT POS a monster, or

 

Pat's saturation-ehnanced photos, or

 

PCGS slabbing it.

 

Sad on all counts....Mike

[Zoins]

I don't consider this very different than some of the extremely colorful Morgan toners that are posted here and ATS.

[MAULEMALL]

I'm not sure what's worse...

 

Maulemall calling this AT POS a monster, or

 

Pat's saturation-ehnanced photos, or

 

PCGS slabbing it.

 

Sad on all counts....Mike

Please see the sig line

[Cladiator]

Pat, are you going to post a reply on the two threads about this coin at CU?

[truthteller]

I'm not sure what's worse...

 

Maulemall calling this AT POS a monster

 

, or

 

Pat's saturation-ehnanced photos

 

, or

 

PCGS slabbing it.

 

Sad on all counts....Mike

[MAULEMALL]

I'm not sure what's worse...

 

Maulemall calling this AT POS a monster

 

, or

 

Pat's saturation-ehnanced photos

 

, or

 

PCGS slabbing it.

 

Sad on all counts....Mike

Hey truth,,,When you are ATing coins do you ever get this type result?

[gmarguli]

Pat, are you going to post a reply on the two threads about this coin at CU?

 

Why should he?

[gmarguli]

I'm not sure what's worse...

 

Maulemall calling this AT POS a monster, or

 

Pat's saturation-ehnanced photos, or

 

PCGS slabbing it.

 

Sad on all counts....Mike

 

Your negativity is better suited for the PCGS forums.

[WinstonWare]

What I find strange about this whole debacle is that Pat (or someone else perhaps) somehow knew that they could crack that red PCI holder and get it certified by PCGS. If I saw this coin raw I would never imagine that it would get holdered. To crack it out of a pci red holder thinking it would get certified by one of the top certification companies is hard for me to fathom.

[gmarguli]

Have you seen the modern commems in PCGS slabs?

 

That Olympic $ that is in the thread ATS is a great example. The guy who made them used to have a case at Long Beach. One price for the raw ones. One price for the PCGS ones. All of them AT and stated so by their maker/seller.

[truthteller]

My experimental coins never get this type of toning. Surely, anyone selling these types of coins and not disclosing the obvious artificial toning have questionable ethics and morals. In addition, those who conspire to sell these coins also may have questionable ethics and morals. Thanks Maulemall for continuing to expose some questionable sellers.

 

 

 

 

TRUTH

[WinstonWare]

Yes I did see that one ATS. I didn’t realize that there were many. You would have guessed that this coin would have been slabbed? I never would have but I’m still learning…

[gmarguli]

My experimental coins never get this type of toning. Surely, anyone selling these types of coins and not disclosing the obvious artificial toning have questionable ethics and morals. In addition, those who conspire to sell these coins also may have questionable ethics and morals.

 

TRUTH

 

Well, if you, Master Coin Doctor, could not get these types of color during your hundreds (thousands) of ATing sessions, then perhaps they are NT?

 

Or are you saying that the doctor was better than you in this case? However, you both get your AT into slabs, so I don't want to talk down your ATing abilities.

[Zoins]

Have you seen the modern commems in PCGS slabs?

 

That Olympic $ that is in the thread ATS is a great example. The guy who made them used to have a case at Long Beach. One price for the raw ones. One price for the PCGS ones. All of them AT and stated so by their maker/seller.

Good to know. Does he still make them?

[MAULEMALL]

My experimental coins never get this type of toning. Surely, anyone selling these types of coins and not disclosing the obvious artificial toning have questionable ethics and morals. In addition, those who conspire to sell these coins also may have questionable ethics and morals. Thanks Maulemall for continuing to expose some questionable sellers.

 

 

 

 

TRUTH

wink,wink

 

I got ya,,, hush hush and all that

[gmarguli]

Not that I am aware of. He sold his business to a top coin doctor in the industry today - no, not TruthTeller.

[truthteller]

My experimental coins never get this type of toning. Surely, anyone selling these types of coins and not disclosing the obvious artificial toning have questionable ethics and morals. In addition, those who conspire to sell these coins also may have questionable ethics and morals.

 

TRUTH

 

Well, if you, Master Coin Doctor, could not get these types of color during your hundreds (thousands) of ATing sessions, then perhaps they are NT?

 

Or are you saying that the doctor was better than you in this case? However, you both get your AT into slabs, so I don't want to talk down your ATing abilities.

