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Drowning in the 'Bay... 1913-S Ty2 Buffalo Nickel not marked RESTORED!

Started by DC Dawg,

19 posts in this topic

DC Dawg

DC Dawg

Posted
Posted

All I have left to fill my Buffalo Nickel album is the 1913-S Type 2 nickel. Other than the 3-Legged Buffalo, it is the key of the business strikes. So I was diving in to the 'Bay to see what was around I found this.

 

Now I am not a Buffalo Nickel expert, but I am pretty sure I can recognize when Buffalo Nickels have been "restored" either using something like Nic-A-Date (acid) or someone retooling the feature. The acid is easy as it usually leaves a spot. Restoring tends to leave a matte or even porous surface. If you get it wrong, you have a real porous surface that looks real bad.

 

What do you do with a coins that looks too porous? You sell it on eBay! Tell everyone "this coin has some surface problems...possibly corrosion" to CYA. The seller has a high feedback score and is a "power seller." He must know something about what he is doing--yea, fooling his betters.

 

What gets me is that as I write this, the coin has been bid up to $76.00!!

 

Maybe we need to crank up the complaint machine on this one!!

 

Scott Christo_pull_hair.gif

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WoodenJefferson

WoodenJefferson

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But...but...it's an XF on a red carpet! (So sayeth the seller)

 

Golly Gosh...it looks like the corrosion products are still active on the reverse, someone is buying into some real problems on this buffalo.

 

At least the seller discloses problems in the description and the pictures show the pourous surfaces...not much you can do about complaining, the seller is waving the red flags like caution flags at the Talladega Speedway.

 

If you can't "SEE" those flags...shame, shame, you're gonna wreck.

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Amanda

Amanda

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"magic buffalo juice" 27_laughing.gif what the heck is that?

 

The power of persuation at work.

 

I don't know. That's just a little animation I found on eBay one time. It makes me sad. frown.gif

 

-Amanda

 

PS- I think it's acid.

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James_OldeTowne

James_OldeTowne

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This coin isn't restored, but rather corroded overall. What would concern me more, though, is authenticity. One of the sneaky methods used to hide an embossed or added mintmark is to acid-treat the entire coin, thus corroding it and disguising diagnostics that make authentication possible. I would unhesitatingly pass on this example.

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DC Dawg

DC Dawg

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I am not bidding, but I don't think the posting is honest.

 

According to someone I know who restores Buffalo nickels (and I have not spoken to him about this coin), restorers use acid to mark the features. The same stuff to bring out the date, except they dilute the liquid with a little acetone and water. It "softens" the nickel. If you use too much acetone or not enough water, you get a very porous surface that makes the coin turn brownish.

 

This coin looks like an example of that type of failed attemp.

 

After I saw it, I was going to pass on it anyway. Even if I get a G-4 example of this key date, I want it to look like it was real. I may even buy a slabbed coin and crack it out for the album!!

 

Scott hi.gif

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thebeav

thebeav

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I'm in the not restored camp. I've seen too many nickles. Both restored and natural.

The date on this coin has too much depth to it. There was no acid used here.

 

Paul

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DC Dawg

DC Dawg

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I spoke to my friend who restores Buffalo Nickels and carves "modern" Hobo nickels. After showing him the listing, he things that this coin was a bad attempt at restoration. He told me that those who restore coins, use an acetone-based solution to help soften the metal so that they can use a wooden stylus to "sculpt" the details. The coin is dipped into the solution and the scupltor redefines the images, including the date.

 

There are two areas where things can go wrong that could cause the type of toning he saw: trying to "wash" the coin when done or using too much acetone. Amatures try to wash the coin with soap after using the acetone wash. According to my friend, the best thing to use is mineral spirits followed by distilled water. Mineral spirits is supposed to stop the "acid" process of the acetone and then the water to rinse everything off. He uses a condement squeeze bottle to rinse the coin.

 

When restoring Buffalo nickels, an acid wash is necessary to lift some of the details so they may be carved. Acetone is the acid of choice. But acetone is very reactive with the copper in the alloy. If the acetone is not diluted enough, it will react with the copper and make the coin appear corroded. What he thinks is that the color you see is the result of too much acetone reacting with the copper. To most people, the coin looks corroded. To someone who restores Buffaloes, it is not surprising.

 

I was suprised with the reaction to the copper doing this, but then I remembered that the composition of the nickel is 75-percent copper! I am also taking his word on the chemical reaction since I am not a chemist. But it makes sense.

 

I am sure some will disagree, but I've known this person for 15 years and I trust him.

 

Scott hi.gif

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TomB

TomB

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Acetone is the acid of choice. But acetone is very reactive with the copper in the alloy. If the acetone is not diluted enough, it will react with the copper and make the coin appear corroded. What he thinks is that the color you see is the result of too much acetone reacting with the copper.

Acetone is not an acid and will not react with copper.

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DC Dawg

DC Dawg

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Acetone is the acid of choice. But acetone is very reactive with the copper in the alloy. If the acetone is not diluted enough, it will react with the copper and make the coin appear corroded. What he thinks is that the color you see is the result of too much acetone reacting with the copper.

Acetone is not an acid and will not react with copper.

I said I wasn't a chemist and did not know. I am just relaying what I was told.

 

(maybe I heard wrong... don't shoot the messenger because he may have had a senior moment)

 

Scott flowerred.gif

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WoodenJefferson

WoodenJefferson

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We used to use Butanone which is a ketone, acetone is also a ketone, in the aircraft industry to clean electrical contacts (copper) until MSDS's were published and it was then and only then that when used in enclosed areas, methyl ethyl ketone (MEK) was decidedly hazardous to your health. If there was any ill wills in using this chemical (not an acid) in the aircraft electrical systems, we would not have been allowed to use it, period.

 

It was a great cleaner and would evaporate instantly leaving zero residue. I'm sure it made my liver quiver after all those years of use...any contact with the skin would leave a white spot where the oils in the skin would be instantly disolved.

 

Your source may be a restorer of buffalo nickels, but he's not using acetone to disolve the surface metal composites.

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TomB

TomB

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I wasn't shooting the messanger, I was simply correcting something that was entirely wrong. Additionally, the coin still clearly appears to have been corroded and not restored.

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