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SGS Certification... good or poop?

Started by WaxonWaxov,

37 posts in this topic

MunkyMan95

MunkyMan95

Posted
Posted

dog poop, bird poop, rabbit poop, just plain poop. Wait a second, deja vu! SGS is pretty bad, they tend to be way high. Most likely they wouldn't cross.

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TomB

TomB

Posted
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PCGS and NGC will not cross any service MS70 or PF70 grade because they need to have the coin cracked out of the slab in order to inspect it.

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gmarguli

gmarguli

Posted
Posted

SGS has a reputation for grading pretty much all their coins as MS/PF70. They are not to be trusted. It's been mentioned that the main (only?) seller of these coins is also the slabber. Run from their stuff.

 

You can cross these to NGC/PCGS if you like. You'll need to specify "cross at any grade" and they will be cracked out first and then graded. Some may retain the grade of 70. Most likely none will, but it is possible.

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Connecticoin

Connecticoin

Posted
Posted
Is SGS certification nay good, or is it poop?

 

How likely would it be that an SGS graded PF-70 will cross-grade to NGC PF-70?

 

thanks

 

They are the largest of a number of "self slabbers" who overgrade thier own coins, "slab" them in plastic slabs available to anyone, and hawk them on Ebay, freqeuently quoting Coin World trends or PCGS price guide values. Newbies fall for these, thinking they are bargains, and usually they end of overpaying for an overgraded coin.

 

Ebay seller "aboncom" does the SGS self-slabbing. The other large "self-slabber" is "NNC" done by e-bay seller "centsles". There are about a dozen others that have come out of the woodwork -- it's getting hard to keep up.

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gmarguli

gmarguli

Posted
Posted
The other large "self-slabber" is "NNC" done by e-bay seller "centsles". There are about a dozen others that have come out of the woodwork -- it's getting hard to keep up.

 

Are you sure that NNC is done by centsles? He seems to have moved from grading service to grading service and he didn't own the others.

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jom

jom

Posted
Posted

Do yourself a favor and learn to treat ALL coins in holders as RAW. That way you will do well.

 

I used to say you can trust the likes of NGC, PCGS and a couple of others but after recent "events" I now think otherwise.

 

Do your homework and in the long run you will benefit.

 

jom

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gmarguli

gmarguli

Posted
Posted
I used to say you can trust the likes of NGC, PCGS and a couple of others but after recent "events" I now think otherwise.

 

You mean your AT gold $5 Indians? boo.gif

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MAULEMALL

MAULEMALL

Posted
Posted
I used to say you can trust the likes of NGC, PCGS and a couple of others but after recent "events" I now think otherwise.

 

You mean your AT gold $5 Indians? boo.gif

I think his soon to be state quarters thumbsup2.gif
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gmarguli

gmarguli

Posted
Posted
I used to say you can trust the likes of NGC, PCGS and a couple of others but after recent "events" I now think otherwise.

 

You mean your AT gold $5 Indians? boo.gif

I think his soon to be state quarters thumbsup2.gif

 

Ah, I remember a "sealed roll" of state quarters jom showed me. Monster toned (blowtorch) endroll coins.

 

The joys of poking sticks at jom. cloud9.gif

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MAULEMALL

MAULEMALL

Posted
Posted
I used to say you can trust the likes of NGC, PCGS and a couple of others but after recent "events" I now think otherwise.

 

You mean your AT gold $5 Indians? boo.gif

I think his soon to be state quarters thumbsup2.gif

 

Ah, I remember a "sealed roll" of state quarters jom showed me. Monster toned (blowtorch) endroll coins.

 

The joys of poking sticks at jom. cloud9.gif

893applaud-thumb.gifsign-funnypost.gif
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jom

jom

Posted
Posted
You mean your AT gold $5 Indians? boo.gif

 

Where did you get that idea? Oh...wait...yeah...that's what I meant. mad.gif

 

Also, you didn't like my blow-torch Washingtons? You TOLD me they would grade out at PCGS didn't you? 893scratchchin-thumb.gif

 

jom

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James_OldeTowne

James_OldeTowne

Posted
Posted

SGS DOES NOT CERTIFY coins. They merely "grade" coins. And since they are unwilling to back their coins with a financial guarantee, that tells you what they think of their own grades, which is to say . . . . . not much.

 

James

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WaxonWaxov

WaxonWaxov

Posted
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I hear you all loud and clear.

 

This coin sold at below Red Book PF-67. If it's a sucky coin when I get it, I'll just send it back.

 

I have no intention of making it a habit to buy SGS coins.

 

smile.gif

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WaxonWaxov

WaxonWaxov

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They are the largest of a number of "self slabbers" who overgrade thier own coins, "slab" them in plastic slabs available to anyone, and hawk them on Ebay, freqeuently quoting Coin World trends or PCGS price guide values. Newbies fall for these, thinking they are bargains, and usually they end of overpaying for an overgraded coin.

 

Ebay seller "aboncom" does the SGS self-slabbing. The other large "self-slabber" is "NNC" done by e-bay seller "centsles". There are about a dozen others that have come out of the woodwork -- it's getting hard to keep up.

