Can I grade properly?

[shirohniichan]

Here's an 1875 20 cent piece I judged to be VF-30 to 35, and I paid a VF price for it.

 

 

Many (if not most) sellers whose booths I've visited at shows would call this XF.

 

Who's right?

[currentcoin]

You probably got it right.

You can believe dealers grading

 

Glen

[toyonakataro]

Is the letter on the shield visible?

I think it's F15-VF20.....

 

taro

[Leothelion]

Is the letter on the shield visible?

I think it's F15-VF20.....

 

taro

 

Just checked the ANA GS and agree with Taro, too much wear for a higher grade but your right, alot of shyster dealers out there. Reminds me how I had a pick of some 12-15 twenty centers and the dealer would not do on a $125 price for a VF20, almost full Liberty. I had even asked if we I could take it over to the ANACS table, instead he picked up the coins and walked away.

 

Leo

[gmarguli]

I can't see the coin at all. What happened to it?

 

 

Hey, not the picture shows up. Looks VFish. Lots of drapery and wing detail. No way I would call it XF.

[berylcoin-migration]

You grade more properly than most sellers.

 

Like Taro I think you may still be a little too generous, even allowing for the striking problems of the issue. Given the common weakness at the head, LIBERTY, and the tops of the Eagles wings, there is still heavy wear throughout both designs. Looking at the ANA guide I doubt it would meet the standards for choice VF even ignoring LIBERTY, BUT...

 

In my opinion the 20 cent piece is generally not graded by any standard at all and is one of the most inconsistently graded U.S. coins in circulated condition. After reviewing the Heritage archives, dealer stock, and looking for a decent XF example for several years, I've almost given up on finding a raw or certified coin that is graded by a standard even remotely resembling the ANA or Photograde. The grade really seems to mean nothing on these.

 

BC

[shirohniichan]

I don't judge the grade using LIBERTY as the main criterion. I've even seen an UNC 1875-CC on which the "B" and "R" on LIBERTY were not legible.

 

I wouldn't hold my breath to find a seller who'd sell me this coin at Gray Sheet levels for Fine condition.

[Oldtrader3]

I would grade it a VF20. Just because of lack of detail in some devices.

[Dermott]

The 20 cent piece is really the exception to the LIBERTY rule. Because LIBERTY is raised instead of sunken into the shield, I'd say that this is one of the biggest reasons why the 20 cent piece seems so inconsistently graded.

[bigd5]

I think you have your coin graded correctly Shiro. VF should do it. Berylcoin, and Dermott make excellent points.

 

Remember, your grading doesn't matter, it's how you can interpret what the services will grade the coin that matters. There's a difference.

[braddick]

I think you're spot on Shiroh as I'd never give that the full XF40 nod.

But, what do I know? I've been accused of grading too liberally on some circulated stuff.

Nice coin, regardless.

[jom]

Using the proposed new grading system which is supposed to help cure the "accuracy" problem I'll say: VF-31.7482 and not a 1000th more!

 

jom

[shirohniichan]

US 20 cent pieces are probably the worst machine-struck series made, except perhaps for the trime.

 

Here's a Peruvian equivalent of the 20 cent piece (an 1875 1/5th sol).

 

 

It's an XF struck so well that it has raised rims and looks like a medallion. The US Mint could have learned something from the Peruvians in die cutting and striking.

[EVillageProwler]

I can see why some might say it's an EF coin. The peripheral detail is all there, especially on the reverse, while the central detail is more likely poorly struck.

 

IMO, the coin is only worth VF money...

 

EVP

[oreville-migration]

Agreed as to VF-20.

 

[shirohniichan]

This particular double dime has almost a wire rim and is indeed well struck around the periphery.

 

On the other end of the spectrum, I've seen many San Francisco double dimes that were weakly struck around the CENTS area. Coins with otherwise VG details are so poorly struck there that CENTS is almost completely gone.

 

I've noticed a number of 1875-CC 20 cent pieces with poorly struck wings on the viewer's left. Decently struck '75-CC's are the exception.

[shirohniichan]

My grade appears to fall in line with ANACS'.

 

Here's an ANACS VF-30 coin I just bought.

 

[shirohniichan]

 

The L and Y on the shield are clear on this 1875-S double dime I bought today in Fine condition. Were one to grade the series strictly by the legibility of LIBERTY on the shield, all three shown here would grade the same. However, if you look at the rest of the details as well (e.g. the stars), you'll see that the two former are a grade better than this one.