US Silver Dollar Commemoratives - what size do you prefer?

[Zoins]

The US has traditionally issued $1 silver commemorative coins containing less than an ounce of silver, however the American Silver Eagle has a $1 face and is an ounce of .999 silver. Countries like Mexico and China issue their silver commemoratives in full ounces of .999 silver. What do you think? Would you prefer if the US Mint moved more commemoratives to full .999 ounces or do you like the way it is now with the Franklin and SF Old Mint dollars, 26.73 grams of 90% silver + 10% copper.

[jtryka]

 

Well considering that the Constitution and the Coinage Act of 1792 define a dollar as 371.25 grains of pure silver, which is equal to 24.057 grams of pure silver, which is also equal to 26.73 grams of 0.900 fine silver. So the commems have it right historically, the modern bullion coins are just that, bullion to which their face value has no relation to economic or historical reality.

 

So to answer your question, I think they are fine using the historical measures of our currency if they are making commemorative coins. Should they decide to make commemorative bullion, then I suppose they can make it in 1-ounce coins, 10-ounce bars or 5-gram mini-ingots for all I care.

[Zoins]

Well considering that the Constitution and the Coinage Act of 1792 define a dollar as 371.25 grains of pure silver, which is equal to 24.057 grams of pure silver, which is also equal to 26.73 grams of 0.900 fine silver. So the commems have it right historically, the modern bullion coins are just that, bullion to which their face value has no relation to economic or historical reality.

The 1792 Coinage Act was superceded when the Ike clad dollars came out 35 years ago. The new commems are essentially non-circulating legal tender (NCLT) b/c their silver content is much higher than their face value. While using 24.057 grams of pure silver may have historical value, I'd say it has no economic reality today. In fact I think ounces are the economic reality. I also think it makes more sense to use ounces going forward because the ASE is the only annually issued US Mint silver dollar we have now. We haven't had a circulating silver dollar since the Peace Dollar if you don't count the people getting arrested for attempting to use Liberty Dollars, which also happen to use ounces. This is one area where I think it's okay to let history be just that, history.

[jtryka]

The 1792 Coinage Act was superceded when the Ike clad dollars came out 35 years ago. The new commems are essentially non-circulating legal tender (NCLT) b/c their silver content is much higher than their face value. While using 24.057 grams of pure silver may have historical value, I'd say it has no economic reality today. In fact I think ounces are the economic reality. I also think it makes more sense to use ounces going forward because the ASE is the only annually issued US Mint silver dollar we have now. We haven't had a circulating silver dollar since the Peace Dollar if you don't count the people getting arrested for attempting to use Liberty Dollars, which also happen to use ounces. This is one area where I think it's okay to let history be just that, history.

 

Speaking of "economic reality" when is the last time an ounce of silver was a dollar? Or an ounce of gold $50? If you want to use ounces that's fine, but then get rid of the phoney dollar value.

[Zoins]

Speaking of "economic reality" when is the last time an ounce of silver was a dollar? Or an ounce of gold $50? If you want to use ounces that's fine, but then get rid of the phoney dollar value.

You'd have a more solid grounding if you didn't claim an economic reality for 1792 silver weights.

 

There is no economic reality for the face values of ASEs, AGEs or any modern commem. They are all NCLT. Claiming a $1 economic reality for 1792 ASW doesn't make sense. If you wish to get rid of the $1 face on the ASE then they should also come off the 1792 ASW commems if you are going by economics. I agree there are historical reasons but that's a separate issue and I prefer to get rid of an ASW that's only based on history.

 

As I mentioned above, ASEs do have a $1 face and they are issued annually. There is no annual US Mint coin with 1792 ASW today.

[markm597]

it doesn;t make a difference to me . I'll buy them any way the mint makes them.I do preffer

they cost less & give more silver though. ha ha ha like that'll happen.

[Bob Flaminio]

Stay with the classic sizes and compositions. They're not bullion -- they're commemoratives, so why treat them as bullion?

[Zoins]

Stay with the classic sizes and compositions. They're not bullion -- they're commemoratives, so why treat them as bullion?

I think staying with classic sizes is better for albums but everyone is moving to slabs now so I'm not sure that matters as much.

 

I don't think it's a bullion vs commemoratives issue. I prefer to think of ounce sized commemoratives as commemoratives of the ASE which is the only annual silver dollar coin we have now.

 

I think it's more of a tradition vs. moving forward issue. It's fine to prefer tradition and history, just call it that.

[Amanda]

I see no reason to make the silver dollar commemoratives anything other than silver dollars.

 

Why fix what's not broken?

 

The ASEs are not silver dollars, they are silver bullion ounces. The face value is moot in their trading, as they trade for bullion prices, or at least, they should.

 

-Amanda

[Zoins]

I see no reason to make the silver dollar commemoratives anything other than silver dollars.

 

Why fix what's not broken?

 

The ASEs are not silver dollars, they are silver bullion ounces. The face value is moot in their trading, as they trade for bullion prices, or at least, they should.

 

ASEs are silver dollars in the same sense that modern NCLT commens are silver dollars, in that they are legislated to have $1 legal tender value by the US government.

 

While ASEs can be treated as bullion, there are ASE collectors out there and many ASEs are worth far more than their bullion value.

[Amanda]

The face value is also moot for all modern NCLT commems.

 

Ah... but they are called commemorative dollars.

 

-Amanda

[Zoins]

The face value is also moot for all modern NCLT commems.

 

Ah... but they are called commemorative dollars.

I edited my earlier post but think we crossed posts.

 

ASEs and modern NCLT commems are both silver dollars in that they have $1 legal tender value as determined by the US government. Since the US government determines what is and is not a dollar and they have assigned a $1 face value to ASEs, I think it's appropriate to call them silver dollars.

[EZ_E]

I see no reason to make the silver dollar commemoratives anything other than silver dollars.

 

Why fix what's not broken?

 

The ASEs are not silver dollars, they are silver bullion ounces. The face value is moot in their trading, as they trade for bullion prices, or at least, they should.

The face value is also moot for all modern NCLT commems. ASEs are treated as bullion but there are ASE collectors out there and many ASEs are worth far more than their bullion value.

 

I like the standard weight and the 38mm size. If the size changed then I would be sorely disappointed, much more so than a change in composition.

 

The face value given makes it a US issued coin which distinguishes it from a medal or a token. This is what makes it more collectable. True, the face value is mute but it is oh so significant.

[Zoins]

I like the standard weight and the 38mm size. If the size changed then I would be sorely disappointed, much more so than a change in composition.

 

The face value given makes it a US issued coin which distinguishes it from a medal or a token. This is what makes it more collectable. True, the face value is mute but it is oh so significant.

I think preferring the traditional size and history are valid reasons for the status quo. I prefer modern amounts of precious metals but can accept those reasons for staying traditional on the commems.

[Bob Flaminio]

It's fine to prefer tradition and history, just call it that.

 

Okies -- I prefer tradition and history.

[WinstonWare]

I could go for a nice 10 pounder. Give me something with some size