 

After reading the this response to this thread I sent him, aboncom, an 'ask seller question' as follows:

 

So I've heard that you are the person who is this 'SGS' third party grader... true? Tell the truth.

 

 

This morning I had this reply:

 

Hi,

 

We have 0 % ownership in SGS Star Grading Service.

 

We are a MASTER DEALER for SGS and quite proud of that.

 

It now takes 11 months to get a coin certified if you are not a Master Dealer.

 

Thank you for asking.

 

Larry L. Bence

CEO

 

 

So this morning I responded as follows:

 

OK, then. This coin at this price will be an test for SGS and you.

 

I find it concerning that you list the item's location as Mansfield, OH and the SGS certificate that you picture lists SGS's address as Bellville, OH. These towns are eleven miles apart, so I guess you see my point.

 

Then there is what I'm reading over on the Collector's Society Message boards about SGS and you. Check it out here... http://boards.collectors-society.com/sho...rt=all&vc=1

 

I look forward to receiving the coin. If there are any visible marks on it at all, then it won't grade NGC-70 and I will be returning it.

 

Have a pleasant day.

 

Once I have the coin in hand, I will post pictures....if any of you read the "First submission..body bagged! Fake coin!" thread, you know that I won't be ripped off.

 

smile.gif

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James_OldeTowne

James_OldeTowne

Posted
Posted

((( We have 0 % ownership in SGS Star Grading Service. )))

 

Ah yes, the old "0% ownership" cop-out. Of course, a brother, or uncle, or daughter, or best friend living in the next town over could, just by coincidence, be the owner.....

 

James

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WaxonWaxov

WaxonWaxov

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((( We have 0 % ownership in SGS Star Grading Service. )))

 

Ah yes, the old "0% ownership" cop-out. Of course, a brother, or uncle, or daughter, or best friend living in the next town over could, just by coincidence, be the owner.....

 

James

 

Exactly!

 

allWhoIs.com lists the owner of abon.com as "Eric Sparks"

 

They list the owner of stargrading.org (SGS) as "David Sparks"

 

Both of whom list their addresses as being within ten miles of each other.

 

Coincidence? I think not.

 

As for "Larry L. Bence, CEO" I'm guessing he's a brother-in-law or something.

 

It's funny... a month ago or so I received my first negative feedback after three years on Ebay (retaliatory of course) now that I have that one, I'm not so much giving a poop if Mr. Abon tries to give me retaliatory.

 

The bottom line is if this coin, that he advertises as "Proof 70 Cameo," grades lower than NGC PF70, he's getting negative. I don't care if he does retaliate negative me.

 

devil.gif

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Allan Ong

Allan Ong

Posted
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It now takes 11 months to get a coin certified if you are not a Master Dealer.

 

Thank you for asking.

 

Larry L. Bence

CEO

 

11 months?!?!?! Even PCGS takes a lot less time than that!! 893whatthe.giftongue.gif

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WaxonWaxov

WaxonWaxov

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Oh yea, I hear ya...

 

I just got 8 Moderns turned aroudn through NGC in two weeks.

 

This guy is definetly wacked.

 

I'll tell you another thing, if that coin doesn't grade at NGC70, I'm going for a 'significantly not as described' refund though PayPal.

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WaxonWaxov

WaxonWaxov

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Ha Ha Ha!

 

I just sent an 'ask seller question' that said "I have bid on, won, and paid for this item... please leave me positive feedback."

 

And get this... they did! Now I'm free to slam them without getting retaliatory negative! yay.gif

 

In their latest response a new person named Deb wrote....

 

I have given you prositive feedback, now you please do the same. Thanks Deb

 

Hmmm.. I wonder who Deb is... here is the response I just sent.

 

Thanks for the feedback, Deb. I appreciate it.

 

Once I receive the coin, I will inspect it, determine if it has a chance at NGC-70, then leave feedback.

 

I'm curious...

 

Before a person named Larry answered.

AllWhoIS.com tells me the owner of abon.com as Eric Sparks.

It also lists the owner of StarGrading.org as David Sparks.

 

So my guess is your're Eric and David's sister and Larry is your husband. Am I close?

 

have a nice day.

 

devil.gif

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Bruceswar

Bruceswar

Posted
Posted

WW,

All I can say to this situation is you set yourself up for failure. You are the buyer of the coin and honestly if you can't grade via the images provided and there is not a return policy, then stay away. I don't agree with using thier feedback against them either. Sure we all know SGS overgrades coins, but the closing prices on the coins reflect that. NEVER have I seen an SGS graded coin bring the money an NGC or PCGS coin brings. That should tell you something right there. Buy the coins for what they are and not the plastic. Just my opinion. This is not a slam on you.

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Bruceswar

Bruceswar

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oh yea, I hear ya.

 

The coin doesn't look that bad. I treated the purchase as buying raw.

 

It's all good.

 

If you treated the purchase as raw then your telling me its PF 70 in your eyes? At either rate its a good thing that you did not purchase this coin as anything else but raw.

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