 

No need to talk down, since you are already below the belly of a snake. Obviously, the coin doctors who tone with this type of toning are trying to make obscene money on artifcially toned coins. In years past, I have helped hundreds of newbie collectors look for the nuances of artificially toned coins and probably have saved them tens of thousands of dollars. Since this coin is so blantantly artificially toned, there is no need for explanations, the work is simply bad, bad, bad.

 

 

TRUTH

[relicsncoins]

Why are the buyers of these coins always completely absolved of these AT debaucles? Buying and selling is a two way street. The buyers of these things don't have a gun pointed at their head, they are willing participants. I see absolutely nothing un-ethical about selling a coin like this. The seller makes no false claims about this coin, the coin is not counterfeit. The coin is what it is, and that's a questionably toned piece of silver bullion in a PCGS slab and is worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

 

JJ

[gmarguli]

Since this coin is so blantantly artificially toned, there is no need for explanations, the work is simply bad, bad, bad.

 

TRUTH

 

It appears that PCGS doesn't agree.

 

Or perhaps it is MA?

[MAULEMALL]

My experimental coins never get this type of toning. Surely, anyone selling these types of coins and not disclosing the obvious artificial toning have questionable ethics and morals. In addition, those who conspire to sell these coins also may have questionable ethics and morals.

 

TRUTH

 

Well, if you, Master Coin Doctor, could not get these types of color during your hundreds (thousands) of ATing sessions, then perhaps they are NT?

 

Or are you saying that the doctor was better than you in this case? However, you both get your AT into slabs, so I don't want to talk down your ATing abilities.

 

No need to talk down, since you are already below the belly of a snake. Obviously, the coin doctors who tone with this type of toning are trying to make obscene money on artifcially toned coins. In years past, I have helped hundreds of newbie collectors look for the nuances of artificially toned coins and probably have saved them tens of thousands of dollars. Since this coin is so blantantly artificially toned, there is no need for explanations, the work is simply bad, bad, bad.

 

 

TRUTH

[truthteller]

Why are the buyers of these coins always completely absolved of these AT debaucles? Buying and selling is a two way street. The buyers of these things don't have a gun pointed at their head, they are willing participants. I see absolutely nothing un-ethical about selling a coin like this. The seller makes no false claims about this coin, the coin is not counterfeit. The coin is what it is, and that's a questionably toned piece of silver bullion in a PCGS slab and is worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

 

JJ

 

 

In some respects, this is true. The aforementioned coin is so blantant, that even the newbie should question the color. If the newbie wants to spend $200 on it, he will soon find out an easy and somewhat inexpensive lesson on color. However, the newbie who buys blue indians spending thousands of dollars, will be in for a shock upon selling. There is obvious AT, there is subtle AT and there is AT where no one can tell the difference. Education is always best.

 

 

TRUTH

[MAULEMALL]

Since this coin is so blantantly artificially toned, there is no need for explanations, the work is simply bad, bad, bad.

 

TRUTH

 

It appears that PCGS doesn't agree.

 

Or perhaps it is MA?

A very good point.

[Zoins]

Since this coin is so blantantly artificially toned, there is no need for explanations, the work is simply bad, bad, bad.

 

TRUTH

It appears that PCGS doesn't agree.

 

Or perhaps it is MA?

If it's MA then according to PCGS it must be an "ultra rarity." Is a 1998 ASE an ultra rarity? If not, according to their printed policies, it must not be artificial toning.

[MAULEMALL]

Why are the buyers of these coins always completely absolved of these AT debaucles? Buying and selling is a two way street. The buyers of these things don't have a gun pointed at their head, they are willing participants. I see absolutely nothing un-ethical about selling a coin like this. The seller makes no false claims about this coin, the coin is not counterfeit. The coin is what it is, and that's a questionably toned piece of silver bullion in a PCGS slab and is worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

 

JJ

 

 

In some respects, this is true. The aforementioned coin is so blantant, that even the newbie should question the color. If the newbie wants to spend $200 on it, he will soon find out an easy and somewhat inexpensive lesson on color. However, the newbie who buys blue indians spending thousands of dollars, will be in for a shock upon selling. There is obvious AT, there is subtle AT and there is AT where no one can tell the difference. Education is always best.

 

 

TRUTH

Is that some sort of a dig at Mark for selling blue indians...He fully disscloses what he thinks about them..