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$20 Liberty Head Collectors - I have a Question Query a Poser !

Started by jgrinz,

17 posts in this topic

jgrinz

jgrinz

Posted
Posted

I have two Liberty head $20 that were certified and encapsulated by PCGS as MS62 - As you realize there is a REAL significant jump in valuation if you can get them in 63 Holders ... Who in todays standards do you think My best bet is to REgrade with PCGS or NGC ... I believe these to be 63;s but lo no from PCGS ... Basic Pictures are in my registry but I will try to get fresh ones up shortly ...

 

1617137-oldgold.jpg

 

Mike

1617137-oldgold.jpg.859ebd7bbc1f2a6e1f2d99f78b6d557b.jpg

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MBA101

MBA101

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Posted

Yes, post us big detailed pics if you can. I have currently 16 Libs, many of which are '62's. I also have 2 '63's and one 64 and have also owned and sold, as well as viewed many other 62, 63, and 64's. If the luster is broken over a large area of the face, they will never (NGC or PCGS) give it a '63. A low end '63 needs to have exceptional almost complete luster, with the same marks as a high end '62. The face is one of the keys. It will almost always be heavily bagged or hairlined, and the severity of which can make or break getting a higher grade. Yours looks too bagged, but hard to be certain from that pic...

 

Check out my registry set pics of my 61's, 2's 3's and the 4 for the face marks in comparison...

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michael

michael

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hard to tell from he scans but a guesstimate or me i grade this coin a nice ms62 from the scans in hand might be different but i doubt it

 

now because of the huge price increase the coin really has to be all there to justify the thousands of dollars more and i just do not see it with this coin based on the photos

 

if i ever have a problem with grading a coin i look at it (like this coin and say) and say .............

 

is this coin worth $850 or $3250+?? 893scratchchin-thumb.gif

 

i see this coin as a $900+ dollar coin .............

 

would you buy this coin today for $3750 and put it in your collection if you did not own it and it was in a pcgs piece of plastic graded ms63??

 

now of course with the coin game and submitting maybe 893scratchchin-thumb.gif you might get it in a pcgs piece of plastic ms63 and i am sure there will be someone out there that will pay more than 3000++ for it. not me

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jgrinz

jgrinz

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Yes, post us big detailed pics if you can. I have currently 16 Libs, many of which are '62's. I also have 2 '63's and one 64 and have also owned and sold, as well as viewed many other 62, 63, and 64's. If the luster is broken over a large area of the face, they will never (NGC or PCGS) give it a '63. A low end '63 needs to have exceptional almost complete luster, with the same marks as a high end '62. The face is one of the keys. It will almost always be heavily bagged or hairlined, and the severity of which can make or break getting a higher grade. Yours looks too bagged, but hard to be certain from that pic...

 

Check out my registry set pics of my 61's, 2's 3's and the 4 for the face marks in comparison...

 

Link would have been nice smile.gif - Now I have to go find you

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MBA101

MBA101

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Posted

And those pics are shrunken a bit because of the pic size limit. If there is one in particular that you would like to see a better pic of, let me know. Tonite I may add pics for the two that I have not done yet as well...

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jtryka

jtryka

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I didn't see any PCGS MS-62s in your set. To be frank, the only two I thought might have a chance were the 1890 and the 1906-D, but to me all the 62s in your set are appropriately graded from the photos. There is a big hurdle to overcome for a Lib to move from 62 to 63 so an upgrade is much easier said than done.

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MBA101

MBA101

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NGC '62's.

 

Generally speaking, PCGS and NGC are not too different in grading these, until maybe MS 64 and up, or if they disagree on whether something is a '58 or sixtysomething.

 

Was actually told by my dealer that he and the guy that he got the 06-D from tried a couple of times to get that coin into a 63 holder and failed. Ms Liberty has some hairlines on her which I believe is what keeps that coin from a higher grade. Thing is, I would rather have those hairlines on my MS 62 Lib than have the usual abundance of bag marks.

 

The 1890 is right on the cusp of '63. I have been temped to try for a up-grade, but I suspect that it would once again just fall short. With a value gap of $1150 vs $8000 in the current greysheet, I wish there was an easy way to sell this coin as an MS62.5. But, hey, if I were truly in this for the money, then I would probably even try submitting it raw to PCGS to see what they had to say.

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jgrinz

jgrinz

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Here it is again ..

 

1621297-gold.jpg

 

A More natural color and better lighting ...

 

Learning curve is slow but it is getting there

 

1621297-gold.jpg.7994c8d5c52cf188e2cad06c1f1c116b.jpg

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MBA101

MBA101

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That looks like a '62 to me, but it may depend on how strong and vibrant the luster is compared with other '62's to have a chance. Still a very nice coin.

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jtryka

jtryka

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The reverse might have a shot at a 63, but the obverse looks like a 62 with the chatter in the fields and the marks on the cheek.

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BillJones

BillJones

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The coin you posted is a prime example of an MS-62 graded coin that is maxed out. There is a rub on the check, and as such this coin can't make MS-63 unless they lower the standards.

 

And yes, in the old days your piece would have been an AU-58.

 

Here's an 1896 $20 gold that's in a PCGS MS-63 holder that I would say is "all there" for the grade.

 

189620O.jpg

189620R.jpg

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jgrinz

jgrinz

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The coin you posted is a prime example of an MS-62 graded coin that is maxed out. There is a rub on the check, and as such this coin can't make MS-63 unless they lower the standards.

 

And yes, in the old days your piece would have been an AU-58.

 

Here's an 1896 $20 gold that's in a PCGS MS-63 holder that I would say is "all there" for the grade.

 

189620O.jpg

189620R.jpg

 

Whats with the eagles tail feathers on the reverse right side .. its like they are not there compared to the distinct look on mine ??

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BillJones

BillJones

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Whats with the eagles tail feathers on the reverse right side .. its like they are not there compared to the distinct look on mine ??

 

The strike is weak in that spot, probably from die polishing. On an MS-63 or 64 it does not matter. If the coin were graded MS-65 or higher it would be a concern IMO. Grading does not just involve marks and spots. In the very high grades strike plays a factor too. A very high grade coin must also be a prime example of a good to great strike for the design.

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